Carlos Bernardes Withdrawn for Nadal Matches

[Federberg]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/tennis/rafaelnadal/11631798/French-Open-2015-Rafael-Nadal-admits-demanding-ban-on-umpire-Carlos-Bernardes-following-Rio-Open-dispute.html

 

[brokenshoelace]

Corruption by governing bodies of sports is not uncommon. Just today, the FBI is closing in on
corruption charges against FIFA Officials. Read more about this on CNN.

I understand that Tennis Froniter wants to be on good books of ATP/ITF. But, that does
not mean we should blindly accept whatever they do without looking into whether it is
reasonable or at least talking about it to raise awareness.

What does it mean when they say, they won't comment on how they select umpires for tennis matches? How would it look like if they say, they won't tell you how the draw is made and
you just have to trust them? Honest, Open, Transparent and Unbiased (not just towards
specific players, but also to the image of the sport itself) administration is needed
at both the ATP and ITF.

How is FIFA being corrupt and taking bribes in any way similar to the ATP/ITF keeping an Umpire away from a player at the player's request?

What is happening with terrible analogies for the past week or so?

 

[Carol]

Oops, I though this thread was closed, what is going on?

Ok, so let's go to say that the "fav ump" for someones always has made many mistakes, nothing new

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2010/jun/02/novak-djokovic-umpire-melzer-french-open

 

[Carol]

And in spite of the title of this article, when you read it you can see who really decided to take some action about Bernades

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/05/26/sports/tennis/ap-ten-french-open-nadal-chair-umpire.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=0

 

[britbox]

^ Uh? Your links confirm the original title of the thread.

Will umpires make wrong calls? Yes.

Will players try and push the boundaries? Yes.

That's life. I don't care about either - it's human.

But, I don't agree with players trying to dictate who officiate their matches. If the umpire isn't good enough then he doesn't umpire period. It's weak of the ATP to allow an umpire to be considered good enough to umpire Player A and not Player B.

 

[Riotbeard]

^ Uh? Your links confirm the original title of the thread.

Will umpires make wrong calls? Yes.

Will players try and push the boundaries? Yes.

That's life. I don't care about either - it's human.

But, I don't agree with players trying to dictate who officiate their matches. If the umpire isn't good enough then he doesn't umpire period. It's weak of the ATP to allow an umpire to be considered good enough to umpire Player A and not Player B.

This is really the crux of the thread. I don't love Nadal's time wasting, but it's nothing new and plenty of players have ticks, etc. More important is a what the request to not be officiated says about Nadal, and the fact that ATP respected the request.

 

[britbox]

And contrary to the view that umpires need to play completely by the rulebook... That in itself is pretty ridiculous. It's more about playing the match in the spirit of the rules.

Nadal has at times "averaged" longer than time limit over the course of a set or match. If the ump played strictly by the rules, he'd have probably defaulted some matches (as would have others). No ump with any grain of sense is going to enforce it to the letter, or if a player is involved in a 30 shot rally on the prior point.

Nadal will have been given notification to speed things up by the ump prior to the first warning. If he chooses to ignore it then that's his problem.

 

[Carol]

^ Uh? Your links confirm the original title of the thread.

Will umpires make wrong calls? Yes.

Will players try and push the boundaries? Yes.

That's life. I don't care about either - it's human.

But, I don't agree with players trying to dictate who officiate their matches. If the umpire isn't good enough then he doesn't umpire period. It's weak of the ATP to allow an umpire to be considered good enough to umpire Player A and not Player B.

My links confirm that it wasn't a request by Nadal though he has to be very happy with the French Tennis Federation decision bc Bernades mistakes seems to be very common. He is not losing his job, he just withdrawn for Nadal's matches, good for both!

 

[Carol]

And contrary to the view that umpires need to play completely by the rulebook... That in itself is pretty ridiculous. It's more about playing the match in the spirit of the rules.

Nadal has at times "averaged" longer than time limit over the course of a set or match. If the ump played strictly by the rules, he'd have probably defaulted some matches (as would have others). No ump with any grain of sense is going to enforce it to the letter, or if a player is involved in a 30 shot rally on the prior point.

Nadal will have been given notification to speed things up by the ump prior to the first warning. If he chooses to ignore it then that's his problem.

You should know by now that he problem between both wasn't "the time" but the lack of respect of that umpire and very bad decisions with the calls, and wait......

 

[Federberg]

^ Uh? Your links confirm the original title of the thread.

Will umpires make wrong calls? Yes.

Will players try and push the boundaries? Yes.

That's life. I don't care about either - it's human.

But, I don't agree with players trying to dictate who officiate their matches. If the umpire isn't good enough then he doesn't umpire period. It's weak of the ATP to allow an umpire to be considered good enough to umpire Player A and not Player B.

My links confirm that it wasn't a request by Nadal though he has to be very happy with the French Tennis Federation decision bc Bernades mistakes seems to be very common. He is not losing his job, he just withdrawn for Nadal's matches, good for both!

Don't think so... and from the bulls mouth no less

From the telegraph..

Nadal was almost nonchalant in his acknowledgment that he had sought to influence the officiating process. “Yes, it was my request,” he said. “I consider him [Bernardes] a great umpire and a good person, but I think when you have some troubles with the same umpire, sometimes it’s easy to stay for a while away, no?”

 

[britbox]

^ Uh? Your links confirm the original title of the thread.

Will umpires make wrong calls? Yes.

Will players try and push the boundaries? Yes.

That's life. I don't care about either - it's human.

But, I don't agree with players trying to dictate who officiate their matches. If the umpire isn't good enough then he doesn't umpire period. It's weak of the ATP to allow an umpire to be considered good enough to umpire Player A and not Player B.

My links confirm that it wasn't a request by Nadal though he has to be very happy with the French Tennis Federation decision bc Bernades mistakes seems to be very common. He is not losing his job, he just withdrawn for Nadal's matches, good for both!

Perhaps you'd like to explain the links (that you put up) then.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2010/jun/02/novak-djokovic-umpire-melzer-french-open

Link 1: Novak Djokovic blasts Bernandes for a line call. (but states that he doesn't blame him for losing the match)

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/05/26/sports/tennis/ap-ten-french-open-nadal-chair-umpire.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=0

Link 2: Rafael Nadal asks for Bernardes not to officiate his matches.

Videos have already been linked to where Nadal has stated that he's going to request Bernardes not to umpire his matches.

But despite putting up Link 2, coupled with Video evidence, you're still denying Nadal asked for it?

Explain...

 

[Kirijax]

Just like Sharapova is not changing her Banshee ways, Nadal is not changing his time-wasting ways. And they are two of the biggest stars of the sport that puts money in the pockets of all who are involved in professional tennis. For that they deserve some leeway. It shouldn't be that way, but that's the way it is. But I heard that the WTA has decided to find some gonads and enforce some rules on grunting for the players coming up. Maybe they can learn something from all this screaming and carrying on and teach the younger players the proper way to play dignified tennis.
Same for the Nadal situation. The ATP needs to learn something from this and teach the younger players that time-wasting only hurts the sport and chases away fans. Nadal could try and do better but it's obvious he doesn't care. It's too late to change his ways and the ATP is obviously not going to do much about it. But as soon as some young player starts coming up the ranks and makes every player wait for him at every court change, starts doing the full-body-towel-down, butt-scratch, finger-sniff routine, they need to find the gonads to nip that in the bud. Same goes for all the ball bouncing too. I'm nuts about tennis and even I can't stand all the stuff that goes on between points. Just think what the casual fan thinks when he turns on the tube. Not many would keep watching. The ATP and WTA need to take charge and think first about the fans watching, then cater to their oh-so-precious stars.

 

[Carol]

^ Uh? Your links confirm the original title of the thread.

Will umpires make wrong calls? Yes.

Will players try and push the boundaries? Yes.

That's life. I don't care about either - it's human.

But, I don't agree with players trying to dictate who officiate their matches. If the umpire isn't good enough then he doesn't umpire period. It's weak of the ATP to allow an umpire to be considered good enough to umpire Player A and not Player B.

My links confirm that it wasn't a request by Nadal though he has to be very happy with the French
Tennis Federation decision bc Bernades mistakes seems to be very common. He is not losing his job, he just withdrawn for Nadal's matches, good for both!

Perhaps you'd like to explain the links (that you put up) then.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2010/jun/02/novak-djokovic-umpire-melzer-french-open

Link 1: Novak Djokovic blasts Bernandes for a line call. (but states that he doesn't blame him for losing

the match)

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/05/26/sports/tennis/ap-ten-french-open-nadal-chair-umpire.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=0

Link 2: Rafael Nadal asks for Bernardes not to officiate his matches.

Videos have already been linked to where Nadal has stated that he's going to request Bernardes not to

umpire his matches.

But despite putting up Link 2, coupled with Video evidence, you're still denying Nadal asked for it?

Explain...

I would love if he asked for it. And by the way he NEVER has said that he has lost a match because Bernades.

 

[britbox]

^ Disagree with this for a couple of reasons (responding to Kirjax)... Players in ANY sport will push the envelope to gain an advantage. I don't hit on them for doing it... It's reality.

If a player thinks slow play will upset the rhythm of an opponent, then so be it. If a player screams and it's given a pass then they'll keep doing it.

If the governing body start clamping down on it then they change behaviour. Look at Soccer and Rugby... Soccer Players give the referees a mouthful of abuse and are largely unpunished. Do the same in Rugby Union then the ball gets moved forward 15 yards as a punishment. That's why backchat against referees in Rugby Union is minimal... because it hurts the cause.

I don't have a big issue with Nadal pushing the envelope - like all players he's trying to push the envelope. I've got more of an issue with the ATP caving in and a bunch of his fans trying to perpetuate the silly notion that Rafa is some church going choirboy who pets puppies in his spare time.

a) We know he' s non-believer b) He hates dogs and c) He's a sportsman who pushes the envelope.

No big deal.

 

[britbox]

My links confirm that it wasn't a request by Nadal though he has to be very happy with the French
Tennis Federation decision bc Bernades mistakes seems to be very common. He is not losing his job, he just withdrawn for Nadal's matches, good for both!

Perhaps you'd like to explain the links (that you put up) then.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2010/jun/02/novak-djokovic-umpire-melzer-french-open

Link 1: Novak Djokovic blasts Bernandes for a line call. (but states that he doesn't blame him for losing

the match)

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/05/26/sports/tennis/ap-ten-french-open-nadal-chair-umpire.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=0

Link 2: Rafael Nadal asks for Bernardes not to officiate his matches.

Videos have already been linked to where Nadal has stated that he's going to request Bernardes not to

umpire his matches.

But despite putting up Link 2, coupled with Video evidence, you're still denying Nadal asked for it?

Explain...

I would love if he asked for it. And by the way he NEVER has said that he has lost a match because Bernades.

Who has?

 

[Federberg]

^ Uh? Your links confirm the original title of the thread.

Will umpires make wrong calls? Yes.

Will players try and push the boundaries? Yes.

That's life. I don't care about either - it's human.

But, I don't agree with players trying to dictate who officiate their matches. If the umpire isn't good enough then he doesn't umpire period. It's weak of the ATP to allow an umpire to be considered good enough to umpire Player A and not Player B.

My links confirm that it wasn't a request by Nadal though he has to be very happy with the French Tennis Federation decision bc Bernades mistakes seems to be very common. He is not losing his job, he just withdrawn for Nadal's matches, good for both!

Perhaps you'd like to explain the links (that you put up) then.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2010/jun/02/novak-djokovic-umpire-melzer-french-open

Link 1: Novak Djokovic blasts Bernandes for a line call. (but states that he doesn't blame him for losing the match)

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/05/26/sports/tennis/ap-ten-french-open-nadal-chair-umpire.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=0

Link 2: Rafael Nadal asks for Bernardes not to officiate his matches.

Videos have already been linked to where Nadal has stated that he's going to request Bernardes not to umpire his matches.

But despite putting up Link 2, coupled with Video evidence, you're still denying Nadal asked for it?

Explain...

Simple explanation.. delusion and denial :laydownlaughing

 

[Kirijax]

^ Disagree with this for a couple of reasons (responding to Kirjax)... Players in ANY sport will push the envelope to gain an advantage. I don't hit on them for doing it... It's reality.

If a player thinks slow play will upset the rhythm of an opponent, then so be it. If a player screams and it's given a pass then they'll keep doing it.

If the governing body start clamping down on it then they change behaviour. Look at Soccer and Rugby... Soccer Players give the referees a mouthful of abuse and are largely unpunished. Do the same in Rugby Union then the ball gets moved forward 15 yards as a punishment. That's why backchat against referees in Rugby Union is minimal... because it hurts the cause.

I don't have a big issue with Nadal pushing the envelope - like all players he's trying to push the envelope. I've got more of an issue with the ATP caving in and a bunch of his fans trying to perpetuate the silly notion that Rafa is some church going choirboy who pets puppies in his spare time.

a) We know he' s non-believer b) He hates dogs and c) He's a sportsman who pushes the envelope.

No big deal.

I'll agree you have to allow it to an extent. The players are to look for any advantage they can get. And Nadal is the GOAT (Gamesmanshipper of All Time) in that respect. But the bigwigs in charge have to think of the fans who have to listen and watch the nonsense going on. I think it's time to call in the High Sparrow. (Sorry. Couldn't resist a　GOT reference.)

 

[Federberg]

^ Disagree with this for a couple of reasons (responding to Kirjax)... Players in ANY sport will push the envelope to gain an advantage. I don't hit on them for doing it... It's reality.

If a player thinks slow play will upset the rhythm of an opponent, then so be it. If a player screams and it's given a pass then they'll keep doing it.

If the governing body start clamping down on it then they change behaviour. Look at Soccer and Rugby... Soccer Players give the referees a mouthful of abuse and are largely unpunished. Do the same in Rugby Union then the ball gets moved forward 15 yards as a punishment. That's why backchat against referees in Rugby Union is minimal... because it hurts the cause.

I don't have a big issue with Nadal pushing the envelope - like all players he's trying to push the envelope. I've got more of an issue with the ATP caving in and a bunch of his fans trying to perpetuate the silly notion that Rafa is some church going choirboy who pets puppies in his spare time.

a) We know he' s non-believer b) He hates dogs and c) He's a sportsman who pushes the envelope.

No big deal.

This! Just have the moral courage to admit he's not a saint. It's like some of these people believe because he's an awesome player than means he's an angel. It is utterly bizarre and says more about them really :nono

 

[britbox]

^ Disagree with this for a couple of reasons (responding to Kirjax)... Players in ANY sport will push the envelope to gain an advantage. I don't hit on them for doing it... It's reality.

If a player thinks slow play will upset the rhythm of an opponent, then so be it. If a player screams and it's given a pass then they'll keep doing it.

If the governing body start clamping down on it then they change behaviour. Look at Soccer and Rugby... Soccer Players give the referees a mouthful of abuse and are largely unpunished. Do the same in Rugby Union then the ball gets moved forward 15 yards as a punishment. That's why backchat against referees in Rugby Union is minimal... because it hurts the cause.

I don't have a big issue with Nadal pushing the envelope - like all players he's trying to push the envelope. I've got more of an issue with the ATP caving in and a bunch of his fans trying to perpetuate the silly notion that Rafa is some church going choirboy who pets puppies in his spare time.

a) We know he' s non-believer b) He hates dogs and c) He's a sportsman who pushes the envelope.

No big deal.

I'll agree you have to allow it to an extent. The players are to look for any advantage they can get. And Nadal is the GOAT (Gamesmanshipper of All Time) in that respect. But the bigwigs in charge have to think of the fans who have to listen and watch the nonsense going on. I think it's time to call in the High Sparrow. (Sorry. Couldn't resist a　GOT reference.)

Don't get me wrong buddy... I can live with Nadal trying it on and asking not to be officiated by a particular umpire... But shame on the ATP for folding and going along with it.

 

[Federberg]

starts doing the full-body-towel-down, butt-scratch, finger-sniff routine

I never noticed the finger sniffing :laydownlaughing I wouldn't want to shake his hand after a match then!