UK Politics Thread

[Vince Evert]

 

[Federberg]

I think they needed a bigger revolt to unseat May. Maybe Braverman and Gove. If the EU are stupid enough to bounce out a soft Brexit then they may end up with a hard one... you might see Davis and Boris return to the fold in that scenario as the clock ticks down.

you keep making the cardinal error of viewing the EU's stance from a UK-centric perspective. The EU is focused on its own survival, and that means making Brexit as painful and unpleasant as possible for the UK.

 

[Horsa]

you keep making the cardinal error of viewing the EU's stance from a UK-centric perspective. The EU is focused on its own survival, and that means making Brexit as painful and unpleasant as possible for the UK.

Everyone is wanting what's best for themselves but how things are going I don't think we're going to be getting the Brexit that the majority voted for. In fact, how things are going, I wish I hadn't voted at all because I don't think that the public are being listened to & getting what they wanted. I think the vote was a waste of time & everything is going to go on as usual with those in power doing what they want anyway.

 

[britbox]

you keep making the cardinal error of viewing the EU's stance from a UK-centric perspective. The EU is focused on its own survival, and that means making Brexit as painful and unpleasant as possible for the UK.

Hardly. I've said from the get-go that it's in the EU's interests to make it as painful as possible. I said nothing would get done until right at the death when German exporters would put pressure on to get something done. A "no-deal" by the end date ain't good for the EU.

 

[britbox]

See Juncker's staggering around drunk as per usual.

 

[Federberg]

Hardly. I've said from the get-go that it's in the EU's interests to make it as painful as possible. I said nothing would get done until right at the death when German exporters would put pressure on to get something done. A "no-deal" by the end date ain't good for the EU.

German exporters aren't going to hold sway in this. This is geopolitics not economics. Look, as I've said multiple times, the odds of the EU ceasing to exist have gone up exponentially since Brexit. And if you look at the postings I made at the time, I mentioned that Italian politics was the next thing of high concern. The worst has happened there. You seriously under-estimate the existential considerations the EU has to factor in. As you also over-estimate the adverse impact on German exporters. The UK has few viable alternatives in a swathe of sectors to German exporters. Politics will be decisive. I'll say one thing for Brexit, if the idiots in the EU have not figured out that they need to come up with a credible solution to immigration by now then they deserve the dissolution that seems inevitable

 

[britbox]

German exporters aren't going to hold sway in this. This is geopolitics not economics. Look, as I've said multiple times, the odds of the EU ceasing to exist have gone up exponentially since Brexit. And if you look at the postings I made at the time, I mentioned that Italian politics was the next thing of high concern. The worst has happened there. You seriously under-estimate the existential considerations the EU has to factor in. As you also over-estimate the adverse impact on German exporters. The UK has few viable alternatives in a swathe of sectors to German exporters. Politics will be decisive. I'll say one thing for Brexit, if the idiots in the EU have not figured out that they need to come up with a credible solution to immigration by now then they deserve the dissolution that seems inevitable

You underestimate how potentially weak some of the positions of leading figures within the EU nation states are right now.

 

[Federberg]

You underestimate how potentially weak some of the positions of leading figures within the EU nation states are right now.

I don't think I do. In fact I think you're the one mis-diagnosing. Growth in the EU is actually alright at the moment. Even Greece is starting to look ok. The problem is the politics. The EU simply cannot afford to take a stance that is soft on the UK. It is existential for them. There's a fair chance that it's too late for the EU anyway, but backing off on Brexit would be institutional suicide. So your constant refrain that the UK is somehow in a strong position or has an economic advantage because of their trade deficit (been proved wrong repeatedly by the way) completely misses the point.

As for the weakness? The weakness that is relevant is the paradigm of nationalism/immigration sweeping through the EU at the moment. That has to be the primary focus of the EU countries. One would have to be blind to miss it, so the idea that German exporters are going to have a place on the table when centre left is practically extinct and the centre right lives in fear of the far right is quite funny

 

[Federberg]

 

[britbox]

Nothing new from Major. Together with Ken Clarke he represents the rabid EU loving wing of the Conservative party.

 

[Federberg]

Nothing new from Major. Together with Ken Clarke he represents the rabid EU loving wing of the Conservative party.

The irony of you characterising John Major and Ken Clarke as "rabid" is probably lost on the non-British folk on this forum

For our fellow global travellers, it's sort of like a Tea Party supporter describing Dubya and Hank Paulson as rabid globalists

 

[britbox]

If you don't think either are arch-EU bedfellows then you haven't been watching closely.

 

[Federberg]

Of course they support Remain. But the adjective "rabid" is more suitable for ideologues who don't care much for their constituents

 

[britbox]

Of course they support Remain. But the adjective "rabid" is more suitable for ideologues who don't care much for their constituents

Major was the guy who was going to deselect Conservatives opposed to Maastricht... and instructed his cabinet to go into "full-gloat" mode against the dissenters when the treaty was signed. He's got a long history.

 

[Federberg]

I swear to god, you're an absolute ninja when it comes to slightly twisting history. I mean that as a compliment

 

[britbox]

Interesting interview with Tommy Robinson (aka Stephen Yaxley)

 

[britbox]

This guy is hilarious.

 

[britbox]

I'd be surprised if May survives this latest Brexit calamity. I can't see her carrying through this package.

 

[Horsa]

I'd be surprised if May survives this latest Brexit calamity. I can't see her carrying through this package.

I'm disgusted about the agreement. We voted out because we didn't want the E.U. telling us what we could & couldn't do & have to pay them extortionate amounts for the privilege. With this agreement we'll still be paying the E.U. extortionate amounts & have to abide by their rules. We thought that out meant out altogether. I think it was a waste of time us voting & that our wishes have been ignored. If I'd have known that people's wishes were going to be disregarded I wouldn't have voted. I thought we were supposed to live in a democratic country. It really looks like it. The government had no intention at all of getting us out of the E.U. & thought of the best idea they could think of so that we'd leave the E.U. without severing any ties.

I agree with your 1st sentence but felt the need to vent.

 

[Federberg]