No. My point is that if trans was a thing, and not some aspect of modern hysteria then any kids on the spectrum would have shown evidence of extreme social discomfort. But instead, they adapted got comfortable in their own skins and have gone on to become who they were going to be. Transport them into these fkd up times, they would have been pushed to question their identity and misdiagnosed as being of another gender. We don't have all the answers in current times as much as we might try to pretend, we do. But I'm 100% certain that putting these kids to the blade will be seen to be as barbaric as the use of leeches as a cure all in medieval times.
You seem to not hear that the 2 kids I'm telling you about experienced extreme social discomfort. That was clear. Again, I have no idea who they are now, nor how the identified as then, but I don't see why you insist that this is a new phenomenon. As I have said, I'm not blind to the fact that there is a faddishness about it, especially in terms of kids identifying as "non-binary." But, again, I don't know what you insist on saying that kids are being put to the blade. Is it that common in the UK? It's not really legal here in the US, before 18. I certainly would agree that it's not ethical, and I think a lot of medical professionals do, too.
As an aside, my dorm mate in boarding school was an Olympic medallist, and former world record holder. A swimmer. Turns out he was gay. He wrote an article in a major newspaper some years ago discussing his voyage of self-discovery. When I read it, it blew my mind in one way, but didn't shock me in another. It didn't shock me because he always used to get letters from his 'girlfriend' from home. She just happened to have exactly the same handwriting as his!
But it blew my mind because he participated in all of our conversations about which girl was the hottest in school. I remember I had a massive crush on one of the swimmers and I used to question him about her all the time. I would never have guessed at the time that he was gay, is the point I'm making. It crushes my soul to think of the turmoil he must have been going through at the time. Let me tell you... that school was brutal. The levels of cruelty some people experienced at that time was no joke. One of the most shameful things I've ever done in my life was giving a kid a choice of either getting beaten up by me or eating the mud from my rugby boot. He chose the mud, and promptly got beaten up by someone else, because he was more afraid of me than him! To this day, if someone tried to have me 'dealt' with, I think it would be him. The humiliation he must have felt. But that was boarding school at that time, I don't know whether it's any better now.
That is a pretty gross story, but i appreciate the sharing. Do you think boarding school was more "Lord of the Flies" than day school? Or maybe it's just that boys can be so physically rough on each other, either way. I'm sure the guys I went to school with have stories I don't know. Don't get me wrong: girls can be very psychologically tough on each other. (There is a reason there was a whole show called "Mean Girls.") But we go in less for the physical humiliation. But I do think of your dorm mate, and the fact that you had no idea he was gay. Small wonder he kept in on the DL, to the point of inventing a GF, if that was the kind of abuse that went on. Plus, I'm sure he could hide behind his big, broad-shouldered, top-athlete machismo. As you say, too bad he felt he had to. Here's a question to your 17-year-old self: if you'd known that boy was gay when he lived on in your dorm, would you have been ok with it, or would you have rejected him? I thought at first you meant "roommate," but probably not. Would he have been treated badly, if it were known or suspected? Were there other kids that were suspected to be gay and ostracized for it? Or did they all just keep it to themselves, for that reason?
Still, we are distinguishing between gay and trans, right?
All that tells me is that more work needs to be done to deal with the mental condition of gender dysphoria. But feel free to supply the data. What I do know is that there is solid peer-reviewed research out there that shows that gender dysphoria in the young is typically a transient thing and tends to be suffered by homosexual kids. They need all of our support. And not the barbaric promotion of trans gender surgeries as an option.
Again with the "barbaric promotion of transgender surgeries." As I mentioned above, I have also read that there is a certain amount of "growing out" of the idea of being "trans," for some kids. Even a majority. I have no problem that that is true, and it makes sense to me. Where you and Kieran and I differ, I think, is that I see that a lot of kids DO get to work through it and past it without serious intervention. Where you guys see activist intervention, outside forces imposing, or something, I see adults trying to help kids along as they wonder/wander about some things. In any case, I do think there's a difference between what parents and schools do to support one kid, compared to what you feel is a wider effort to normalize or promote transgenderism. I know you feel that that is a danger to society, (at least Kieran does,) but if we can at least recognize that they are two different parts of the issue. Meaning how individual kids are treated, and how the issue is approached, at-large.
That last paragraph of yours was going so well until this last bit. This is where you lose us
@Moxie. This shaming,
'I'm better than you' progressive language. If I can concede that saying 'Boom!' is unnecessarily contentious, then I would like to task you with checking yourself. Please stop. As much as you might think you have the moral high ground, that's just your perspective, and it's not the way to have the respectful dialogue you claim you want
Yes, fair. It was my closing salvo. I considered not writing it, but I figured you were all so done with me on the topic. But then you wrote me the most earnest response I've had from you in ages, so I responded.
It has seemed for a long time that you all would just prefer if I leave you alone to be outraged amongst yourselves about the trans stuff, without my tiresome debate from the other side. (THAT is not "shaming." You ARE all outraged. That is a fair to say, I think.) I figured I've said my bit, and have watched enough videos. You've heard enough of where I'm coming from, and I mostly just get sneered at for it. I'm tired of hearing that I'm a zombie acolyte of the left, or a person who just drinks kool-aid. Now, I'll leave you all to it.
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