Rogers Cup, Montreal, Canada, ATP Masters

[Fiero425]

Only 2 seeds, not 3

I wasn't wrong at the time genius! We lost RBA today! Thanks so much for making me out to be a liar! :whistle: :cuckoo:

 

[El Dude]

I am rather waiting out to see how things are unfolding than to get into all complicated analysis. I know they are fun for you and others who like to play with them.
Many unknown parameters can happen , all kind of setbacks, and some just plainly will disappoint. Two years ago for example there were 4 teenagers breaking through into the mid top 100: Coric, Chung, Kokkinakis and Zverev.
Only Zverev proved in the end to become the big player everyone was hoping for, the other 3 did not, for one reason or another.
That is only a 25% conversion and that is really disappointing.

It is a lower than average "conversion rate." As you probably remember, I've done studies on teenagers reaching the top 100. I can't remember the exact percentage, but it is more than 25% that become at least good (top 20) players. I still think the other three will at least dip into the top 40 and be seeded at Slams, but you never know. Only Zverev looks like a true elite player.

I still believe Rublev will be very good - not Zverev good, but I think he'll challenge for big titles and reach the top 10. Similarly with Tiafoe. I'm losing faith in Fritz, but he's young enough that he can still jump up. Khachanov and Medvedev seem like top 20 types but not true top 10s. I don't know what to think of Ruud yet. Donaldson is finally doing better, but still looks more like a future top 20-30 type than top 10. Kozlov and Opelka have been disappointing this year. Etc.

 

[El Dude]

I of course want Roger to win, but how awesome would it be if somehow Robin Haase won a Masters title? He'd probably be the worst player to win a Masters since...Ivan Ljubicic? And Ljubicic was a more successful player. Anderson-Haase would be a nice, if un-sexy, final. The tennis gods want Zverev-Federer.

 

[herios]

It is a lower than average "conversion rate." As you probably remember, I've done studies on teenagers reaching the top 100. I can't remember the exact percentage, but it is more than 25% that become at least good (top 20) players. I still think the other three will at least dip into the top 40 and be seeded at Slams, but you never know. Only Zverev looks like a true elite player.

I still believe Rublev will be very good - not Zverev good, but I think he'll challenge for big titles and reach the top 10. Similarly with Tiafoe. I'm losing faith in Fritz, but he's young enough that he can still jump up. Khachanov and Medvedev seem like top 20 types but not true top 10s. I don't know what to think of Ruud yet. Donaldson is finally doing better, but still looks more like a future top 20-30 type than top 10. Kozlov and Opelka have been now, all these are disappointing this year. Etc.

A lot of "to be seen here", some will happen, some will not.

 

[herios]

I of course want Roger to win, but how awesome would it be if somehow Robin Haase won a Masters title? He'd probably be the worst player to win a Masters since...Ivan Ljubicic? And Ljubicic was a more successful player. Anderson-Haase would be a nice, if un-sexy, final. The tennis gods want Zverev-Federer.

Ljubicic would die if he would hear someone compares with him Haase. LOL

 

[herios]

Denis has to learn quickly how to play the tricky French, because he will be gone in no time.

 

[Fiero425]

I of course want Roger to win, but how awesome would it be if somehow Robin Haase won a Masters title? He'd probably be the worst player to win a Masters since...Ivan Ljubicic? And Ljubicic was a more successful player. Anderson-Haase would be a nice, if un-sexy, final. The tennis gods want Zverev-Federer.

I loved that IW's match in 2010; Ivan taking out our own Andy Roddick! One of the worst 1 hit wonders of all time; a USO title and ranked #1 for about 5 min.! A-ROD got the most out of that lame MOJO lost in 2003!

 

[herios]

Denis lack of experience is glaring. He needs to adjust to windy conditions, and his strokes are not really suitable because of his swings.

 

[mrzz]

Kokkinakis had a few god wins lately, but I am not sure he will be constantly good or fit.

Yes, that´s a fair statement. Anyway, the truth is there is not exactly much depth in the NextGen, so one or two more good runs in 250/500´s and he is already there. He played probably less than one third of the matches of the other guys and is still

worst player to win a Masters since...Ivan Ljubicic?

You´re being a bit harsh. The guy got to #3 in the world (before he won that masters...)... not mentioning his coaching skills (which would be a fine topic in a proper thread).

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

Match point for the kid...So impressive. He had every reason to fold tonight.
And he does it !

 

[Busted]

Watched the Mannarino\Shapovalov match and now I'm shaking my head. It's easy to see why so many "veterans" languish in the 30-70 range and can't beat the top 20 let alone the Big 4. They literally have no kill shot, not Plan B and no balls. Guess nobody ever told them no guts, no glory.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Match point for the kid...So impressive. He had every reason to fold tonight.
And he does it !

Yep, the kid does it again. He is now just one win away from facing TMF. Even if he does not win any more, his ranking is expected to be cut down by half from about 150 to about 75.

Also, by virtue of reaching SF, he is eligible for a special exemption slot in Cincy. However, he will not really get the SE slot as
he has already entered in a challenger in Vancouver next week. That entry apparently prohibits him from receiving the SE slot.

 

[Busted]

Denis lack of experience is glaring. He needs to adjust to windy conditions, and his strokes are not really suitable because of his swings.

He still won, didn't he? The kid'll learn the nuances as he goes along...

 

[Busted]

Saw the last half of both sets. Roger was hitting pretty well but serving like crap. Must have been quite a bit better overall than his performance yesterday because Ferrer is basically a worse/older version of RBA at this point.

I was LMAO at Patrick McEnroe and Chris Fowler. PM said Fed was getting a routine win with "his B game" and CF came back with, "As opposed to winning yesterday with his C+ game." Obviously if he makes the final - whichever of the two tweens that makes the final is going to be hungry to take down Federer and try to establish a new world order in men's tennis, so Roger's probably going to need at least his B+ or A- game on Sunday.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

With all the excitement over the new kid in the block, folks forgot that for Cincy is already out .

Here are the projected QFs if the seeds live up to their billing.

Rafa vs. Tsonga
Thiem vs. Kei
Raonic vs. Zverev
Grigor vs. Fed

There is also the likelihood of Rafa facing Muller in R16. :bat:

 

[Fiero425]

With all the excitement over the new kid in the block, folks forgot that for Cincy is already out .

Here are the projected QFs if the seeds live up to their billing.

Rafa vs. Tsonga
Thiem vs. Kei
Raonic vs. Zverev
Grigor vs. Fed

There is also the likelihood of Rafa facing Muller in R16. :bat:

Well you can drop Tsonga & Grigor already! I'm never going to give them credit again to make it to their appt.'d Rds! They stink!

 

[kskate2]

Oh boy. @Fiero425 ain't nobody's fool...

 

[El Dude]

@herios, @mrzz, what part of "Ljubicic was a more successful player" (than Haase) did you folks miss? I probably could have stated that better - clearly "Lube" was better than Haase is, who is the quintessential "journeyman." I just mentioned Ljubicic because, going back in time, he's the only guy I could remember that wasn't regularly in the elite or near elite.

How it is VERY unlikely that Haase gets by not only Roger but Zverev to win the title, so it is a moot point. Still, its been a nice run for him - the first time he's made a semi of a big tournament.

@Fiero425, you are WAY too harsh on Roddick. He was far from the "worst one-hit wonders of all time." In fact, I think there's a good argument that he's among the very best single-Slam winners in the Open Era.

 

[Shivashish Sarkar]

Federer-Zverev please. Can't call matches interesting just because they are going to have low profile players.

@Fiero425

After winning USO in '03, he reached 3 Wimbledon finals and a US Open final. He lost 'em all to Roger. He played in the shadow of Roger and that was the reason he did not win another slam. And he lost many other grand slam matches to him other than finals.

 

[Shivashish Sarkar]

If Roger wins Montreal, he goes ahead of Rafa in the race rankings. Then Roger has to be the favourite to end no. 1 in the rankings. But, he will need to keep the aggression going. Less slices, more flat backhands, more net approaches.

Zverev seems to have become a regular contender in the ATP masters series.
Shapovalov seems to have gotten a kind of a breakthrough. One step ahead. I didn't know him well even seven days ago. Semis of a masters is a huge result. He should just begin playing on the main ATP tour right away. I don't think there is any reason not to do it. At least, he should start prioritising the ATP main tournaments.
Good for Haase, although I think it will end now. Time for Roger to deliver a masterclass. But is Haase defensive? I don't remember but I don't think.

P.S.: I am going by what one of you mentioned. Shapovalov is going to be around no. 75 after this tourney at the very least. A world no. 75 shouldn't have to play qualifiers in ATP 250s and ATP 500s. If he does score points there, in some time he won't need to play qualifiers in masters (I think he can get a main draw entry already at IW, Miami. But he will need to maintain his rankings till March, April next year)