Novak Djokovic's Vaccine Stance & Visa Troubles

El Dude

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Yeah, it is stupid. It was stupid then, and now looks even more stupid.

But even so, I don't know why that would be a "slap in the face" of the vaccinated.
 

Moxie

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Yeah, it is stupid. It was stupid then, and now looks even more stupid.

But even so, I don't know why that would be a "slap in the face" of the vaccinated.
Some 95+% of Australians over age 16 have had 2 doses of the vaccination, as they were told to do. Besides that, they endured heavy lockdowns and travel restrictions, including within Australia. Novak wanted to be exempted from the vaccine for no other reason than that he doesn't want to take it. You'll remember that, at the time, when he came in with what he thought was a valid exemption, public sentiment in Australia was strongly against what appeared to be, and almost certainly was, special treatment. He fought the deportation ruling, and it was he, via his lawyers, who sought the 3 justices, one decision, no appeals course of action, which they were granted. The decision came down against him, and it included a 3-year ban. Now he's (presumably) appealing that part of the decision, though there were meant to be no appeals. If it gets lifted, it could very well look like special treatment. He wasn't deported for being unvaccinated. That wasn't in dispute. He was deported for something like being a public nuisance, a threat to good order. As a foreign national, Australian Federal Immigration doesn't owe him a retraction of this. IMO, it would be a "slap" to the vaccinated for the very reason that they did what was right for the public good, when asked, and he hadn't, and hasn't. That doesn't change just because entry requirements do. To me, that's why the vaccinated in Australia might feel affronted, which, as you see above, is nearly the entire population.
 

TheSicilian

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I'd hope they would get over their stupidity! If these Koala Bear burger eating MF'rs try to sustain a 3 yr. ban on Djokr like this, they're done IMO! ;)
This is not about vaccination. It's about immigration its completely different and a lot more serious. Careful what you say about the Australians or they may send the Koala Bears after you :teddy-bear::popcorn
 
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TheSicilian

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Yeah, it is stupid. It was stupid then, and now looks even more stupid.

But even so, I don't know why that would be a "slap in the face" of the vaccinated.
It's immigration related the 3 year ban nothing to do with the vaccine. I thought the ban was down to the dishonest paperwork?
 
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Moxie

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It's immigration related the 3 year ban nothing to do with the vaccine. I thought the ban was down to the dishonest paperwork?
Actually, I don't even think the false statements on the paperwork ever came into it last January, but I have wondered if that would be a reason for denying the application for lifting the ban. In the US, that's a pretty serious infraction, subject to a much longer ban, and heavy fines.
 
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Moxie

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This is not about vaccination. It's about immigration its completely different and a lot more serious. Careful what you say about the Australians or they may send the Koala Bears after you :teddy-bear::popcorn
Kudos for use of the bear emoji!
 
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Moxie

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I'd hope they would get over their stupidity! If these Koala Bear burger eating MF'rs try to sustain a 3 yr. ban on Djokr like this, they're done IMO! ;)
"Done" in the sense of what? Being a country? Having a tennis Major?
 

Moxie

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All of the above! It was easy for me to avoid the whole tournament when Novak was upset or didn't play! Fedal final wasn't seen by me! :yawningface: :astonished-face:
I wonder how the tournament will recover from being boycotted by you. Or indeed the entire country of Australia, if you should white them out of your map of the world.
 

El Dude

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Some 95+% of Australians over age 16 have had 2 doses of the vaccination, as they were told to do. Besides that, they endured heavy lockdowns and travel restrictions, including within Australia. Novak wanted to be exempted from the vaccine for no other reason than that he doesn't want to take it. You'll remember that, at the time, when he came in with what he thought was a valid exemption, public sentiment in Australia was strongly against what appeared to be, and almost certainly was, special treatment. He fought the deportation ruling, and it was he, via his lawyers, who sought the 3 justices, one decision, no appeals course of action, which they were granted. The decision came down against him, and it included a 3-year ban. Now he's (presumably) appealing that part of the decision, though there were meant to be no appeals. If it gets lifted, it could very well look like special treatment. He wasn't deported for being unvaccinated. That wasn't in dispute. He was deported for something like being a public nuisance, a threat to good order. As a foreign national, Australian Federal Immigration doesn't owe him a retraction of this. IMO, it would be a "slap" to the vaccinated for the very reason that they did what was right for the public good, when asked, and he hadn't, and hasn't. That doesn't change just because entry requirements do. To me, that's why the vaccinated in Australia might feel affronted, which, as you see above, is nearly the entire population.
But if you're saying he wasn't deported for being vaxxed but for being a public nuisance, what does a hypothetical reduction in his deportation have to do with him being unvaxxed? You're just explaining my point.
 
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Moxie

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But if you're saying he wasn't deported for being vaxxed but for being a public nuisance, what does a hypothetical reduction in his deportation have to do with him being unvaxxed? You're just explaining my point.
I'm not saying it has anything to do with him being unvaccinated. I explained, I thought, why it would be an insult to the vaccinated, however. They followed the regulations. He, if he's let off a ban, would be getting special treatment. There's a connection to be made, but I'm sure you can do it.
 
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El Dude

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I'm not saying it has anything to do with him being unvaccinated. I explained, I thought, why it would be an insult to the vaccinated, however. They followed the regulations. He, if he's let off a ban, would be getting special treatment. There's a connection to be made, but I'm sure you can do it.
But why just the vaccinated? Why not everyone who has ever not been able to get out of something, or anyone who has ever felt forced to do something?

You can't have it both ways. "He wasn't deported because of vax status" and "Vaccinated Australians will feel slapped in the face if he is un-deported."

In a way it almost sounds like a way of telling vaxxed Australians that they should be upset, because, "Novax bad, Vax good."

As with a year ago, Novak is being made an example of. "Comply or be punished!"
 
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Moxie

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But why just the vaccinated? Why not everyone who has ever not been able to get out of something, or anyone who has ever felt forced to do something?

You can't have it both ways. "He wasn't deported because of vax status" and "Vaccinated Australians will feel slapped in the face if he is un-deported."

In a way it almost sounds like a way of telling vaxxed Australians that they should be upset, because, "Novax bad, Vax good."

As with a year ago, Novak is being made an example of. "Comply or be punished!"
You asked why as to the specific quote. I didn't say it. I would say, if you like, that Australians might be incensed if he got out of a judgement, but it happens that they are nearly all vaccinated, too.

Novak has already been punished. It's a question as to whether he should get let off. Maybe he will. The question being addressed, because of the quote by some ex-minister, is whether it's going to bother people in Australia. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. Maybe @MargaretMcAleer can give us a feel for public sentiment on the subject.
 

Kieran

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Novak wanted to be exempted from the vaccine for no other reason than that he doesn't want to take it.
Well, he didn’t want to take it for health reasons. He doesn’t need it, and that’s reason enough, especially given that plenty of people have subsequently had a worse effect from the vaccine than the virus. He wanted to choose, on that basis.

But I see that Tiley is keeping out of it this time. By the way, I think that based on Novaks performance last year, they’d be justified to uphold the ban:


Australian Open cannot lobby for Djokovic

 
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TheSicilian

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Well, he didn’t want to take it for health reasons. He doesn’t need it, and that’s reason enough, especially given that plenty of people have subsequently had a worse effect from the vaccine than the virus. He wanted to choose, on that basis.

But I see that Tiley is keeping out of it this time. By the way, I think that based on Novaks performance last year, they’d be justified to uphold the ban:


Australian Open cannot lobby for Djokovic

Personal choice is not a good reason for an exemption to enter Australia to play a tennis tournament. The exemption from the vaccine is put in place for people with legitimate health problems. Yet like everything people like Novax try to hijack it for personal gain. For me he should be more worried about lying on his papers to enter Australia. Immigration officers are not people you want to mess with. I'm sure I read if he wasn't a famous millionaire he could have been arrested even put in jail for the dishonest paper work...
 
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Kieran

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Personal choice is not a good reason for an exemption to enter Australia to play a tennis tournament. The exemption from the vaccine is put in place for people with legitimate health problems. Yet like everything people like Novax try to hijack it for personal gain. For me he should be more worried about lying on his papers to enter Australia. Immigration officers are not people you want to mess with. I'm sure I read if he wasn't a famous millionaire he could have been arrested even put in jail for the dishonest paper work...
Well, the awkward part for him in Australia was that he didn’t have a valid medical exemption, but pretended he did. And I believe he “pretended he did”, rather than believing that he was “misinformed or lied to” by TA or anyone else.

The reason I believe he pretended he did is because subsequent to his arrival in Australia, he chose to lie, bully and try to cheat his way in, and this is also why I think they have sound reasons for not overturning the ban.

But his decision not to get vaccinated? That’s okay with me. That’s based on science too. He has a sensible reason for not taking the vaccine , and if I have a problem about his escapades in Australia this year it’s that he didn’t stand by that sound principle, and stay at home…
 

TheSicilian

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Well, the awkward part for him in Australia was that he didn’t have a valid medical exemption, but pretended he did. And I believe he “pretended he did”, rather than believing that he was “misinformed or lied to” by TA or anyone else.

The reason I believe he pretended he did is because subsequent to his arrival in Australia, he chose to lie, bully and try to cheat his way in, and this is also why I think they have sound reasons for not overturning the ban.

But his decision not to get vaccinated? That’s okay with me. That’s based on science too. He has a sensible reason for not taking the vaccine , and if I have a problem about his escapades in Australia this year it’s that he didn’t stand by that sound principle, and stay at home…
I agree with that. As for the medical exemption I don't think he ever publicly said what his exemption was? Which probably confirms he didn't have one.
 

Kieran

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I agree with that. As for the medical exemption I don't think he ever publicly said what his exemption was? Which probably confirms he didn't have one.
He said his exemption was that he’d caught covid, which wasn’t actually included in the Australian list of valid exemptions, a list that was easy to find, I did it in a few seconds back then, so I’m certain that Novak was aware of it…
 

MargaretMcAleer

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Well, he didn’t want to take it for health reasons. He doesn’t need it, and that’s reason enough, especially given that plenty of people have subsequently had a worse effect from the vaccine than the virus. He wanted to choose, on that basis.

But I see that Tiley is keeping out of it this time. By the way, I think that based on Novaks performance last year, they’d be justified to uphold the ban:


Australian Open cannot lobby for Djokovic

Sorry to disappoint you Kieran, Craig Tiley has been very vocal on our television here in Australia about wanting Novak to play, he did enough damage last year and should keep his mouth closed and concentrate on his job, though he did say it was up to Federal Immigration to decide if the ban is overturned., as was Daniel Anderson, the Premier of Victoria.
BTW The 2023 AO was launched yesterday in Melbourne, still it is anyone's guess at present if Novak will play
 
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