Indian Wells, BNP Paribas Open, Masters 1000

[Moxie]

Actually I read it like a funny provocation, that's why I liked it.

If you weren't the provocative prankster that you are, I would call bullshit. But so...do you really think Roger played better than he did in the '08 Wimbledon final?

 

[mrzz]

His groundstrokes are more powerful than last year

On the forehand side, no doubt about it. On the BH side, he is a full grade behind. But the trade off is positive already and I expect him to recover his BH come clay season.

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

On the forehand side, no doubt about it. On the BH side, he is a full grade behind. But the trade off is positive already and I expect him to recover his BH come clay season.

He can defend his BH better on clay anyway.He has the power to blow off any player off the court

Faster HCs and Grass will be his achilles heel where his huge-takeback on his strokes can be rushed easily.

 

[mrzz]

If you weren't the provocative prankster that you are, I would call bullshit. But so...do you really think Roger played better than he did in the '08 Wimbledon final?

Ok, here we go. All in all, I think W 2008 is better, by a good margin actually, even if the matches are so different that it is hard to compare. You might remember that I don think Federer played a shit match in W 2008, I just don think is his best match match there, which I guess is obvious.

Today it was an OK match from Federer. From a shot making perspective, it was bellow par. Strategy wise, though, it was pretty good -- even the drop shots at 5 all. The first was merit Thiem (and some lazyness from Federer to cover the cross court), and the second one was poor execution. But the variation was working all match, and the second drop shot, if not that poorly executed, would be lauded as genial.

The fact that I don't think that Federer played great does not take the merit away from Thiem. First, most of the field would have lost to Federer today. Second, part of Federer bad play was due to Thiem's power, and also his courage to go for big plays in big moments. Federer chose to bet on Thiem's errors in some key moments and payed the price. Not a bad bet, considering the guy had never won a MS and was not exactly playing that well as of late, but it did not work. I actually like when those safe bets go wrong.

 

[DarthFed]

If you weren't the provocative prankster that you are, I would call bullshit. But so...do you really think Roger played better than he did in the '08 Wimbledon final?

Who cares? It's like arguing whether piss tastes better than shit.

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

Ok, here we go. All in all, I think W 2008 is better, by a good margin actually, even if the matches are so different that it is hard to compare. You might remember that I don think Federer played a shit match in W 2008, I just don think is his best match match there, which I guess is obvious.

Today it was an OK match from Federer. From a shot making perspective, it was bellow par. Strategy wise, though, it was pretty good -- even the drop shots at 5 all. The first was merit Thiem (and some lazyness from Federer to cover the cross court), and the second one was poor execution. But the variation was working all match, and the second drop shot, if not that poorly executed, would be lauded as genial.

The fact that I don't think that Federer played great does not take the merit away from Thiem. First, most of the field would have lost to Federer today. Second, part of Federer bad play was due to Thiem's power, and also his courage to go for big plays in big moments. Federer chose to bet on Thiem's errors in some key moments and payed the price. Not a bad bet, considering the guy had never won a MS and was not exactly playing that well as of late, but it did not work. I actually like when those safe bets go wrong.

I think both were poor performances but back then at least Fed could rally properly and not wilter at the first heavy ball

 

[mrzz]

He can defend his BH better on clay anyway.He has the power to blow off any player off the court

Faster HCs and Grass will be his achilles heel where his huge-takeback on his strokes can be rushed easily.

I watched him play some weeks ago on the South American clay swing, and his BH was atrocious. Really. He was slicing it all time, to the same amount that del Potro was when back from one of his wrist surgeries. No wonder he lost early in two small clay tournaments. That why I made the remark I mentioned some posts ago -- which should be the worst prediction of all times -- that he was not playing well enough not even to reach a clay masters semi final. I guess there was some injury affecting him back then, but also I think he changed a bit his motion. Not that much, but it is a bit shorter. Actually he fired a few much shorter ones today, but I guess it was more a natural reflex to being rushed than his proper motion.

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

I watched him play some weeks ago on the South American clay swing, and his BH was atrocious. Really. He was slicing it all time, to the same amount that del Potro was when back from one of his wrist surgeries. No wonder he lost early in two small clay tournaments. That why I made the remark I mentioned some posts ago -- which should be the worst prediction of all times -- that he was not playing well enough not even to reach a clay masters semi final. I guess there was some injury affecting him back then, but also I think he changed a bit his motion. Not that much, but it is a bit shorter. Actually he fired a few much shorter ones today, but I guess it was more a natural reflex to being rushed than his proper motion.

Yeah I saw some of those Rio and Buenos Aires matches.
He wasn't recovered from his illness back then.
I think he's fully committed to the clay season - I read somewhere that he's also skipping Miami

 

[the AntiPusher]

Yeah I saw some of those Rio and Buenos Aires matches.
He wasn't recovered from his illness back then.
I think he's fully committed to the clay season - I read somewhere that he's also skipping Miami

Rafa and Dominic will defeat him in straight sets on clay..I truly don’t buy that he is gonna play RG

 

[mrzz]

Yeah I saw some of those Rio and Buenos Aires matches.
He wasn't recovered from his illness back then.
I think he's fully committed to the clay season - I read somewhere that he's also skipping Miami

I know that he historically overplays but I think he should play. Guy is on a roll, Miami is slow as hell, and he would have almost a week to rest. But, on the other hand, it would show how serious he is about the clay season. And let the guy party a while...

Anyway it would be fun to see now everyone saying how much a favorite he is on the clay season -- while he was considered dead just a week ago.

 

[mrzz]

Rafa and Dominic will defeat him in straight sets on clay..I truly don’t buy that he is gonna play RG

He was referring to Thiem.

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

Rafa and Dominic will defeat him in straight sets on clay..I truly don’t buy that he is gonna play RG

How can Dominic defeat Dominic ?

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

I know that he historically overplays but I think he should play. Guy is on a roll, Miami is slow as hell, and he would have almost a week to rest. But, on the other hand, it would show how serious he is about the clay season. And let the guy party a while...

Anyway it would be fun to see now everyone saying how much a favorite he is on the clay season -- while he was considered dead just a week ago.

His clay prep was stalled due to an IW injury last year - which explains the poor results in MC and Barcelona.He regrouped well though reaching RG final-had the most brutal draw amongst the top seeds.

 

[mrzz]

How can Dominic defeat Dominic ?

Well, Fognini is one that can beat himself quite easily.

 

[Moxie]

Who cares? It's like arguing whether piss tastes better than shit.

I didn't propose the question. That is your evaluation. To me, it's a joke to say that Roger at 37 at IW could play better than he did at Wimbledon at 26.

 

[the AntiPusher]

How can Dominic defeat Dominic ?

i am referring to Roger’s chances on clay

 

[the AntiPusher]

He was referring to Thiem.

I am referring to Roger

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

i am referring to Roger’s chances on clay

I don't rate that highly anyway and IMO it's a mistake but that post had nothing to do with this topic.
It's a separate conversation

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Let me go look at the "up to the moment" rankings! Dom and Roger should have changed places with Thiem going to #4 and Fed #5!

This is a rare poetic justice. Often in tennis, the losing player might actually end up high in the rankings and vice versa (due to the way defending points work) and we have hard time explaining it to non-tennis fans. But, this time the winning player moved ahead of the losing player and that too by a mere exchange of spots, not affecting other players.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Embarrassing for Fed. Thiem and Zverev both ahead of him. Hopefully he gets a top 4 seed at Wimbledon. With their ranking system it is possible.

Since Roger sucked at Wimbledon last year, he won't get his usual quota of freebie grass points. Also, both Sasha and Thiem will rack up lot of points during the clay season. So, Roger need to do well in Miami, Madrid and RG to retain a top four spot at Wimby.