2020 French Open Final: Novak Djokovic vs. Rafael Nadal

[calitennis127]

Nadal also got to a higher level of god mode tennis on hard courts than both Djokovic and Federer as well in 2010,2013 2009, 2019 of course Nadal favorite surface stats and level are far greater than Djokovic and Federer favorite surface stats as well like I said greater player Nadal.

Nadal didn’t even get to a MS final the summer of 2010. In 2009 he won against Federer in the Australian Open and against Nalbandian at Indian Wells he never should have. Then Delpo slapped him down at the US Open.

 

[Andy22]

In 2008, Federer did not drop a set before the final. In 2009, he only dropped one set before the final. And in the prior years I don’t recall him ever going to 5 before the final.

Nadal’s best run at Wimbledon was in 2008 but there’s no way his level was above Federer’s. Nadal’s only other title at Wimbledon required him to win 2 5-setters.

but that was weak era Wimbledon before 2010s, after that he had lost to world 100 something player, Tsonga after being 2 sets up? Anderson lost again, Djokovic lost 2014, 2019 choke job LOL. Nadal never lost 2 sets up at Wimbledon face it Nadal just better in most things in tennis than Federer like 2010s DEC.

 

[MikeOne]

Mike, you are totally missing the point for why Djokovic lost.....it’s the same problem that caused the Tsitsipas match to go to 5. Djokovic’s first serving is inexcusably sloppy and abysmal at times. I believe in the first set he only made 40% of first serves. He never seems to get in a serving rhythm, even when he’s playing well.

Notice how Nadal and especially Federer walk up to the line, especially when they’re fresh, and smoothly hit the serves they want. Djokovic still dribbles 18 times like he did 10 years ago and then muscles the ball into the net before taking another 20 minutes to barely get his second serve in. It cost him at the end of the 3rd set against Tsitsipas and it cost him in the first set today.

That’s his main area of weakness, and with Nadal sharp and energized, it didn’t allow him to get the match to open up.

i'm actually a djokovic fan, i slightly favor him than nadal but i like nadal as-well. I wanted Novak to win because he has 17 and i wanted to see 18-19-20, plus i think Novak is probably the most complete of all big 3... his best surfaces are hardcourt (8 AOs, 3 USOs) and grass (5 Wimbledons, beating Fed 3 times in finals!) and is the player sho has beating the nadal the most on clay, including in big stages. It feels to me, Novak should get both records of most weeks at #1 (he is getting there) and most slams (setback today).

So it's not like i'm a nadal fan, novak hater, unlike you, i see what opponents have..you always dismiss Nadal as a caveman.. Your serve argument sounds like the same BS you have made about nalbandian, 'If Nadalbandian could serve, he would've had 30 slams'. So today, novak's serve was off.. Somehow you treat the serve different than a forehand, backhand, volleys...

The point is that you have been wrong on nadal all the time. Nadal doesn't just defend, he is EXTREMELY AGGRESIVE ON CLAY. He OVERPOWERED Wawrinka in 17 finals, OVERPOWERED FeD IN 08 FINALS... he has tremendous power and spin. Forget about the serve, Djokovic played well in 3rd set and still lost it. Djokovic played out of his mind in 13 sem-finals, still lost it.

The issue is simple... Nadal's movement, defense and offense on clay is the best we have ever seen.. 13-0 in finals is out of this world. The fact is that even Djokovic playing at his absolute best can still lose to nadal.... Of course the 0,2 was a disgrace, Novak can do better than that. Here's the kicker, Novak would've never lost 0,2 against Theim, Tsitsipas or even Fed playing like he did in the first 2 sets... Nadal doesn't give you ANYTHING and he ALSO ATTACKS YOU. It was apparent that Novak had to redline for 3-5 hours today, go big on all his shots, serve big, mix it up and also have to deal with many winners coming back... there were some points in 3rd set where Novak had to hit 3 winners to win the point, you saw him smiling.

So in the end. novak could've done better, but even at his best, he needs a bit of luck. My issue with you is how you continue to undermine Nadal's game, Nadal has it all, including power, spin and ability to hit winners off both wings.. Then he has the defense, movement, lefty style, angles.. it's a crazy combination cali, this is NEVER on Djokovic's racquet...

 

[Andy22]

Nadal didn’t even get to a MS final the summer of 2010. In 2009 he won against Federer in the Australian Open and against Nalbandian at Indian Wells he never should have. Then Delpo slapped him down at the US Open.

your right Nadal was a tennis god in first half in 2009, until injury which is why del potro beat him.

 

[the AntiPusher]

I’m just thrilled to see you here again, brother. You’ve been missed.

I didn't miss him.. jajaja

 

[Andy22]

federer had a weaker era, Hard court king djokovic has two slams on his favorite surface and still goat Nadal has 20 grand slam titles WOW this man is out of this world epic.

 

[calitennis127]

i'm actually a djokovic fan, i slightly favor him than nadal but i like nadal as-well. I wanted Novak to win because he has 17 and i wanted to see 18-19-20, plus i think Novak is probably the most complete of all big 3... his best surfaces are hardcourt (8 AOs, 3 USOs) and grass (5 Wimbledons, beating Fed 3 times in finals!) and is the player sho has beating the nadal the most on clay, including in big stages. It feels to me, Novak should get both records of most weeks at #1 (he is getting there) and most slams (setback today).

So it's not like i'm a nadal fan, novak hater, unlike you, i see what opponents have..you always dismiss Nadal as a caveman.. Your serve argument sounds like the same BS you have made about nalbandian, 'If Nadalbandian could serve, he would've had 30 slams'. So today, novak's serve was off.. Somehow you treat the serve different than a forehand, backhand, volleys...

The point is that you have been wrong on nadal all the time. Nadal doesn't just defend, he is EXTREMELY AGGRESIVE ON CLAY. He OVERPOWERED Wawrinka in 17 finals, OVERPOWERED FeD IN 08 FINALS... he has tremendous power and spin. Forget about the serve, Djokovic played well in 3rd set and still lost it. Djokovic played out of his mind in 13 sem-finals, still lost it.

The issue is simple... Nadal's movement, defense and offense on clay is the best we have ever seen.. 13-0 in finals is out of this world. The fact is that even Djokovic playing at his absolute best can still lose to nadal.... Of course the 0,2 was a disgrace, Novak can do better than that. Here's the kicker, Novak would've never lost 0,2 against Theim, Tsitsipas or even Fed playing like he did in the first 2 sets... Nadal doesn't give you ANYTHING and he ALSO ATTACKS YOU. It was apparent that Novak had to redline for 3-5 hours today, go big on all his shots, serve big, mix it up and also have to deal with many winners coming back... there were some points in 3rd set where Novak had to hit 3 winners to win the point, you saw him smiling.

So in the end. novak could've done better, but even at his best, he needs a bit of luck. My issue with you is how you continue to undermine Nadal's game, Nadal has it all, including power, spin and ability to hit winners off both wings.. Then he has the defense, movement, lefty style, angles.. it's a crazy combination cali, this is NEVER on Djokovic's racquet...

Mike, you make some good points but for the most part you are full of shit on this issue. Djokovic has beaten Nadal 7 times on clay. Do you seriously think he played perfectly every time? Do you think he never made a mistake in those wins? That is ridiculous. Stop making Nadal out to be some invincible superhuman for Djokovic to overcome.

Second, my point about serving is not that Djokovic needed to be Kevin Anderson. My point is that he needed to be better than a qualifier. Is it too much to ask the #1 player in the world to serve between 60 and 70% in the first set of a Grand slam final? He served 40% today in the first set. That is abysmal. And there is no excuse for it.

The match didn’t even open up until the 3rd set because of how bad Djokovic’s serving was.

As for Nadal’s natural offense, you are of course overrating it. If he had the offensive talent you are talking about, he would have a much better overall record at Wimbledon and he would have won more early in his career at the US Open. My own opinion of Nadal shifted 2007 to 2009 with his US Open losses. He was immensely athletic and I was rooting for him against Ferrer and Murray so that a Fed-Nadal final could happen. But then we saw his limitations on full display in those two matches, as we also did against Delpo in 2009.

That isn’t to say Nadal is not offensive at all (I have never called him a caveman either). He obviously is offensive. He just isn’t is as sensational as you make him out to be. And his offensive game does not explain why he wins big matches.

 

[calitennis127]

but that was weak era Wimbledon before 2010s, after that he had lost to world 100 something player, Tsonga after being 2 sets up? Anderson lost again, Djokovic lost 2014, 2019 choke job LOL. Nadal never lost 2 sets up at Wimbledon face it Nadal just better in most things in tennis than Federer like 2010s DEC.

Federer had much tougher competition from the field than Djokovic/Nadal do. How can you compare the depth of the tour when Federer was #1 to what the tour has now?

The second-tier players were much better than they are now.

 

[tented]

Nadal's performance wasn't only one of the greatest we've seen in tennis, but his 13th title transcends tennis to become one of sports most monolithic, epic and surely unequalable achievements.

NBC showed this during the match:

The Phelps record is arguably the most impressive (i.e., unbreakable), since someone only gets a chance to improve on this every four years.

 

[Andy22]

Federer had much tougher competition from the field than Djokovic/Nadal do. How can you compare the depth of the tour when Federer was #1 to what the tour has now?

The second-tier players were much better than they are now.

NO weak era not even close to players these days wawrinka murray, cillic del potro, All beat federer at slams, hewitt Roddick never did Also wawrinka and murray by themselves, won more majors than safin hewitt roddick james blake henman ect LOL. thats not even counting del potro Cllic thiem they was jokes to players like djokovic Nadal wawrinka murray, cllic del potro even tsonga berdych ferrer where better players took it up big 3 way more.

 

[calitennis127]

NO weak era not even close to players these days wawrinka murray, cillic del potro, All beat federer at slams, hewitt Roddick never did Also wawrinka and murray by themselves, won more majors than safin hewitt roddick james blake henman ect LOL. thats not even counting del potro Cllic thiem they was jokes to players like djokovic Nadal wawrinka murray, cllic del potro even tsonga berdych ferrer where better players took it up big 3 way more.

Wawrinka, Murray, and Del Potro are part of the era I am talking about. Wawrinka is older than Djokovic and Nadal.

The point is that there was more talent and competition in the rankings from 5 to 20 while Federer was #1 than there is now.

 

[Andy22]

Nadal is the only flawless player in the world right now, that a hero he is to everyone, even inspired IGA korda to play tennis his the reason why we have a new women's teen RG champion. Also Nadal inspired the whole world to play tennis because of his god level tennis the man is just out of this world epic and we should All get on our knees and thank god for goat Nadal.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Rafa is the first men's player in history to win a major without dropping a set four times (2008,2010,2017 and 2020).

Rafa is the first player in the Open Era,male or female,to win any tour-event 13 times.(Navratilova won WTA Chicago event 12 times).

 

[Andy22]

Wawrinka, Murray, and Del Potro are part of the era I am talking about. Wawrinka is older than Djokovic and Nadal.

The point is that there was more talent and competition in the rankings from 5 to 20 while Federer was #1 than there is now.

but wawrinka Murray where not even close to prime tennis back than so don't that your talking about have you go mad? Also the talent thing is just opinion based not fact base, I take thiem, zverev Medvedev sinner tsitsipas any day of the week over weak era way less talented players who hardy won any majors besides Hewitt Roddick Safin before Federer had even got to his peak.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Rafa still not sure about playing the ATP Finals.Will decide tomorrow or Tuesday.

"We are facing a tough situation,we will need to go to Australia earlier than usual.It's time to be smart and do the right decisions".

 

[Andy22]

not even covid-19 can stop Nadal from becoming the goat of tennis, but honestly I would still have Djokovic over Federer in 2nd place his double masters titles and beating him in 3 Wimbledon finals won me over then it comes to 2nd goat.

 

[calitennis127]

but wawrinka Murray where not even close to prime tennis back than so don't that your talking about have you go mad? Also the talent thing is just opinion based not fact base, I take thiem, zverev Medvedev sinner tsitsipas any day of the week over weak era way less talented players who hardy won any majors besides Hewitt Roddick Safin before Federer had even got to his peak.

I’ll take Nalbandian, Safin, Davydenko, Moya, etc. over the second tier today.

Murray started doing damage in 2006. He was one of the few to beat Federer that year. And Wawrinka did not hit his prime until his early 30’s. He also never really had a dominant stretch aside from his Slam runs. Look at his record against the Big 3. It’s not pretty.

The second tier was better during Federer’s reign that it is today.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

May I say Rafa hitting a lob over the BH side of Novak,who is right handed is just Unbelievable......back to watching the match

 

[Bonaca]

He will skip ATP Finals like he skipped US Open, knowing he most likely will not win.
He should also think about skipping AO 21 and use these 7 month to prepare for French Open 21 like he did this year.
Hope for upsets and disqualifications.
Would be damn smart.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jelenafan]

Didn't want to jinx Nadal during the tourney so I didn't post this earlier but I thought this was a fairly obvious thing...

https://www.atptour.com/en/news/nadal-infosys-beyond-the-numbers-rally-length-october-2020

Nadal may very well struggle to hurt opponents with spin and height as in previous years, but with the length of the rallies becoming significantly longer because of the colder conditions, Nadal is merely exchanging one weapon for another.