Will Nadal pass Federer?

[Carol]

Unfortunately Roger had just keyhole surgery and no performance enhancing PRP treatment so he won't sprout giant muscles and start running like the Easter bunny.

That's exactly how Roger these last months was running all around the court so maybe his knee has suffered.

Doubt that very much. He never plays like a grinder and never will. It's just bad luck.

I see that you have not watched him too much playing against some players.....oh wait, I forgot that he plays too easy.....yeah.....sure....any effort at all.....unbelievable......

 

[lacatch]

That's exactly how Roger these last months was running all around the court so maybe his knee has suffered.

Doubt that very much. He never plays like a grinder and never will. It's just bad luck.

I see that you have not watched him too much playing against some players.....oh wait, I forgot that he plays too easy.....yeah.....sure....any effort at all.....unbelievable......

Carol: 1)Rafa's style of playing is far more brutal on the body/more physical than Roger's, since the latter plays much shorter points and is lighter on his feet. That's not opinion, it's just fact. 2)Roger didn't injure his knee during the Open; he did it the day AFTER he played. No one knows what happened to him, but it didn't occur on the court.

 

[Carol]

Nobody has to be professional athlete to get an injury, it can happen any time, running, a misstep, falling, etc etc. but after to work hard every single day to improve the game and playing professionally any sport everyone sooner or later has more risk to get injuries because the body is punished constantly but of course there is the luck factor which Roger always had (but not most of the players) and after to play several matches the knees are more sensitive to any bad movement even just jumping from the bed or the sofa and that seems what happened to him

 

[lacatch]

Nobody has to be professional athlete to get an injury, it can happen any time, running, a misstep, falling, etc etc. but after to work hard every single day to improve the game and playing professionally any sport everyone sooner or later has more risk to get injuries because the body is punished constantly but of course there is the luck factor which Roger always had (but not most of the players) and after to play several matches the knees are more sensitive to any bad movement even just jumping from the bed or the sofa and that seems what happened to him

Carol--I agree that being a professional athlete and the punishment to the body can make it more prone to an injury. On the other hand, the opposite can be true as well: because athletes are super fit they are less likely to get injuries exacerbated by being out of shape. I disagree with your statement that Roger has been relatively injury-free because he is "lucky". To my knowledge, he's only had a couple of years--most recently in 2013, when a bad back hampered his play. I remember that he wore a special support under his shirt. He has been injury free due to at least 3 factors: training regimen, style of play (more graceful than most anyone else), and body type.

 

[Carol]

The factor lucky has much to do. For example Ferrer is one of the players that makes more effort in all the ways than anyone else, how many times has been injured? once, twice and for a very short time, Almagro who plays "easier" has had more injuries, shoulder, foot etc. Delpo, strong guy, excellent serve, strong FH and you have seen what has happened to him, not just one wrist but both injured. Novak, the rubber man (Monfils style) a lot of yoga and elasticity but very lucky that his body is still in one piece, I saw his ankle twisted many times, also his knees and legs but still "alive".
It doesn't matter the style, all of them are trying to be fitted but they have to move the shoulders, arms and legs and yes, the back suffers a lot too, Muzz had to go through a surgery, Raonic and Nalbandian the hip, Tsonga and Monfils injury by injury and etc etc etc etc. Only a few players (not only Roger) are injury-free and I agree that the frame of the body is an important factor too

 

[Front242]

The words you are looking for are good genetics, not lucky. You make your own luck. If you run match after match like a gazelle you're not unlucky, you're simply not being very clever in the long term. Compare the average length of Nadal's matches to Federer's and you'll see where the "luck" comes into it. They're often half the time of Nadal's. The "luck" is way less time on court due to a higher tennis IQ.

 

[Kieran]

The words you are looking for are good genetics, not lucky. You make your own luck. If you run match after match like a gazelle you're not unlucky, you're simply not being very clever in the long term. Compare the average length of Nadal's matches to Federer's and you'll see where the "luck" comes into it. They're often half the time of Nadal's. The "luck" is way less time on court due to a higher tennis IQ.

You couldn't write three lines without contradicting yourself. Is it a "higher tennis IQ" :cover , genetics, or playing long matches? Which one is it?

And I was under the impression - from you among others - that Rafa's matches were so long because he faffs about with towels and water bottles and itching and scratching and all sorts of nefarious schemes to drag things out.

You're eating the Federer body myth without salt, buddy. You're repeating the reheats...

 

[lacatch]

The words you are looking for are good genetics, not lucky. You make your own luck. If you run match after match like a gazelle you're not unlucky, you're simply not being very clever in the long term. Compare the average length of Nadal's matches to Federer's and you'll see where the "luck" comes into it. They're often half the time of Nadal's. The "luck" is way less time on court due to a higher tennis IQ.

You couldn't write three lines without contradicting yourself. Is it a "higher tennis IQ" :cover , genetics, or playing long matches? Which one is it?

And I was under the impression - from you among others - that Rafa's matches were so long because he faffs about with towels and water bottles and itching and scratching and all sorts of nefarious schemes to drag things out.

You're eating the Federer body myth without salt, buddy. You're repeating the reheats...

Kieran and Carol--Please refer to my post above. I stated that Fed's lack of injury has been due to at least three factors, two of which you just repeated: 1)playing style (quicker matches and less grinding style on the body) ; 2) genetics; 3) training regimen. I'm not sure where "luck" fits into the equation.

 

[Kieran]

The words you are looking for are good genetics, not lucky. You make your own luck. If you run match after match like a gazelle you're not unlucky, you're simply not being very clever in the long term. Compare the average length of Nadal's matches to Federer's and you'll see where the "luck" comes into it. They're often half the time of Nadal's. The "luck" is way less time on court due to a higher tennis IQ.

You couldn't write three lines without contradicting yourself. Is it a "higher tennis IQ" :cover , genetics, or playing long matches? Which one is it?

And I was under the impression - from you among others - that Rafa's matches were so long because he faffs about with towels and water bottles and itching and scratching and all sorts of nefarious schemes to drag things out.

You're eating the Federer body myth without salt, buddy. You're repeating the reheats...

Kieran and Carol--Please refer to my post above. I stated that Fed's lack of injury has been due to at least three factors, two of which you just repeated: 1)playing style (quicker matches and less grinding style on the body) ; 2) genetics; 3) training regimen. I'm not sure where "luck" fits into the equation.

Well, we don't know about his "genetics" or much about his "training regimen", and I never mentioned "luck". His aggressive style of play is actually grinding enough on the body, given how many miles on the clock he has. But don't worry, I'm not getting at you or Federer, just my old buddy Front and his inconsistencies. Suddenly he's decided that Novak's egg is noteworthy - after all these years using it - because Novak is dominating the field...

 

[Carol]

The words you are looking for are good genetics, not lucky. You make your own luck. If you run match after match like a gazelle you're not unlucky, you're simply not being very clever in the long term. Compare the average length of Nadal's matches to Federer's and you'll see where the "luck" comes into it. They're often half the time of Nadal's. The "luck" is way less time on court due to a higher tennis IQ.

You couldn't write three lines without contradicting yourself. Is it a "higher tennis IQ" :cover , genetics, or playing long matches? Which one is it?

And I was under the impression - from you among others - that Rafa's matches were so long because he faffs about with towels and water bottles and itching and scratching and all sorts of nefarious schemes to drag things out.

You're eating the Federer body myth without salt, buddy. You're repeating the reheats...

Kieran and Carol--Please refer to my post above. I stated that Fed's lack of injury has been due to at least three factors, two of which you just repeated: 1)playing style (quicker matches and less grinding style on the body) ; 2) genetics; 3) training regimen. I'm not sure where "luck" fits into the equation.

Can you tell me why Ferrer, Berdych, Stan, Verdasco and others never have been injured (just a little
discomfort) and maybe they have taken just a week off? or why anyone can get appendicitis?
And please, don't tell that they play quick matches and by the way I've seen Roger playing long matches many times too....

 

[Kieran]

I don't think a player can be lucky not to be injured, because we'd have to be able to pinpoint exactly when and where the good fortune struck them, but they can be unlucky to be injured...

 

[lacatch]

Carol--You are trying to deflect the fact that part of Rafa's frequent injuries is due to his style of play. That is a fact. Others ---like Federer--have a much less taxing style of play. And Ferrer HAS been out with long injuries--just last year in fact. And he has a VERY taxing style of play--he runs everything down, as Rafa USED to be able to do in the past. You try and denigrate Novak's victories by calling his competition weak, lessen Roger's accomplishments by attributing his style of play/success to "luck" at not being injured. Only poor, poor Rafa has been unfairly punished because he has had bad luck. Appendicitis hasn't caused him to fall from the perch,d ear---his style of play has caught up to him. And if you disagree with almost every expert on this----I don't know what else to tell you. It's one thing to be a fan, it's another to misconstrue facts and live in denial.

 

[Carol]

Carol--You are trying to deflect the fact that part of Rafa's frequent injuries is due to his style of play. That is a fact. Others ---like Federer--have a much less taxing style of play. And Ferrer HAS been out with long injuries--just last year in fact. And he has a VERY taxing style of play--he runs everything down, as Rafa USED to be able to do in the past. You try and denigrate Novak's victories by calling his competition weak, lessen Roger's accomplishments by attributing his style of play/success to "luck" at not being injured. Only poor, poor Rafa has been unfairly punished because he has had bad luck. Appendicitis hasn't caused him to fall from the perch,d ear---his style of play has caught up to him. And if you disagree with almost every expert on this----I don't know what else to tell you. It's one thing to be a fan, it's another to misconstrue facts and live in denial.

Excuse moi but you are the one that ALWAYS try to denigrate the Nadal's victories over anyone
You don't have any idea why Rafa has had problems in his knee, any remote idea but you should get better information before to attack him like you always do
How long Ferrer has been out of the court?
And about Novak, I've never said that he doesn't deserve to win, he does with all the honors because is playing really well but it doesn't mean that the others good players are in their best time, they are not for different reasons, age, injuries, lack of confidence, personal problems, whatever but they are very inconsistent and I hope it's not going to last too long, nothing wrong to say it because it's obviously the true
And I have the same problem like you, I don't know what else to tell you after these reasonable facts

 

[Kieran]

Things are never so simple as to blame Nadal for all his injuries. His right wrist? Pure bad timing that 99.9999% of the time wouldn't have had any negative effect. The appendix top of it. His energetic style doesn't necessarily mean he's bound to have knee trouble. Novak plays energetically, pulling off the splits on hard courts, bending his ankles at right angles skidding into the shot, but we've had no reports that this has caused him anything other than a chance of making the shot...

 

[Fiero425]

Things are never so simple as to blame Nadal for all his injuries. His right wrist? Pure bad timing that 99.9999% of the time wouldn't have had any negative effect. The appendix top of it. His energetic style doesn't necessarily mean he's bound to have knee trouble. Novak plays energetically, pulling off the splits on hard courts, bending his ankles at right angles skidding into the shot, but we've had no reports that this has caused him anything other than a chance of making the shot...

Nole doesn't employ a chemist either; that could be a factor! :nono :angel: :dodgy: :ras:

 

[Kieran]

Things are never so simple as to blame Nadal for all his injuries. His right wrist? Pure bad timing that 99.9999% of the time wouldn't have had any negative effect. The appendix top of it. His energetic style doesn't necessarily mean he's bound to have knee trouble. Novak plays energetically, pulling off the splits on hard courts, bending his ankles at right angles skidding into the shot, but we've had no reports that this has caused him anything other than a chance of making the shot...

Nole doesn't employ a chemist either; that could be a factor! :nono :angel: :dodgy: :ras:

What a silly and bizarre comment. As in, Rafa doesn't employ a chemist, and "Novak doesn't employ a chemist either" ? Do you have records of who they employ? I'm missing something here, buddy... :cover

 

[Carol]

gzzzz, reading some comments sometimes I think I' m in a Circus :snicker

 

[Riotbeard]

You couldn't write three lines without contradicting yourself. Is it a "higher tennis IQ" :cover , genetics, or playing long matches? Which one is it?

And I was under the impression - from you among others - that Rafa's matches were so long because he faffs about with towels and water bottles and itching and scratching and all sorts of nefarious schemes to drag things out.

You're eating the Federer body myth without salt, buddy. You're repeating the reheats...

Kieran and Carol--Please refer to my post above. I stated that Fed's lack of injury has been due to at least three factors, two of which you just repeated: 1)playing style (quicker matches and less grinding style on the body) ; 2) genetics; 3) training regimen. I'm not sure where "luck" fits into the equation.

Well, we don't know about his "genetics" or much about his "training regimen", and I never mentioned "luck". His aggressive style of play is actually grinding enough on the body, given how many miles on the clock he has. But don't worry, I'm not getting at you or Federer, just my old buddy Front and his inconsistencies. Suddenly he's decided that Novak's egg is noteworthy - after all these years using it - because Novak is dominating the field...

I am not saying Federer or Djokovic are lucky, but I am not sure how we can say with any proof that Fed has been injury free (relatively speaking) due to genetic inheritance. Maybe not luck but chance certainly play some sort of factor, even if it's the chance of being born with stronger knees and the personal historical contingencies that shape how a player chooses to approach the game.

 

[El Dude]

I remember someone saying, in regards to baseball, that staying healthy is a skill, part of a player's overall skill-set. I'm inclined to agree with that and think it is relevant to tennis.

Now staying healthy isn't only skill, but it isn't only genetics or luck. It is a combination of factors. But when we look at a player's record, we can't just tease out parts like mental toughness and say, "other than that he's a great player." A major component of greatness is mental toughness - and in terms of longevity, is health. Health has to be factored in - not as an excuse for any missing components in a player's greatness resume, but as a part of why a given player has the record they do. In other words, we can look at Roger or Novak and see their health as a part of why they are great. I'm not sure it is as accurate to say that Rafa would have been greater if he had been healthier because, as some have pointed out, part of his greatness is because of his style of play and body, which in turn leads to more injury.

Achilles was the greatest warrior during the Trojan war because of his skill, passion and fire. But he was also filled with hubris because of those very same qualities, which led to his eventual death. We can't separate the good from the bad, because oftentimes they are two sides of the same coin. And so it is with Rafa.

 

[Kieran]

Again, I'm not too sure it's so straight forward. Rafa had bad knees aged 20, with hardly yards on the clock, let alone miles. And as I say, his right wrist, not his left one went. That can't be from overdoing it, because it would never have gotten anywhere like the work Federers or stan's wrists would get from their one-hander. Sometimes these things are a local weakness in the body, or random bad luck, in which case it doesn't fall under the category of "a skill." As we see, Novak gives his ankles a helluva time - on hards! - but hasn't reported any injuries or wear and tear issues that we know of.

Sometimes they're due to physical punishment too, and bad scheduling, no question about it. Sometimes something else...