What on Earth is going on in the world today? It's gone mad

[Federberg]

 

[calitennis127]

In fairness, that would be on the Governer of Florida, not Trump. They actually raised that specific case at the conference today. Pence fielded the question and said all Americans should be following the Federal advice. If DeSantis? has gone rogue, then it's really on him. They did sidestep a couple of questions on the Governer specifically, but the advice was fairly clear.

There is one other political element that you are completely missing here. DeSantis won the gubernatorial race in Florida last year in one of the most tightly contested elections in the country. The guy he beat was Andrew Gillum, a black Democrat and a darling of the national media. (Gillum also recently got busted in Miami cheating on his wife with a white male gay porn star in a hotel room where they were doing meth together). The national media is still salty over DeSantis winning so they want to target him at all costs.

Notice that most of the states struggling with coronavirus have Democratic governors, and when the media talk about them it is with pity and praise. All of the Democratic governors are heroes trying to save lives according to the media. But DeSantis is just a ruthless, stubborn ass hole allowing Floridians to die. Cuomo on the other hand is the reincarnation of Ghandi and Nelson Mandela wrapped in one, as he tries to save babies and crying mothers (so we are told).

 

[calitennis127]

Uh oh, terrible news here for Tented, Federbergy, and Bwoken - in addition to the recent FDA approval of the drug touted by Trump, now the Democratic governor of Michigan has reversed course on it after initially prohibiting it.

So Britbox…..are you going to give Trump some credit on this one? Ever since he talked this drug up, not only has it worked in multiple cases but government officials are starting to sanction it. (I did notice that you gave Trump some credit for a good press conference. Maybe you should give him credit for calling this one too.)

Gov. Whitmer reverses course on coronavirus drugs, is now asking feds for hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine

Gov. Whitmer reverses course on coronavirus drugs, is now asking feds for hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine

Gov. Gretchen Whitmer drew fire from some on the right after the Michigan Department of Licensing and Regulatory Affairs (LARA) sent a letter last week...

www.metrotimes.com

 

[Federberg]

Uh oh, terrible news here for Tented, Federbergy, and Bwoken - in addition to the recent FDA approval of the drug touted by Trump, now the Democratic governor of Michigan has reversed course on it after initially prohibiting it.

So Britbox…..are you going to give Trump some credit on this one? Ever since he talked this drug up, not only has it worked in multiple cases but government officials are starting to sanction it. (I did notice that you gave Trump some credit for a good press conference. Maybe you should give him credit for calling this one too.)

Gov. Whitmer reverses course on coronavirus drugs, is now asking feds for hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine

Gov. Whitmer reverses course on coronavirus drugs, is now asking feds for hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine

Gov. Gretchen Whitmer drew fire from some on the right after the Michigan Department of Licensing and Regulatory Affairs (LARA) sent a letter last week...

www.metrotimes.com

That’s more to do with politics than science I suspect. Research needs to be done.

Can chloroquine prevent coronavirus disease? | News | Wellcome

The COVID-19 Therapeutics Accelerator is funding clinical trials to investigate if anti-malarial drugs hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine can be used to prevent the spread of COVID-19.

wellcome.ac.uk

 

[calitennis127]

That’s more to do with politics than science I suspect. Research needs to be done.

Well the good news (for people who actually want the pandemic to be slowed) is that this is not a brand new drug that has never been used. It has already been successful in combating malaria. Your article said this:

"Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine have been approved as safe and effective drugs to treat malaria. When taken, they accumulate in lung tissue where the coronavirus is found – this is why researchers think they might be effective against the virus.....Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine have been safely used in millions of people, including children."

Also, there were already two studies in France done on hydroxychloroquine but for whatever reason they aren't getting much attention.

 

[Federberg]

Well the good news (for people who actually want the pandemic to be slowed) is that this is not a brand new drug that has never been used. It has already been successful in combating malaria. Your article said this:

"Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine have been approved as safe and effective drugs to treat malaria. When taken, they accumulate in lung tissue where the coronavirus is found – this is why researchers think they might be effective against the virus.....Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine have been safely used in millions of people, including children."

Also, there were already two studies in France done on hydroxychloroquine but for whatever reason they aren't getting much attention.

obviously because it isn't a confirmed palliative for the coronavirus. Obviously we all hope it will have some positive effects. It is utterly stupid to parade it as a cure all right now as this risk causes unwarranted shortages which end up killing people who actually need it. Can't believe this has to be said...

 

[calitennis127]

obviously because it isn't a confirmed palliative for the coronavirus. Obviously we all hope it will have some positive effects.

I don't think that's obvious at all. I think many people want it to fail because Trump touted it - you included.

It is utterly stupid to parade it as a cure all right now as this risk causes unwarranted shortages which end up killing people who actually need it. Can't believe this has to be said...

Lol.....oh I see. Let's not use hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19 even though there are numerous indicators that it will work and even though it addresses the core problem with coronavirus (lung infection). We should just keep it on the shelf in case there is a new malaria outbreak.

Face it Federbergy…..you simply don't want it to succeed because Trump was talking it up a week ago. You would hate to see him vindicated.

 

[Federberg]

They're not messing around! This is how it's done...

 

[Federberg]

I don't think that's obvious at all. I think many people want it to fail because Trump touted it - you included.



Lol.....oh I see. Let's not use hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19 even though there are numerous indicators that it will work and even though it addresses the core problem with coronavirus (lung infection). We should just keep it on the shelf in case there is a new malaria outbreak.

Face it Federbergy…..you simply don't want it to succeed because Trump was talking it up a week ago. You would hate to see him vindicated.

This is where you really lose me. People are dying you fucking prick. I don't care who comes up with a solution. I just want this gone. What the fuck is wrong with you???

 

[calitennis127]

This is where you really lose me. People are dying you fucking prick. I don't care who comes up with a solution. I just want this gone. What the fuck is wrong with you???

I am not saying that you are an evil person who is wishing death on anyone (except perhaps Americans in the abstract so you can use that against Trump). I'm sure there are people you know who you are genuinely worried about. But I also think that you would prefer that the cure not be something that Trump hyped. Both things can be true at the same time, can't they?

 

[Federberg]

I am not saying that you are an evil person who is wishing death on anyone (except perhaps Americans in the abstract so you can use that against Trump). I'm sure there are people you know who you are genuinely worried about. But I also think that you would prefer that the cure not be something that Trump hyped. Both things can be true at the same time, can't they?

I have American relatives idiot! I visit America frequently. I love the place and love the people. Your politics is truly fucked up, and that's saying something because it's a disaster here as well. The difference between you and us, is that it's politics and we'll eventually come together. You lot? I'm not optimistic. Particularly when I have to listen to the shit people like you spew. Trump is a symptom of your politics, not the cause. If I were to lay the blame on anyone it would probably be Gingrich but the truth is that, that assessment probably wouldn't be fair. It was messed up before that, he just exposed it

 

[Federberg]

this is awesome!

 

[Moxie]

Cali, you really do take this "politics-as-blood-sport" and "win-at-all-cost" thing too far. No one wants people to die. No one wants a recession that will hurt us all just to win an election. Expressing caution about a palliative or "cure" is not people hoping it won't work, and certainly not to just screw Trump. But when Trump first talked it up, it sparked a hoarding of these medicines by health care providers (in some cases) to the point of those who actively need them for their intended purposes worried about not having access to them due to shortage. This is an example of Trump's scatter-shot method of putting out information without proper consultation from those who know better. I don't think his approach to this this crisis has been coherent, timely or considered enough. He's been contradictory, misleading and late on many things. For many, this doesn't inspire either confidence or effective action. The man thrives in chaos, and no we're all suffering from it, not just his staff and various departments of government.

 

[Moxie]

I hope everyone watches this. Useful distinctions. But I would also hope that a side-benefit, when this is all over, is that people take getting their flu shots more seriously. I don't understand why some people resist it, but I'd wager that some of those same people will be clamoring for the Covid-19 shot, when it gets manufactured.

 

[Moxie]

Here is an interesting article on how nuanced the counting is country by country.

Spain and other countries count coronavirus death tolls differently and the numbers may be misleading, experts warn - Olive Press News Spain

Covid-19 death figures are incomplete

www.theolivepress.es

This is such an interesting article. One can see why the choices in Italy can over-report, (though I'm not clear what @Federberg means by "malfeasance." And I don't get why the UK thinks they need the family's permission to add their dead to the statistics.

Completely overwhelmed with work and other issues here so I cannot contribute and not even read properly -- that will go on for a few days I'm afraid. Just one thing, I have seen that extensive testing has been discussed. Yes, it is a big effort, but there are more benefits than just tracking the cases.

1) Contain asymptomatic patients -- right now evidence points that they can transmit the virus, even before showing the symptoms;
2) Do proper statistics -- this is vital, because models rely on data, and if your data sucks, your models are useless. You need to have a decent random sample of the population being tested, so you can use it to cross examine your full data and feed the models with some meaningful number. Otherwise your projections mean close to zilch. Just look at South Korea graphs. They are smooth for a reason.

Take care folks.

As to the #1, I think we did already knew that asymptomatic people could likely spread the virus. That's not unusual. And Federberg's video about flu v. Covid tells us how problematic that is, given that the incubation period is long.

2.) Yes, proper statistics are vital, but there are clearly different choices being made, in terms of how deaths are categorized, by country. A lot of this will shake out better in the end than what we're seeing now. Hopefully good records are being kept so that we can determine how and why people died. This is the crux. There is a lot of talk about "underlying conditions," which is important. Or old folks dying. But clearly the Covid virus is killing people that wouldn't necessarily have died now. There can be no controversy that the virus is killing many thousands of people, right now. And we are approaching the 1 million mark, however you count it. What will be interesting to learn, down the road, when we're all more immunized from COVID-19, either by exposure or vaccine, will be to ask the question of how many died because the healthcare system was simply overloaded? How unprepared were we for pandemic? How many deaths were part of this kind of a virus swarm, and how many were preventable?

We'll miss your voice, @mrzz, while you're working hard. Drop in when you can.

 

[calitennis127]

Cali, you really do take this "politics-as-blood-sport" and "win-at-all-cost" thing too far. No one wants people to die. No one wants a recession that will hurt us all just to win an election. Expressing caution about a palliative or "cure" is not people hoping it won't work, and certainly not to just screw Trump.

That might be the case for you personally Moxie. I know that you love New York (albeit partially for BS ideological reasons), but there is no question that you love the city and the people there and you are depressed at the condition your city is in at the moment. I am not questioning you personally in this case. However, you don't represent every single Democrat in the United States. Watching the media almost constantly in recent weeks I have seen talking head after talking head grinning and salivating over how this whole episode has the potential to ruin Trump's re-election chances. Maybe you as a depressed New Yorker are not thinking that way, but there are many people who are thinking like that.

But when Trump first talked it up, it sparked a hoarding of these medicines by health care providers (in some cases) to the point of those who actively need them for their intended purposes worried about not having access to them due to shortage.

Where is your evidence that there was a hoarding of these medicines?

I don't think his approach to this this crisis has been coherent, timely or considered enough. He's been contradictory, misleading and late on many things.

And so have Dr. Fauci, the CDC, and numerous leading Democrats, especially in the state of New York. Why are you singling out Trump as if he is an all-powerful god who controls everything that happens in the United States? Why can't you criticize Dr. Fauci for being contradictory at times when he certainly has been? Why can't you criticize the numerous Democratic officials (including Pelosi, De Blasio, and Oxiris Barbot) who were all very late to taking coronavirus seriously?

 

[calitennis127]

I have American relatives idiot! I visit America frequently. I love the place and love the people. Your politics is truly fucked up, and that's saying something because it's a disaster here as well. The difference between you and us, is that it's politics and we'll eventually come together.

I agree that America is profoundly and viciously divided. However, the irony here is that Trump himself has tried to be bipartisan in this case. Here is the latest example. Words from California Democratic governor Gavin Newsom:

 

[calitennis127]

This is an example of Trump's scatter-shot method of putting out information without proper consultation from those who know better. I don't think his approach to this this crisis has been coherent, timely or considered enough. He's been contradictory, misleading and late on many things. For many, this doesn't inspire either confidence or effective action. The man thrives in chaos, and no we're all suffering from it, not just his staff and various departments of government.

Apparently Gavin Newsom doesn't entirely agree with you:

 

[Moxie]

Apparently Gavin Newsom doesn't entirely agree with you:

A point you liked so much, you decided to make it twice. I believe I have said before that Trump's ego is so fragile that it wants stroking. If you want something from the Fed, compliment the Cheetoh in Chief. This is proof of nothing.

 

[calitennis127]

You can just introduce things into the conversation without an accusation that no one else thought of it first. OK? Can we make a pact on that?

Sure, but in this case I do find it absurd that there has been hardly any discussion at all of China, despite this being an international board. Look at Federbergy and the Lebanese sloppy sloth. They can tee off on Trump or "America" day and night (which is their prerogative), but they can't utter a single critical peep about a government which is clearly corrupting the WHO and which clearly misrepresented the severity of the crisis to the United States and other countries. It's even possible that the Chinese government sent large numbers of Wuhan residents to foreign countries after the January 23rd shutdown of Wuhan in order to have them take the virus anywhere but China. Why is this kind of scumbag behavior hardly brought up? It's funny that you are condemning me for a "win-at-all-costs" political mentality when the Chinese government epitomizes it.

And we have hardly even begun to scratch the surface of just how much China has corrupted the WHO.....which reminds me of this fitting new nickname assigned to it by Japan's Deputy Prime Minister: