Warming up to USO

[GameSetAndMath]

Washington DC used to be men's and women's event. Did they change it recently?

 

[the AntiPusher]

Rafa seems to be in trouble. Lost the first set, but up in second set.

If he needs three sets against ( sock, harris etc) this kind of players, it does not bode well for his USO chances.

No. Rafa played fantastic. Harris was the more aggressive player and deserved to the W. Congratulations to him..Rafa only had 11 UFEs in 3 sets..That tells me all he needs is more matches to play more aggressively.. He got what he wanted..a few matches and now onward to Toronto..Very good day for Rafa fans..he moved well and hit unloaded his full arsenal..only the return of service was below average..Vamos

 

[Fiero425]

No. Rafa played fantastic. Harris was the more aggressive player and deserved to the W. Congratulations to him..Rafa only had 11 UFEs in 3 sets..That tells me all he needs is more matches to play more aggressively.. He got what he wanted..a few matches and now onward to Toronto..Very good day for Rafa fans..he moved well and hit unloaded his full arsenal..only the return of service was below average..Vamos

A few matches is equivalent to 2 now? When did that happen? Rafa did spend enough time on the court for a few going 3 sets twice!

 

[the AntiPusher]

No. Rafa played fantastic. Harris was the more aggressive player and deserved to the W. Congratulations to him..Rafa only had 11 UFEs in 3 sets..That tells me all he needs is more matches to play more aggressively.. He got what he wanted..a few matches and now onward to Toronto..Very good day for Rafa fans..he moved well and hit unloaded his full arsenal..only the return of service was below average..Vamos

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[Moxie]

Rafa seems to be in trouble. Lost the first set, but up in second set.

If he needs three sets against ( sock, harris etc) this kind of players, it does not bode well for his USO chances.

He's having foot trouble, which has been an issue a good deal of his career. He hasn't played tennis in two months. I know you want it not to "bode well," but I'd give it some more time before I sounded the alarm.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Wow, I left in the middle of second set. I thought, as usual Ralph will come back and eke out a win in three sets. I am just learning that he could not even do that. But, good that he played well despite losing. Also, he says his foot issue is improving.

But, seriously the field was very weak and it was Rafa's tourney to lose and he did.

 

[Fiero425]

Wow, I left in the middle of second set. I thought, as usual Ralph will come back and eke out a win in three sets. I am just learning that he could not even do that. But, good that he played well despite losing. Also, he says his foot issue is improving.

But, seriously the field was very weak and it was Rafa's tourney to lose and he did.

I didn't watch much of the match last night, but just saw a clip or 2 where Rafa was obviously struggling to get around! Why is he here? This makes no sense! Did he really think he could get away with reputation enough to get thru this weak field? The worst of them, SOCK took him to the limit and Harrs finished him off! Rafa was literally sitting there looking as if he was going to break down and cry!

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Some tournaments have wised up and sign a "performance backed appearance fee". That is instead of giving a lumpsum, they make it dependent on how far the player goes in the tournament. Not sure whether DC did that to Rafa.

This is a good strategy for the tournaments as if a star player gets appearance fee and loses in the opening round, then the tourney may not be selling lot of tickets for the remaining matches which they were hoping in view of the star power.

 

[Fiero425]

Some tournaments have wised up and sign a "performance backed appearance fee". That is instead of giving a lumpsum, they make it dependent on how far the player goes in the tournament. Not sure whether DC did that to Rafa.

This is a good strategy for the tournaments as if a star player gets appearance fee and loses in the opening round, then the tourney may not be selling lot of tickets for the remaining matches which they were hoping in view of the star power.

It was a long time coming! Back in the day, whenever a top seed went out early in smaller tournaments to lesser players, you always had to figure the aggreement was to just show up; not stay all week glad-handing with the locals when they're international stars! I don't care how humble they can come off, after a certain point it's easy to become an elitist snob that want to keep us at arm's length! I read years ago that Borg would rather air out on bed with the curtains drawn trying to come down from the concentration it took to get thru matches against hardcore S & V'rs! We had a men's event here in Chicago! Lendl was the top seed and back then tickets would usually fall into my lap! He was gone before I had a chance to see him outside of practice! He was gone 1st day, 2nd RD., Wed. to some nobody! There was appearance money that Graf was getting (by way of her crooked father), but she at least went all out to win!

 

[GameSetAndMath]

My point is that I think we know more than they do, about the more subtle issues. I don't think that bookies' notion that Novak's chances are 4x that of Rafa's means anything. Rafa has a better record at the USO than Novak, 4-3. He'll come in more rested, and he has a better h2h than Novak there, in the big moments. 4 times as likely to win, Novak? I think that's a stretch. Because you have to admit, of the two, the more likely for early upset is Novak, based on pressure, his admitted stress and burn out. Your bookies just don't look at those subtleties.

Well, with all the foot issues, I think the bookies numbers turns out to be correct. If at all Novak is taken out, it won't be by Rafa. Rafa won't last that long in the tournament to meet Novak.

 

[tented]

Well, with all the foot issues, I think the bookies numbers turns out to be correct. If at all Novak is taken out, it won't be by Rafa. Rafa won't last that long in the tournament to meet Novak.

Agreed. Rafa hasn’t beaten Novak on a hard court since their 2013 USO final, eight years ago. I’d say the writing was on the wall.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Agreed. Rafa hasn’t beaten Novak on a hard court since their 2013 USO final, eight years ago. I’d say the writing was on the wall.

Wow, didn't realize it was that long ago!

 

[tented]

Wow, didn't realize it was that long ago!

He may not have even won a set since then, but I’m not positive. Maybe one or two, tops.

EDIT: I checked. Nope, not a single set since 2013.

 

[Fiero425]

He may not have even won a set since then, but I’m not positive. Maybe one or two, tops.

EDIT: I checked. Nope, not a single set since 2013.

Rafa was scratching for games at Aussie Open Final 2 yrs ago in '19! This was when Rafa at his heights, holding serve 60+ straight times!

 

[tented]

Rafa was scratching for games at Aussie Open Final 2 yrs ago in '19! This was when Rafa at his heights, holding serve 60+ straight times!

 

[GameSetAndMath]

After losing the second round match at Washington DC, Rafa said that even though he lost he was happy that he is improving and the foot situation is becoming better. That was a plain lie. If it was becoming better, he would not have withdrawn from Toronto.

I am not really blaming or accusing Rafa for lying as he had to do that in order to not put himself at a competitive disadvantage. He is not the only person to lie in similar situations as well.

The point that I am trying to drive at is that we should all take what these folks say in pressers with a grain of salt.

 

[tented]

After losing the second round match at Washington DC, Rafa said that even though he lost he was happy that he is improving and the foot situation is becoming better. That was a plain lie. If it was becoming better, he would not have withdrawn from Toronto.

Getting better isn’t always a straight line, in one direction. Things can feel better one day, then worse the next for various reasons, including re-injuring it.

I am not really blaming or accusing Rafa for lying

You just did. Who are you kidding?

The point that I am trying to drive at is that we should all take what these folks say in pressers with a grain of salt.

Including Federer.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Agreed. Rafa hasn’t beaten Novak on a hard court since their 2013 USO final, eight years ago. I’d say the writing was on the wall.

What is Rafa's overall hard court record since that 2013 final?

 

[tented]

What is Rafa's overall hard court record since that 2013 final?

Hard courts stats from 2014-2021:

Wins - 146
Losses - 38
Winning percentage: 79%

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Even in withdrawing from the Masters Tourney, Fed is the leader. He did it first and Nadovic simply followed.