US Politics Thread

[Moxie]

RIP John McCain. One who did reach across the aisle and a war hero. I didn't always agree with him, but respected him. How our politics have devolved in such a short time.

 

[Federberg]

RIP John McCain. One who did reach across the aisle and a war hero. I didn't always agree with him, but respected him. How our politics have devolved in such a short time.

A great great man. RIP...

And as for Trump... a little man with small hands...

 

[Federberg]

So there's a New York Times Op-Ed piece that's come out from a senior member of the Trump Administration indicating that there are people working close to Trump who are protecting the country from the President's worst instincts. This might shock folks but I agree with Trump. This person is GUTLESS! By their actions they are softening the edges of the Trump Presidency and increasing the likelihood that he might win another term. What has happened to this world. I recall a time where senior members of government who dissented would resign and give their reasons for doing so. This person might think they are doing the right thing but this is the very definition of cowardice. This is not a time to protect your job. You are not being patriotic. You should have the guts to stand up, make yourself known. Be a fucking adult ffs...

 

[britbox]

So there's a New York Times Op-Ed piece that's come out from a senior member of the Trump Administration indicating that there are people working close to Trump who are protecting the country from the President's worst instincts. This might shock folks but I agree with Trump. This person is GUTLESS! By their actions they are softening the edges of the Trump Presidency and increasing the likelihood that he might win another term. What has happened to this world. I recall a time where senior members of government who dissented would resign and give their reasons for doing so. This person might think they are doing the right thing but this is the very definition of cowardice. This is not a time to protect your job. You are not being patriotic. You should have the guts to stand up, make yourself known. Be a fucking adult ffs...

Disagree. It's smart. They are in a position of influence and use it. If they quit then they have no influence and become irrelevant. The revolving door at the White House has already shown that quitting or getting fired has made no difference.

 

[Federberg]

Disagree. It's smart. They are in a position of influence and use it. If they quit then they have no influence and become irrelevant. The revolving door at the White House has already shown that quitting or getting fired has made no difference.

if you're looking at this current administration in isolation then I can see why you might think so. But when you consider the presidency as an institution this is not good at all. There are precedents being established now that might be impossible to recover. The whole thing is entropic. I'm even disturbed by the military seeming to disregard some of his orders. Where does it end? No. I'm convinced this is wrong

 

[britbox]

if you're looking at this current administration in isolation then I can see why you might think so. But when you consider the presidency as an institution this is not good at all. There are precedents being established now that might be impossible to recover. The whole thing is entropic. I'm even disturbed by the military seeming to disregard some of his orders. Where does it end? No. I'm convinced this is wrong

Which orders are you talking about? The one floating around about killing Assad?

Also, which precedents?

 

[britbox]

Anyway, as it stands, if Trump is still around going into the 2020 Presidential elections, I think he wins again. His approval ratings right now are 40-44%. Put him on the campaign trail and he'll do enough to win. The problem that the Dems have is that their whole machine is just based on anti-Trump hysteria, nothing to note on policy and nobody of any substance to stand up to the plate.

 

[Federberg]

Which orders are you talking about? The one floating around about killing Assad?

Also, which precedents?

not just that one. Remember the trans-gender thing? I can understand Mattis disregarding the assassination order. That was illegal...

 

[britbox]

not just that one. Remember the trans-gender thing? I can understand Mattis disregarding the assassination order. That was illegal...

Illegal? When did that stop the US from assassinating leaders before? It's part of the CIA playbook.

 

[Federberg]

Anyway, as it stands, if Trump is still around going into the 2020 Presidential elections, I think he wins again. His approval ratings right now are 40-44%. Put him on the campaign trail and he'll do enough to win. The problem that the Dems have is that their whole machine is just based on anti-Trump hysteria, nothing to note on policy and nobody of any substance to stand up to the plate.

it's interesting you say that. It seems to be a common trope from the media you like to criticise, so some interesting cross pollination there. The evidence from primaries and special elections is quite the contrary. The focus seems to be about pocket book issues and Dems are winning handily doing so. Of course the leadership still seems fantastically incompetent so who knows how much of a hindrance they'll be. The problem with these predictions that Trump can or will win again is that a couple of things are different this time. (1) he won't be campaigning against the most historically unpopular candidate in US election history (2) he will be a known element, and he's done nothing to grow his base, in fact he's done everything to increase the number of the die-hard opposition.

Last time he won with assistance from Russians, Comey and being the new kid on the block. He won't have any of those things going for him next time

 

[Federberg]

Illegal? When did that stop the US from assassinating leaders before? It's part of the CIA playbook.

do I need to point out that he made the request to Mattis? Defence Secretary mate. If he had wanted it done the way you're suggesting it would have been Pompeo at the time. Different gravy.... and with no plausible deniability it would have been an illegal act

 

[britbox]

it's interesting you say that. It seems to be a common trope from the media you like to criticise, so some interesting cross pollination there. The evidence from primaries and special elections is quite the contrary. The focus seems to be about pocket book issues and Dems are winning handily doing so. Of course the leadership still seems fantastically incompetent so who knows how much of a hindrance they'll be. The problem with these predictions that Trump can or will win again is that a couple of things are different this time. (1) he won't be campaigning against the most historically unpopular candidate in US election history (2) he will be a known element, and he's done nothing to grow his base, in fact he's done everything to increase the number of the die-hard opposition.

Last time he won with assistance from Russians, Comey and being the new kid on the block. He won't have any of those things going for him next time

The Russians didn't win the election for Trump even if there was collusion. The leadership is incompetent but so are the Dems. It'll be interesting to see who they put up... because while you've likely seen the bottom of the barrel with Trump, rest assured the opposite guy in the race will need to be squeaky clean, robust and charismatic. Trump should probably be on 20% right now but the fact he isn't and people aren't paying much attention to mainstream media has to be worrying for you.

 

[Federberg]

The Russians didn't win the election for Trump even if there was collusion. The leadership is incompetent but so are the Dems. It'll be interesting to see who they put up... because while you've likely seen the bottom of the barrel with Trump, rest assured the opposite guy in the race will need to be squeaky clean, robust and charismatic. Trump should probably be on 20% right now but the fact he isn't and people aren't paying much attention to mainstream media has to be worrying for you.

With the greatest of respect you don't know the empirical impact of the Trump campaign's conspiracy with Russian, so let's just establish that right now. You can make all the declarative statements you want, but it makes you sound as credible as the orange one...

Lol! Worrying for me? He has an intractable base. That's dialed in. You keep talking about 2020. I've got news for you, the only thing that matters right now is the mid-terms. I haven't a clue what happens in 2020. But if the Dems win the House, then Trump is in for such a world of hurt, he may well not bother running. For the record, I've said time and time again, impeaching him would be a terrible idea. There are so many things to investigate and expose. I firmly believe that revealing his true financial state will be one of the things to smash through to his base. It's going to be entertaining if the Dems get the House.

 

[britbox]

I said if he's still around in 2020... Well aware of the potential scenarios. If they want to take Trump they'd be better off through subpeonas than direct impeachment.

 

[britbox]

With the greatest of respect you don't know the empirical impact of the Trump campaign's conspiracy with Russian, so let's just establish that right now.

And neither do you mate.

 

[Federberg]

And neither do you mate.

Lol! You're the one who keeps making declarative statements not me. Check yourself!

 

[britbox]

Lol. "Last time he won with assistance from Russians" - Looks pretty declarative to me old bean.

 

[Federberg]

Lol. "Last time he won with assistance from Russians" - Looks pretty declarative to me old bean.

I stand by that. That is proven! We watched it in real time.

That's a sight different from your bit..."The Russians didn't win the election for Trump even if there was collusion."

I merely talk about the Russkies assisting. You talk about them winning the whole thing for him! Big difference

 

[britbox]

I stand by that. That is proven! We watched it in real time.

That's a sight different from your bit..."The Russians didn't win the election for Trump even if there was collusion."

I merely talk about the Russkies assisting. You talk about them winning the whole thing for him! Big difference

Well, let's skip around the sparring and ask the question...\

Did the Russians make the difference between winning and losing?

I'd say no.

 

[Federberg]

Well, let's skip around the sparring and ask the question...\

Did the Russians make the difference between winning and losing?

I'd say no.

Haha! Money Mayweather!

Ok I'll play along...

I've always stated that the decisive blow was Comey. But the Russkies sure softened her up with the Wikileaks stuff and what we've now seen from the social media attacks. There is simply no question about it. But Comey was the one...