US Politics Thread

Federberg

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Remember back when we were reading about Stormy Daniels, the playboy model and Summer Zervos? And the experts were all saying that the most worrisome one for Trump was Zervos? We've been so caught up by the pornstar that we could easily be forgiven for forgetting about this. Now Summer Zervos has been granted the right to push ahead with discovery. She's going for Apprentice film from MGM, and will force Trump to testify. I swear this is as entertaining as GoT! ::sw1:::popcorn
 

Federberg

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Oh good grief. Another school shooting. More politicians coming out with "thoughts and prayers" no doubt
 

Horsa

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Oh good grief. Another school shooting. More politicians coming out with "thoughts and prayers" no doubt
It's dreadful. There are so many bad things happening in the world today I don't know what to say anymore as there are only so many times you can say I'm very sorry to hear about that & I'll be thinking about all the families of victims & my thoughts are with the families of victims. I don't mention prayers because I'm an atheist. My point is that although you feel for the families of victims & think the events are terrible there comes a point where you just don't know what to say anymore & it renders you speechless.
 

monfed

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America's dumb gun laws need to change. Why does anyone need more than a pistol to defend himself? The founding fathers didn't know maniacs with semi-automatics would be roaming around shooting kids in school or else that 2nd amendment wouldn't have happened. Times change and rules need to adapt to them.
 

monfed

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The NRA is basically a terrorist organisation and until that disgusting thing isn't disbanded these gun crimes will never stop. This gun culture creates so much fear within people that they can't live freely. Ironic that a country that claims about being free can lose their lives by speaking something that someone doesn't like.
 

Federberg

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@britbox I remember discussing Benghazi with you back in the halcyon days when Trump wasn't President. You mentioned that one of your most fundamental issues with HRC and her Benghazi and email issues was that her negligence could put others at risk.

I wonder, when you see what's going on now with Trump trying to out intelligence sources how you feel about HRC in comparison to Trump. What she might (even though over 10 Republican initiated investigations to date haven't turned anything up) have done compared to what Trump is very overtly trying to do. I'm truly curious to hear your views given this evolving situation...
 

britbox

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@britbox I wonder, when you see what's going on now with Trump trying to out intelligence sources

I don't really understand the sentence, so you'll have to elaborate... but with HRC, Benghazi was one of many things dating back over a number of years that fuelled my personal dislike of her. I'm not particularly tribal about politics... I can dislike or like people from opposing parties with equal abandon.
 

Federberg

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I don't really understand the sentence, so you'll have to elaborate... but with HRC, Benghazi was one of many things dating back over a number of years that fuelled my personal dislike of her. I'm not particularly tribal about politics... I can dislike or like people from opposing parties with equal abandon.

An FBI informant was in contact with officials in the Trump campaign during the election. This guy is considered a valuable asset and has been instrumental in national security situations over the years. Trump and Nunes have pretty much forced this person into the open now. Their narrative is that he was inserted into the campaign as a spy, in order to smear them. The reality is that once intelligence agencies began to hear about Russian interest in the Trump campaign, they asked this informant to reach out to some Trump officials and find out anything he could. This guy is still involved in other national security situations. This is like another Valerie Plame type thing. I'm just wondering how you feel about that when you specifically brought up HRC's careless handling of classified information. This is overt, while Hillary could be accused of negligence...
 

britbox

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It's a totally different scenario... you're comparing apples and oranges. Most of the stuff I mentioned about HRC was her bypassing internal standards and communicating classified information via her own personal servers from her basement... and then playing dumb. But on the FBI note, wasn't Trump ridiculed at the time for suggesting he was under FBI surveillance?

Comparing an FBI mole and a CIA mole are also two different things, so the Plame thing isn't valid either... you're talking about a spy in a local theatre of risk who might have his cover blown and need to be withdrawn against a spy working in a foreign theatre, where their life or liberty may be at risk... and the people they handle. OK, there is a probably a bit of an overlap in role and risk but there is a difference. There is also a discrete difference between compromising an overseas US spy over somebody spying on you personally... surely you must see that even beyond your hatred of Trump.
 

Federberg

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It's a totally different scenario... you're comparing apples and oranges. Most of the stuff I mentioned about HRC was her bypassing internal standards and communicating classified information via her own personal servers from her basement... and then playing dumb. But on the FBI note, wasn't Trump ridiculed at the time for suggesting he was under FBI surveillance?

Comparing an FBI mole and a CIA mole are also two different things, so the Plame thing isn't valid either... you're talking about a spy in a local theatre of risk who might have his cover blown and need to be withdrawn against a spy working in a foreign theatre, where their life or liberty may be at risk... and the people they handle. OK, there is a probably a bit of an overlap in role and risk but there is a difference. There is also a discrete difference between compromising an overseas US spy over somebody spying on you personally... surely you must see that even beyond your hatred of Trump.

Lol! It's not really apples and oranges mate. You're being pedantic. I never implied they were exactly the same, just the outcomes could be similar. They both highlight similar ethical and operational issues/risks. And by the way, all of the stuff HRC has been accused of with personal servers are being done in the WH right now.

I noticed you never answered my question. For the life of me I don't understand why, it's not a right or wrong issue. I'm simply curious about whether you condone Trump's actions. Surely that's not too difficult to answer?

And to answer your last question... you have one scenario where there was an outside chance of compromising US intelligence (HRC email server), an outside chance. Something that never happened. And in the other, you have a US President explicitly trying to out an informant, with potential collateral damage to other assets and US national security. And for political reasons no less. Not because the guy actually spied on him (you're completely off base there), but because Trump is trying to win in the court of public opinion
 

britbox

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You did imply they were similar, otherwise why package them together?

Wikileaks leaked stuff from HRC. It happened.

What US assets and security are you are claiming are compromised by Trump outing somebody who spied on him? Himself?? I wouldn't have thought you would class him as an asset.
 

Federberg

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You did imply they were similar, otherwise why package them together?

Wikileaks leaked stuff from HRC. It happened.

What US assets and security are you are claiming are compromised by Trump outing somebody who spied on him? Himself?? I wouldn't have thought you would class him as an asset.

Different circumstances, but similar worst case outcomes. The stuff Wikileaks got was not from the server being compromised. Let's not revise history.

Again you go with spy imputation. This informant is someone who is embedded in more than one active national security issue, which Trump had to be aware of. I know you're just trying to be obtuse and avoid giving an answer. I guess that's information of a sort. Thank you :)
 

Federberg

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The answer? No, I feel no differently about HRC now than I did then.
Lol! No, my question was whether what Trump is trying to do affects how you feel about him. Who cares about HRC? :D
 

GameSetAndMath

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Whatever the truth may be, Trump has now successfully created an appearance that it is 50/50 case. May be the FBI is wrong and they spied on Trump campaign or May be FBI was right and Trump campaign was colluding. Forgetting all the ethical aspects, this is politically a master move. Now apart from the "basket of deplorables", Trump might even get renewed support from about half of the independents who are sitting in the middle. :clap:

The important aspect of this extra support is that if the republican party can maintain their majority in house, the impeachment proceeding s will not even start. Given that Muller is likely not to indict Trump, as long as Trump can avoid impeachment he will be the boss. For that he needs to ensure that majority in congress does not change after the 2018 elections.
 
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Federberg

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^ I definitely agree that in the absence of anything from Mueller it certainly seems that way. It's easy for Trump and Guiliani to push the no collusion, and impugning the Justice Department. But let's wait and see what the public thinks when the next round of indictments happen. I have to believe the reason why Rosenstein succumbed to the GOP is because he knows something big is coming very soon
 

Horsa

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Is the news I've just heard about Donald Trump no longer being able to block people on twitter true, do you know? If it is he's going to get some right hassle because although there are some right gems on twitter there are some very obnoxious, abusive people on there too & some who want to talk dirty & show explicit pictures & ask you personal questions & want you to show them your personal explicit pictures or preach. I just block them. Without the block function you'd get right hassle. I make good use of the report function too.
 
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