I hope Serena plays. People will hold her in higher esteem for her willingness to forgive. She is transforming herself into a gracious person worthy of being called the GOAT. She is much more likable now than when she was younger. As she nears the end of her career, decisions like these will add to her legacy.
Serena to play Indian Wells again
- Thread starter GameSetAndMath
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10sfan said:
Yea her willingness to forgive - how about others willingness to forgive her. I have to say I always liked Serena, from the time she stepped foot on a tennis court. Serena really does not need to step foot on any court at IW ever again......Going back to a place that treated her like crap would bring back the worse memories for her because she will feel that it would happen again, I don't care if she's the #1 player or if she has 17 majors I don't think she would every forget that experience. Up to this day I cannot watch that match. I know one thing that's the tournament that re-enforced Serena's mental toughness.
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special700 said:
You are confusing between forgiving and forgetting. It is possible to forgive without
forgetting.
Do you think Nelson Mandela forgot all the injustice done to him by getting some sort
of Amnesia? He for sure remembered everything, but choose to forgive.
That's Nelson Mandela. And I am not confusing anything. People always say it is possible to forgive without forgetting, I do not know who came up with that, but I do not believe that for one moment because each time I see that person who did that wrong to me I will always remember the wrong and that so call forgiveness that I thought I had is going to go right out the window because it is going to bring back very, very bad memories. And that's just how I feel about it.
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special700 said:
When I say, it is possible all that I am saying is that it can be done in principle.
I am no way implying that it is easy task to forgive.
If at all there is any relation between forgiving and forgetting, forgiving has to
come first. If you actually forget, there is nothing to forgive. If you forgive, over time
it may be possible to forget as well.
10sfan said:
She is worthy of being called the GOAT because
she is the best player that ever was and deserves it.
Not because she utters platitudes to her opponents
( mean it or not )
or may play an event that treated her like dirt.
If she means forgiveness or is just enhancing her legacy
its her business. But I ran out of cheeks a long time ago
my sherona said:
Sometimes your delusions are funny and sometimes annoying like this comment but I guess I will always treat your comments lightly
RJD11 said:
Amen RJD - you've said it all. I don't see how going back there will enhance her legacy - she has enough hardware to do that.
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special700 said:
It would sure enhance her legacy. You got to see that legacy has multiple aspects.
Serena's legacy as a tennis player does not depend on whether she plays in IW or not.
But, her legacy as a human being would not certainly go up, if she can forgive and
go there. I am not saying she should go to IW or should not go to IW. That is her
decision to make. But, I do certainly believe that if she chooses to forgive and goes
there, it would surely enhance her personal legacy (especially as both you and
me know, it is not easy to forgive for most ordinary people).
On the personal front, she does have some shortcomings as evidence by the
USO referee incident and some others. But, I don't want to open that pandora box
again. Besides, nobody is perfect.
GameSetAndMath said:
I would love to know what other accidents you are referring too. How about mentioning all the wrongs that were done to her and she never said a word she just went on her way and about her business. I bet you would never mention those. You know they are only so many times that we can turn the other cheek. In Serena's 15 yrs on the WTA she had one blow up in her stellar career and you all never let her forget it and yet you never mentioned all the crap that that was done to her. Like I said she does not need IW. As a matter of fact they need her more than she need them.
JesuslookslikeBorg
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GameSetAndMath said:
shortcomings as evidence by the
USO referee incident and some others
Shortcomings? I don't see the USO incident as a shortcoming.
I see that as the straw that broke the Camels back. She should
be lauded for her restraint. Let's open Pandora's box. I see other
players colluding to " stop " the Williams Sisters early in their career.
(Dav and Hingis ). I see Dementieva possibly causing the IW incident
with her baseless accusations. I see Serena being cheated out of
a possible FO title cause the ref didn't see Henin raise her hand ( isn't
that his job ). I see her having to withdraw from the AO cause the
officials would not grant her an extra day for an injury when they did it
for another player the year before which may have cost her the calender
year grand slam. I see the sprem incident at Wimb when the ref got the
score wrong. ( once again isn't that his job ). I see Larry Scott
implementing rules to force the Sisters to do what he wants. I see the
tour introducing heavier balls that Serena said hurt her arm. I see
all the events " slowing " the courts down in recent years. I see
a USO ref and her co-horts with many bad calls costing Serena another
USO title. ( Alvez & Co ). And then I see that Ref with a Foot fault call
on the most important point of the match. One of many foot fault calls
on the Williams Sisters in that USO when they had no previous history
of excessive foot fault previously. Remember the challenge system that
resulted from the Alvez thing prevented regular bad calls. And I see
the Williams Sisters who have never cheated anyone or displayed bad
sportsmanship in their career except in the minds of the media and anti-
fans who call them arrogant because the didn't kiss the === of the
girls they beat fair and square. So yes I think she showed great
restraint by not shoving a tennis ball after all those years of Sherona's
card playing shoved in her face. I think her legacy as a player and
human being is secure. Especially after the horrendous IW thing
as a 19 year old child trying to be the best she could. She showed
a lot of courage that day. That alone shows a worthy legacy
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A laundry list of grievances (independent of whether they are legitimate or not) does
not justify bad behavior. If you think Serena should be commended for actually not
shoving the balls and stopping at mere threatening of the official, I do not see much
point in debating with you.
not justify bad behavior. If you think Serena should be commended for actually not
shoving the balls and stopping at mere threatening of the official, I do not see much
point in debating with you.
GameSetAndMath said:
I am not justifying bad behavior. Serena was wrong to do
what she did. And She admitted it:
She wrote: “Hey guys!!! I want to amend my press statement of yesterday, and want to make it clear as possible — I want to sincerely apologize FIRST to the lineswoman, Kim Clijsters, the USTA, and tennis fans everywhere for my inappropriate outburst. I’m a woman of great pride, faith and integrity, and I admit when I’m wrong.
“I need to make it clear to all young people that I handled myself inappropriately and it’s not the way to act — win or lose, good call or bad call in any sport, in any manner. I like to lead by example. We all learn from experiences both good and bad. I will learn and grow from this, and be a better person as a result.â€
And IMO she has, considering her behavior since.
But I'm saying I understand why she did it
All of those things contributed to the frustrations she and Vee
have carried around for years. Especially for Serena at the USO
Think how She felt after that Alvez match that was taken from
her and here it was happening again. I read an article after the
tourny that she and Venus had been called for a whole lot of
foot faults during the tournament. And they had never been
known for excessive foot faulting. And face it, other players have
done much worse things without nearly as much hoopla as that.
You stated that she threatened the official like its a fact when
since then there have been many threads, articles and debating
about if what she said constituted a threat.
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As I said in my post talking about legacy, I did not really want to go deep into the incident.
But, you are now provoking.
As all of us know, the apology that you were quoting came after two or three different
non apology, pseudo apology and semi apologies. If readers want, they can dig up the
series of statements made by her in successive press conferences after the incident.
People do make mistakes., especially, in the heat of the moment and I am willing
to forgive her. But, if you are not realizing that you made a mistake and apologize
completely and unconditionally (after one has cooled down and had time to think about it),
it is natural for people to wonder whether the final apology is a forced statement
due to the storm or a heart felt apology.
Finally, a lines person cannot take any history into account while making calls.
They have to call it as they see it and that is how the foot fault was called by the
linesperson. How would it be if some linesperson starts thinking that player X usually
gets the serve in when going down the T and therefore whenever he goes down the T,
we will say the serve is in. The linesperson called it as they saw it.
I am not saying that the linesperson is guaranteed to be correct. There are often wrong
calls in sports, in all sports (football, basketball, etc). After all, the linesperson, referee
etc are also human beings and they are prone to make errors. But, that does not mean
they are "ugly inside".
Anyway, to get back on to the track, my main point in that post was that if
Serena forgives the injustices that were done to her at IW (I am not saying she should)
and plays in IW, it would surely enhance her legacy. Do you agree or not?
"Resentment is like drinking poison and then hoping it will kill your enemies." - Nelson Mandela.
But, you are now provoking.
As all of us know, the apology that you were quoting came after two or three different
non apology, pseudo apology and semi apologies. If readers want, they can dig up the
series of statements made by her in successive press conferences after the incident.
People do make mistakes., especially, in the heat of the moment and I am willing
to forgive her. But, if you are not realizing that you made a mistake and apologize
completely and unconditionally (after one has cooled down and had time to think about it),
it is natural for people to wonder whether the final apology is a forced statement
due to the storm or a heart felt apology.
Finally, a lines person cannot take any history into account while making calls.
They have to call it as they see it and that is how the foot fault was called by the
linesperson. How would it be if some linesperson starts thinking that player X usually
gets the serve in when going down the T and therefore whenever he goes down the T,
we will say the serve is in. The linesperson called it as they saw it.
I am not saying that the linesperson is guaranteed to be correct. There are often wrong
calls in sports, in all sports (football, basketball, etc). After all, the linesperson, referee
etc are also human beings and they are prone to make errors. But, that does not mean
they are "ugly inside".
Anyway, to get back on to the track, my main point in that post was that if
Serena forgives the injustices that were done to her at IW (I am not saying she should)
and plays in IW, it would surely enhance her legacy. Do you agree or not?
"Resentment is like drinking poison and then hoping it will kill your enemies." - Nelson Mandela.
Sundaymorningguy
Grand Slam Champion
Either she will or she won't play, but this is one of the few options she has left to earn a lot of points if she is still interested in earning points to pad that ranking aside from Wimbledon. Everywhere else she defends a lot of points.
Were you this adamant to when one of the Bryan bothers his an empire and that entire thing was swept under the rug. Of course not, but we have to remember that Serena is black and whatever she does is magnify 200% and talked about for years.GameSetAndMath said:
