Rolex Shanghai Masters 2018, China

Moxie

Multiple Major Winner
Joined
Apr 14, 2013
Messages
43,700
Reactions
14,876
Points
113
You're just impossibly annoying with this untrue, non-factual arguments, that's all this is. It's like you have a chip on your shoulder or something.

Look , Fed's not played a worst set in his prime (when playing well) than the 2nd set of USO 09 where had won he as he should've, it was curtains for pony.

How arrogant to suggest that Fed losing to his perennial lapdog and fanboy the WTF SF.....Fuck, do you even believe your own bullshit or do you get a kick out of arguing for no reason?
I'm not clear about your argument. You are pounding the table about matches/sets that Roger should have won, but he didn't. He didn't win them, as in: he lost them. That happens. Trying to maintain the position that he should have won matches that he didn't is arrogant, in my opinion. A bit lost in unreality. Also, I would suggest that it's possible the worst set he played was the 2nd set in the '08 Wimbledon.
 

monfed

Major Winner
Joined
Apr 28, 2018
Messages
2,112
Reactions
506
Points
113
I'm not clear about your argument. You are pounding the table about matches/sets that Roger should have won, but he didn't. He didn't win them, as in: he lost them. That happens. Trying to maintain the position that he should have won matches that he didn't is arrogant, in my opinion. A bit lost in unreality. Also, I would suggest that it's possible the worst set he played was the 2nd set in the '08 Wimbledon.

I don't care what you think but Fed blew USO 09 and WTF 17. End of story. You either accept it or you don't, I'm not interested in arguing obvious shit like this. My original point of Fed not being at 22-25 slams by blowing slams like USO 09 stands whether you like it not and congrats for making my arguments out to be what they're not, you seem to be an expert at that.
 
  • Like
Reactions: The_Grand_Slam

lob

Pro Tour Champion
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
386
Reactions
150
Points
43
He's got enough money and always will. He will play as long as he thinks he can be competitive. At this point he is being stubborn right now, he has sucked donkey dick for 7 months and it was time to hit reset and call it a year after USO. Now he is just going through the motions and getting embarrassed instead of rest, relax, and train for 2019. At 37 he could have used a long offseason.

At this point, it doesn't really matter much. He just wants to be relevant. Taking a break would be nice but he wants to win something. Anything.

Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk
 

Moxie

Multiple Major Winner
Joined
Apr 14, 2013
Messages
43,700
Reactions
14,876
Points
113
I don't care what you think but Fed blew USO 09 and WTF 17. End of story. You either accept it or you don't, I'm not interested in arguing obvious shit like this. My original point of Fed not being at 22-25 slams by blowing slams like USO 09 stands whether you like it not and congrats for making my arguments out to be what they're not, you seem to be an expert at that.
Read what you just wrote. You're right and no one else is. Even though Federer lost. Either these are debatable matches, or they're not. You're pretending that there is no debate, in matches that Federer lost. I'm sorry, but the best option for a match that a player lost is debating it, and coming up with mitigating circumstances. Otherwise, he just lost.
 

monfed

Major Winner
Joined
Apr 28, 2018
Messages
2,112
Reactions
506
Points
113
Read what you just wrote. You're right and no one else is. Even though Federer lost. Either these are debatable matches, or they're not. You're pretending that there is no debate, in matches that Federer lost. I'm sorry, but the best option for a match that a player lost is debating it, and coming up with mitigating circumstances. Otherwise, he just lost.

WTF are you rambling about? Do you have OCD like dull?

Fed was set and a break up playing complete shit tennis in the 2nd set of USO 09 against a bloody slam virgin tall ostrich, being the 5 time defending champion and having owned him at AO and beat him at RG too in the same bloody year. No there is nothing to argue about, Fed blew it.

And WTF 17 expecting to beat his lapdog specially after winning the 1st set comprehensively is being arrogant? Go see a shrink or something, you have it bad.
 
  • Like
Reactions: The_Grand_Slam

Moxie

Multiple Major Winner
Joined
Apr 14, 2013
Messages
43,700
Reactions
14,876
Points
113
WTF are you rambling about? Do you have OCD like dull?

Fed was set and a break up playing complete shit tennis in the 2nd set of USO 09 against a bloody slam virgin tall ostrich, being the 5 time defending champion and having owned him at AO and beat him at RG too in the same bloody year. No there is nothing to argue about, Fed blew it.

And WTF 17 expecting to beat his lapdog specially after winning the 1st set comprehensively is being arrogant? Go see a shrink or something, you have it bad.
I'm sorry, but you're doing the woulda-coulda-shoulda that more reasonable Fed fans try to avoid. I can appreciate that you wish that he'd done better, but it doesn't change the outcome. You're moaning very loudly that Roger lost, and trying to make it my fault for pointing that out. That everyone should recognize that he should have won those matches. Sorry for not drinking that Kool-Aid. Or for living in the real world.
 

monfed

Major Winner
Joined
Apr 28, 2018
Messages
2,112
Reactions
506
Points
113
I'm sorry, but you're doing the woulda-coulda-shoulda that more reasonable Fed fans try to avoid. I can appreciate that you wish that he'd done better, but it doesn't change the outcome. You're moaning very loudly that Roger lost, and trying to make it my fault for pointing that out. That everyone should recognize that he should have won those matches. Sorry for not drinking that Kool-Aid. Or for living in the real world.

It's pretty fucking rich for you to call someone arrogant when you're so full of it. Like I said keep living in your delusions, the world doesn't care.
 
  • Like
Reactions: The_Grand_Slam

Moxie

Multiple Major Winner
Joined
Apr 14, 2013
Messages
43,700
Reactions
14,876
Points
113
It's pretty fucking rich for you to call someone arrogant when you're so full of it. Like I said keep living in your delusions, the world doesn't care.
I'm giving you the big shrug now, since you clearly have no response.
 

monfed

Major Winner
Joined
Apr 28, 2018
Messages
2,112
Reactions
506
Points
113
Must say I quite like Coric too and he's really improved and I hope he continues to climb and makes it into the top 10. Would much rather see him there than Zverev who I find completely overrated tbh and he's been pure dung at the slams despite his ranking. Haven't been able to watch any of this tournament and tbh was fully expecting Coric to win given how much Roger has declined this year. Watching the highlights was saddening. Everything was just like a different player. His movement which he's renowned for looked absolutely awful. Return was awful, serve was so so, could have been worse. Tons of errors and any rally that wasn't over soon you just knew Roger was coming net an easy ball or blast it miles wide or long. I know he played 6 hours in 3 matches with little rest, but still. That was really sad to see. He just looks like sad out there himself, just as much as his fans are watching that pale imitation of his former self, wanting hard to play like he used to even at the start of this year but his body and mind just won't let him.

Despite the haters hoping he'll retire, he's gone on record to state he'd like to play at the next Olympics and I've always thought he'd play till 2020 with it being the last Olympics he's likely to participate in, so don't expect him to disappear next year. Yes, that performance today was woeful and looked a lot worse than just 6-4 6-4, which on paper, isn't so bad, but for all the "he should retire nonsense", he still made the semis of a Masters 1000 in his sleep at 37 and playing like complete dog shit, so contemplate that before suggesting he retires. It's not like he lost in the first round. That said, slam winning days and, for that matter, most tournament winning days are over. Many people say write off Roger Federer at your peril, but I have. It's a sad day and if he wins something big again I'll be delighted, but just can't see it at all right now. Can see him even losing to Zverev at the WTF and Zverev shouldn't really be beating him there at all, but the way Roger's playing, I'd expect it. Probably disappoint his home fans at Basel again too. A sad, sad time to be a Federer time and a great day for all the haters. If your favourites are still playing at this age (yes you Nadal and Djokovic fans), I'd expect even worse than this as their games depend way more on movement than Roger's so, be cocky now 'cos we'll remember it when they're like this too. It happens to everyone, especially if they're still playing at 37, which most obviously aren't. At least old Roger Rogered your favourites quite a few times last few years as a geriatric.

I read somewhere that Fed will retire after LC next year. But yes I echo your sentiments in general, its both sad and unthinkable that Fed could decline so sharply after playing out of the world tennis in 2017.

I'm in slight disagreement with your stance on faker and dull not doing well into their thirties because of declined movement because these pushers can just grind down their opponents without much fuss on these slow courts and heavy balls all year round with the "next gen" being totally worthless. Fed didn't get the conditions he needed to win slams at this age and both dull and faker constantly blocking him due to being younger and in their primes so that's where I feel faker and dull will continue winning unfortunately and that's why I feel Fed should've put his slam record beyond reach at 22-25 slams.
 
  • Like
Reactions: The_Grand_Slam

lob

Pro Tour Champion
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
386
Reactions
150
Points
43
I don't care what you think but Fed blew USO 09 and WTF 17. End of story. You either accept it or you don't, I'm not interested in arguing obvious shit like this. My original point of Fed not being at 22-25 slams by blowing slams like USO 09 stands whether you like it not and congrats for making my arguments out to be what they're not, you seem to be an expert at that.
Mon, of course Fed blew several opportunities. But that's Fed. He was hardly an opportunistic player even in his heyday. The slam record means much more to his fans than it does to him. He doesn't kill himself out there. He enjoys himself on the tour. He loves winning but winning is not the only thing for him. He is very normal out there and there is a reason the tour likes him in spite of his celebrity and status.


Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk
 

monfed

Major Winner
Joined
Apr 28, 2018
Messages
2,112
Reactions
506
Points
113
Mon, of course Fed blew several opportunities. But that's Fed. He was hardly an opportunistic player even in his heyday. The slam record means much more to his fans than it does to him. He doesn't kill himself out there. He enjoys himself on the tour. He loves winning but winning is not the only thing for him. He is very normal out there and there is a reason the tour likes him in spite of his celebrity and status.

I agree with you lob but it's still unthinkable to me that a once in a lifetime player like Fed can be overtaken in his own era by a bunch of pushers even with 20 slams. Anyway I won't go offtopic anymore as it's the Shanghai MS thread.
 
  • Like
Reactions: The_Grand_Slam

lob

Pro Tour Champion
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
386
Reactions
150
Points
43
Fed didn't get the conditions he needed to win slams at this age and both dull and faker constantly blocking him due to being younger and in their primes so that's where I feel faker and dull will continue winning unfortunately and that's why I feel Fed should've put his slam record beyond reach at 22-25 slams.

Yes, 'conditions' matter...it's a grinder's world.

Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk
 

Moxie

Multiple Major Winner
Joined
Apr 14, 2013
Messages
43,700
Reactions
14,876
Points
113
Mon, of course Fed blew several opportunities. But that's Fed. He was hardly an opportunistic player even in his heyday. The slam record means much more to his fans than it does to him. He doesn't kill himself out there. He enjoys himself on the tour. He loves winning but winning is not the only thing for him. He is very normal out there and there is a reason the tour likes him in spite of his celebrity and status.


Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk
I think you're wrong if you think he's just having a lark out there. If you don't think winning means a lot to him, you haven't been watching his pressers when he loses. No one wins 20 Majors by just showing up with a lovely game. #Nalbandian #Safin. Federer is anything but normal. He's a world class athlete, and that comes from competitiveness. Fed wouldn't have played Montreal last year or Rotterdam this year if he weren't competitive against his rivals, and aware of the race. And he's absolutely an opportunist. If he weren't, he'd never have won the one RG he has. And I mean that in the best way. Great players are opportunists.
 

Shivashish Sarkar

Major Winner
Joined
Feb 1, 2016
Messages
1,407
Reactions
197
Points
63
Location
Bengaluru, India.
This isn't WWE so certainly players go out with an intention of being as competitive as they can. No doubt about it. If Federer has won 20 slams till now it means he's been good enough for only these many. And, still it's a record. But we Roger fans feel he should have/could have won more. This is unreasonable but natural for a fan.
 

Jelenafan

Multiple Major Winner
Joined
Sep 15, 2013
Messages
3,681
Reactions
5,029
Points
113
Location
California, USA
WTF are you rambling about? Do you have OCD like dull?


And WTF 17 expecting to beat his lapdog specially after winning the 1st set comprehensively is being arrogant? Go see a shrink or something, you have it bad.

Oh the irony...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Moxie

The_Grand_Slam

Masters Champion
Joined
Nov 28, 2017
Messages
604
Reactions
305
Points
63
Yes, 'conditions' matter...it's a grinder's world.

Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk
acbyat.jpg
 

Moxie

Multiple Major Winner
Joined
Apr 14, 2013
Messages
43,700
Reactions
14,876
Points
113
I'm never sure what all of this conversation about the pace of the courts is really about. It is a feature of them, but to what point? Federer fans seem to feel that Roger deserved a quicker overall court speed and has somehow been robbed. I thought Cincy was in the "fast" column. And just to point out, Canada is played in two alternating cities, not just Toronto.
 

The_Grand_Slam

Masters Champion
Joined
Nov 28, 2017
Messages
604
Reactions
305
Points
63
I'm never sure what all of this conversation about the pace of the courts is really about. It is a feature of them, but to what point? Federer fans seem to feel that Roger deserved a quicker overall court speed and has somehow been robbed.

If all Clay surfaces played like variations of Madrid Nadal fans would complain too.;-):

I thought Cincy was in the "fast" column. And just to point out, Canada is played in two alternating cities, not just Toronto.

Cincy uses lighter balls.I just posted the CPI.
 

Mile

Masters Champion
Joined
Nov 11, 2013
Messages
639
Reactions
96
Points
28
Did anyone note Novak shirt, ita Lacoste but on left arm there is Asics logo.