Rogers Cup 2018, Toronto, Canada, ATP Masters

[Horsa]

Thanks, very wise suggestion by BSL & the decision. I also follow it.
On this occasion, I just wanted to test the narcissist's readiness to self-reflect (and got negative reaction), because psychologists have proven that narcissism (even on the very high end of spectrum) does not kill the ability of self-reflection.
At the same time, I wanted to show how to talk honestly to a narcisist, if anyone chooses to. There is no point arguing his opinion and his bad manners because it will only backfire. The only way is to, in the authoritative way, turn his attention to other people's emotions.

You're welcome. It was. Thank you very much for the information. I was going to indulge in a bit of word-play with narcissism & the group of flowers the daffodil belongs to which is the narcissus family of flowers but decided not to.

 

[Horsa]

that rings true with other sports and sporting stars, mox, not just tennis forums. It can be fun and lively stuff provided the anti Nadal, Fed, Djokovic etc are able to rationalize and explain what it is about the player/s they loath that annoys them and are reasonable about it.

In my favourite sport, (equestrian sports) there isn't all this hatred. The main arguments are about whether horse-racing is cruel to horses or not, whether the Grand National should be banned or not, whether show-jumping is cruel or not & whether jockeys & other equestrians should be banned from using whips or not.

 

[DarthFed]

My point whizzed past you by a mile, clearly.

How so? You are complaining that we are assholes when it comes to Nadal. All I'm saying is I can't stand him and am not about to pretend that I do. I say I understand you fine. But that is one of your moves; "I made many good points and you made none" or "you are too stupid to understand what I'm saying"

 

[DarthFed]

Sorry Darth if it's a repeat for you because I had missed the discussions on the topics I emphasised. Can you explain what you mean by Nadal being "not trustworthy" & having "fake personality"?

Nadal at one point was known for fake MTO's to break an opponent's rhythm. To his credit he has stopped doing that for the most part but even now some of the things he does to delay proceedings can qualify as gamesmanship. And I do think he is fake humble (he likes to shower opponents with praise even after he wins to butter them up) find him to be whiny and very self-serving along with his uncle.

 

[Andy22]

Nadal at one point was known for fake MTO's to break an opponent's rhythm. To his credit he has stopped doing that for the most part but even now some of the things he does to delay proceedings can qualify as gamesmanship. And I do think he is fake humble (he likes to shower opponents with praise even after he wins to butter them up) find him to be whiny and very self-serving along with his uncle.

nadal not fake at all he's as real as it gets, just because he does not talk like a dick like federer does not mean he's hiding something, nadal just smarter with that he says man.

 

[Chris Koziarz]

nadal not fake at all he's as real as it gets, just because he does not talk like a dick like federer does not mean he's hiding something, nadal just smarter with that he says man.

Let's save this for fedal wars thread, should we? Fed did not even play here.
I would agree with your point that the manner Nadal talks does not mean he's hiding anything, except that your vulgarism (emphasised) prompts me to down-rate everything you've said.

 

[Chris Koziarz]

Nadal at one point was known for fake MTO's to break an opponent's rhythm. To his credit he has stopped doing that for the most part but even now some of the things he does to delay proceedings can qualify as gamesmanship. And I do think he is fake humble (he likes to shower opponents with praise even after he wins to butter them up) find him to be whiny and very self-serving along with his uncle.

I think everyone's humble can be seen as fake: if you don't like someone you always tend to think he "talks fake". I, a Fed fan like you, who do not like some of Nadal's manners, but who tries to be impartial, did not find Nadal faking or self-contradicting in any of his talks. But faking MTOs is another matter and the serious one (though hard to prove), good to hear Nad learned to control that unfair behaviour.

 

[Andy22]

Let's save this for fedal wars thread, should we? Fed did not even play here.
I would agree with your point that the manner Nadal talks does not mean he's hiding anything, except that your vulgarism (emphasised) prompts me to down-rate everything you've said.

So you agree with me but down-rate that I said based on the way said it, wow man did not know you are a lawyer, or a woman? For me I am going to judge posts on its right or not for me not on the way the post sounds.

 

[Horsa]

So you agree with me but down-rate that I said based on the way said it, wow man did not know you are a lawyer, or a woman? For me I am going to judge posts on its right or not for me not on the way the post sounds.

I don't think Chris meant it like that. I think Chris meant that people normally listen to comments more when they're not put in a way that insults someone. I don't think that warrants people to assume the job of someone. It's not only lawyers who think like that. Anyone who doesn't like intimidation of any form or bad language would think that way too. I'm very sorry @Chris Koziarz for just assuming what you meant.

 

[Andy22]

I don't think Chris meant it like that. I think Chris meant that people normally listen to comments more when they're not put in a way that insults someone. I don't think that warrants people to assume the job of someone. It's not only lawyers who think like that. Anyone who doesn't like intimidation of any form or bad language would think that way too. I'm very sorry @Chris Koziarz for just assuming what you meant.

well ok thats fair enough if he meant it in a nice way, chris does not do this but other older posters seem to give the newer posters a hard time but he seems ok.

 

[Horsa]

well ok thats fair enough if he meant it in a nice way, chris does not do this but other older posters seem to give the newer posters a hard time but he seems ok.

The people here are mainly welcoming & friendly. I found the transformation from writing poems & talking about books & music every so often to chatting very hard but have realised that a lot of people like banter on here & are very good friends. They're trying to banter with us too so we feel like part of the team. (Well, I came at the same time as a few other writer's who I used to chat to & they seem to have disappeared. I miss them but realised that I can join in & have fun & interesting conversations with others.) Chris is very nice. He's only trying to help you fit in & not get in the firing line so you're not upsetting others, getting upset back by what's said & can have fun.

 

[Chris Koziarz]

So you agree with me but down-rate that I said based on the way said it, wow man did not know you are a lawyer, or a woman? For me I am going to judge posts on its right or not for me not on the way the post sounds.

Hmmm, interesting. People sometimes tell me that I sound like a lawyer, but no one ever told me that I sounded like a woman. I indeed want to be the former when arguing about the facts, because I want to be logical. Bur I also think it's important to pay attention how we are arguing the facts. In particular, by choosing a denigrating vulgarism to describe Fed, you've showed disregard to the emotions of Fed fans. Why do you imply one needs to be a woman to understand that? If you mean that women in general are more clever here & said women understand emotions better than men do (e.g. as Horsa above understood me perfectly well) then I agree. However, I wanted to turn your attention to just basic social implications of your comment, to quote Horsa, you "put [your words] in a way that insults someone". Everyone, women & men like myself, do understand the negative emotions you tried to excite, and in general no one likes negative emotions. Ergo, I think I did not sound like "a woman".

 

[Riotbeard]

Kudos to Nadal. He came out swinging yesterday. I was impressed that Tsitsipas, after getting smashed for a good hour, had the spirit to make a fight of it at the end, even if it was with the help of Nadal.

 

[Carol]

Hey, nobody is perfect but that Trophy is a little bit confuse lol

 

[Jelenafan]

That has to be one of the oddest looking champhionship trophys ever...

 

[monfed]

Then what we can call your Roger, idiot?

Fed is 37 YO. dull is 32, 5 yr age gap. You're the idiot. And Fed doesn't chicken out of tough draws, dull saw the draw and chickened out like the disgusting coward that he is.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

I think everyone's humble can be seen as fake: if you don't like someone you always tend to think he "talks fake". I, a Fed fan like you, who do not like some of Nadal's manners, but who tries to be impartial, did not find Nadal faking or self-contradicting in any of his talks. But faking MTOs is another matter and the serious one (though hard to prove), good to hear Nad learned to control that unfair behaviour.

He will be playing some no name in the first round of RG which he has won umpteen times. In the pre-match interview, he would say "That nobody is really a great player. I have to be at my best in order to have a chance to win, no". Do you think he really means it? That is exactly what is meant by Rafa is a fake humble person.

Of course, nobody likes arrogant person either. But being "fake humble" is another extreme that no one likes either.

 

[Jelenafan]

He will be playing some no name in the first round of RG which he has won umpteen times. In the pre-match interview, he would say "That nobody is really a great player. I have to be at my best in order to have a chance to win, no". Do you think he really means it? That is exactly what is meant by Rafa is a fake humble person.

Of course, nobody likes arrogant person either. But being "fake humble" is another extreme that no one likes either.

Uhh, maybe that mental attitude explains why he’s so good at the French since even on his best surface which best utilizes his strengths he doesn’t take things for granted?

Because he’s right; players who are the top 200 in the world ARE great players. It’s respect for a lower ranked opponent who can potentially (and have had) out of the blue a blazing hot streak in even one match. There isn’t a single top player who hasn’t been upset by an opponent who on paper they should have handled easily. Saying you have to play your best is not letting arrogance/hubris undermine your chances. Rafa knows trying to play his best is the best answer for any opponent you face. The flip side is that after most matches Rafa rarely thinks he’s actually played to his ultimate best, but the point is to strive for that every time. It works for him. Like him or not, Rafa is rarely the type of player who gives up on a game, much less a point. He’s usually all out throttle even when struggling.

Is not fake humility, it’s a realistic assessment of an unknown future result ( a match) and figuring your best possible chance is to “play your best.”

 

[Horsa]

Hmmm, interesting. People sometimes tell me that I sound like a lawyer, but no one ever told me that I sounded like a woman. I indeed want to be the former when arguing about the facts, because I want to be logical. Bur I also think it's important to pay attention how we are arguing the facts. In particular, by choosing a denigrating vulgarism to describe Fed, you've showed disregard to the emotions of Fed fans. Why do you imply one needs to be a woman to understand that? If you mean that women in general are more clever here & said women understand emotions better than men do (e.g. as Horsa above understood me perfectly well) then I agree. However, I wanted to turn your attention to just basic social implications of your comment, to quote Horsa, you "put [your words] in a way that insults someone". Everyone, women & men like myself, do understand the negative emotions you tried to excite, and in general no one likes negative emotions. Ergo, I think I did not sound like "a woman".

I appreciate your respect for my gender, Chris but I don't fully agree that women on the whole are more emotionally intelligent than men. E.g. 3 of the best books in the bookshops about emotions were written by men. 2 of the books I am going to mention were written by the same man though. Those books are emotional intelligence by Daniel Goleman, destructive emotions & how to deal with them also by Daniel Goleman & authentic happiness by Martin Seligman. There were a lot of male poets & a lot of poetry deals with & expresses emotions. I'd also say that creative people as a whole tend to understand the emotions of themselves & others better which in a way can be a bad thing as it makes them more prone to emotional difficulties. Famous creative people who suffered from emotional difficulties are Charlotte Bronte & Charles Dickens.

 

[Carol]

Fed is 37 YO. dull is 32, 5 yr age gap. You're the idiot. And Fed doesn't chicken out of tough draws, dull saw the draw and chickened out like the disgusting coward that he is.

Nadal didn´t care the draw because first at all he finished winning Toronto playing much better than the previous matches, with more confidence and winning the guy who had beaten 4 top players, second he didn´t have the joke draw like Federer has but he anyway probably would have played pretty well but for the first time he is taking care with his body and the schedule and wants to finish the year in much better conditions than the previous years. And third he is skipping only one HC tournament and NOT ALL THE CLAY SEASON like Federer did so if someone is a coward then POINT to this last one, idiot!