Nitto ATP Finals 2023, Turin, Italy

[Moxie]

Thank You, Moxie!

I see people “blaming” Sinner for not losing against Rune, but Rune did not wake up for the match until the 2nd set!

The best analogy I can think of this:

A player is injured during the match or towards the end of the match and does not want to retire from the match. It is up to other player to actually win the match itself. Unfortunately, the non-injured player did not deliver the final blow so the injured player wins the match.

Mind you guys also, Rune had the opportunity to win the Green Group by beating Sinner. However, for some odd reason, he played terribly in the 1st Set and waited in the 2nd set to do some adjustments.

Well, Front is blaming Sinner, but he's an old cynic.

Sinner was never going to retire from that match. Not in front of the home crowd, not after what happened with Tsitsipas, and not to signal injury. As you (sort of) say, Rune could have solved everyone's problems by better play, but he didn't have it in him. I think Rune has an excellent future, but he's not there yet. What was Sinner to do, but win that match?

Well, the die is cast, as Suetonius said to Caesar. Sinner chose the noble path. I guess we now go with...if you come for the king, you better not miss twice! In any case, I'm glad Jannik fancies his own chances.

 

[Moxie]

You're making the case for me. All the more reason to be sensitive to the body and not risk further injury or soreness with extended play in a meaningless match. He was already in the SF. Why not save all his strength for that?

He could have used it, but he didn't. I still like the integrity of it.

 

[Moxie]

Maybe he was waiting for Jannik to tank and when that didn't happen he actually realized he would need to play to advance and it was too late.

That would be pathetic.

 

[kskate2]

That would be pathetic.

I agree, but we really don't know why he didn't try harder in the first set w/ a SF birth on the line.

 

[Front242]

Well, Front is blaming Sinner, but he's an old cynic.

Sinner was never going to retire from that match. Not in front of the home crowd, not after what happened with Tsitsipas, and not to signal injury. As you (sort of) say, Rune could have solved everyone's problems by better play, but he didn't have it in him. I think Rune has an excellent future, but he's not there yet. What was Sinner to do, but win that match?

Well, the die is cast, as Suetonius said to Caesar. Sinner chose the noble path. I guess we now go with...if you come for the king, you better not miss twice! In any case, I'm glad Jannik fancies his own chances.

No, I'm merely pointing out the obvious easier path to winning the title...

If he beats him twice in a row I'll be impressed but I doubt he will.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

In regards to Jannik feeling a twinge his lower back in that 2nd set against Rune, he stated later that it went quickly went away
Regardless of the obvious and easier path to winning the title, knowing Jannik he would not tank, and knowing Cahill he would not put up with a player he coaches not giving 100% regardless of the circumstances. Simona Halep knows that too well when they were together they parted for awhile, till she came to her senses and realized Cahill was right!

 

[Front242]

In regards to Jannik feeling a twinge his lower back in that 2nd set against Rune, he stated later that it went quickly went away
Regardless of the obvious and easier path to winning the title, knowing Jannik he would not tank, and knowing Cahill he would not put up with a player he coaches not giving 100% regardless of the circumstances. Simona Halep knows that too well when they were together they parted for awhile, till she came to her senses and realized Cahill was right!

All it would have taken though was making some errors at 5-5 in the 3rd set. Wouldn't have looked like a tank job then but still no chance of Djokovic in the final and he may have won the title. Now he still might but I don't think he will and it was within his grasp.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

All it would have taken though was making some errors at 5-5 in the 3rd set. Wouldn't have looked like a tank job then but still no chance of Djokovic in the final and have may have won the title. Now he still might but I don't think he will and it was within his grasp.

Well if Jannik loses the final, I am still proud of what he has accomplished in the last couple of months, bodes well for DC next week and also 2024,

 

[Moxie]

I agree, but we really don't know why he didn't try harder in the first set w/ a SF birth on the line.

Oh, I think he was trying. He's got issues, and things to learn. I honestly don't think he was waiting for Sinner to tank. At least I hope not. That is no championship mentality.

 

[the AntiPusher]

I agree, but we really don't know why he didn't try harder in the first set w/ a SF birth on the line.

The goal is to win this round robin tournament the best way that is possible. Just as front saying, the odds are extremely extraordinary low to defeat Novak twice

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Oh, I think he was trying. He's got issues, and things to learn. I honestly don't think he was waiting for Sinner to tank. At least I hope not. That is no championship mentality.

Jannik started the 1st set really well and didnt allow Rune to get a look in, then Rune raised his level from the start of the 2nd set, maybe in the back of Runes mind he had a 2-0 H2H over Jannik that could have been his downfall as well mentally

 

[Nadalfan2013]

Anything less than 6-0, 6-0 for Sinner will be disappointing. Let’s go Sinner, end noletardism once and for all!

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Anything less than 6-0, 6-0 for Sinner will be disappointing. Let’s go Sinner, end noletardism once and for all!

I can assure you that score line wont be happening if Sinner defeats Novak in the final

 

[Moxie]

All it would have taken though was making some errors at 5-5 in the 3rd set. Wouldn't have looked like a tank job then but still no chance of Djokovic in the final and he may have won the title. Now he still might but I don't think he will and it was within his grasp.

Yeah, but integrity isn't something you should sell cheap. (OK, not so cheap. But integrity SHOULD be valued.) This is Sinner's first YEC. (Was he an alternate before?) He's undefeated in the tournament. If he loses tomorrow, to Djokovic, no one is going to think less of him. He's had an excellent tournament, and sends a message to the field. However, if he beats him, he has a value beyond the euros on offer. I say bet on yourself. And, as they say: to be the best, you have to beat the best. Forza, Jannik!

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Just looking at Alcaraz season,
65 wins
11 losses
6 titles, including his 2nd GS title
Year end No 2.....well done Charly!

 

[the AntiPusher]

Anything less than 6-0, 6-0 for Sinner will be disappointing. Let’s go Sinner, end noletardism once and for all!

Only Rafa is capable of giving Novak a bagel

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Only Rafa is capable of giving Novak a bagel

May I suggest you read Moxie's post regarding 'Integrity' on this page., it might make you think, before you start thinking of going to the dark side of tennis

 

[PhiEaglesfan712]

Carlos Alcaraz was great for 80% of the season, up until the loss to Medvedev at the US Open. Starting with the Medvedev loss, Carlos finished the season going 9-6 in his last 15 matches.

 

[Moxie]

Carlos Alcaraz was great for 80% of the season, up until the loss to Medvedev at the US Open. Starting with the Medvedev loss, Carlos finished the season going 9-6 in his last 15 matches.

Being great for 80% of the season is pretty good, as is beating Djokovic in the final of Wimbledon, and finishing the year at #2. He's 20. Is there a problem?

 

[the AntiPusher]

Yeah, but integrity isn't something you should sell cheap. (OK, not so cheap. But integrity SHOULD be valued.) This is Sinner's first YEC. (Was he an alternate before?) He's undefeated in the tournament. If he loses tomorrow, to Djokovic, no one is going to think less of him. He's had an excellent tournament, and sends a message to the field. However, if he beats him, he has a value beyond the euros on offer. I say bet on yourself. And, as they say: to be the best, you have to beat the best. Forza, Jannik

History best memory is who wins the final not the earlier rounds of a round robin..iif it was a clay tournament and Rafa would be knocked out if Novak's looses his 2nd but he knows he will advance to the weekend semis .which option would Novak choose. Hmmm