Is Federer the biggest choker among ATGs?

[monfed]

Haha i offend you? You poor bastard. You just a clown. Worthless idiot. I tried , but that’s the last post to you shithead.

A little shakeup and the mask is off. So predictable you poor slugger.

 

[atttomole]

You thought Federer didn't have a prayer in finals after how he played against a red-hot Rafa? knowing his game is suited for grass and seeing how Djoker sort of didn't look that impressive vs Agut? My gosh, you federer fans are so harsh on Roger, cut him some slack.

He almost blew it vs Cilic, but he didn't did he? What about when he pulled through vs Roddick in 09 Wimbledon, against Rafa in 07 Wimbledon and more recently when he toppled Nadal in finals of AO a few years ago, i believe nadal was up a break early in 5th set. So much for Roger blowing it then..

I think you guys are too harsh on Roger, to me, there is a simpler explanation here. Roger's game is based on higher risk than Novak and Nadal. When calm, confident, he can produce more winners than UFEs but in pressure situations, he has less margin than Nadal or Novak. It is understandable that Nadal and Djoker's games will be more steady under pressure, most of the time. This is even more of a problem for Roger in his older age as in the past, he relied on defense A LOT more. Back during 04-07, Federer oftentimes relied on defense to make opponents miss in pressure situations, he also played offense, but he used defense more. In his older age, he has adopted a more risky, offensive approach and so he is more susceptible to making errors when nerves are at play. It's tough for him when he faces Novak or Nadal, two all time greats, who have more steady games. The fact that Djokovic made 0 UFE! 0 UFE! in 3 tiebreakers is CRAZY, OUTRAGEOUS. He forced Federer to play risk tennis and Federer couldn't execute. Not that easy to do...

The reasons why Djokovic was favorite are known. Are you going to tell me that you thought Federer was going to win before the final match? I know you are still tormented that Sampras’s record was pulverized. Isn’t it Spinmaster?

 

[MikeOne]

The reasons why Djokovic was favorite are known. Are you going to tell me that you thought Federer was going to win before the final match? I know you are still tormented that Sampras’s record was pulverized. Isn’t it Spinmaster?

Bruh, dude, the sampras thing gets old, for real, it’s actually getting really boring now.

I thought federer had an excellent shot... the way he played vs nadal, who was the most in form player of the tournament and the most battle tested.

 

[DarthFed]

Bruh, dude, the sampras thing gets old, for real, it’s actually getting really boring now.

I thought federer had an excellent shot... the way he played vs nadal, who was the most in form player of the tournament and the most battle tested.

Nadal is a way lesser player than Djokovic off clay. Roger should beat Rafa damn near every match off clay, and that always was the case. Gramps has made that abundantly clear the past few years now. Djokovic is a different story, much harder ask for Roger to beat.

 

[Jelenafan]

Nadal is a way lesser player than Djokovic off clay. Roger should beat Rafa damn near every match off clay, and that always was the case. Gramps has made that abundantly clear the past few years now. .

Sorry you can’t erase 12 years as much as you would like to.
Not

12 out of the 15 years they’ve played. In fact Nadal beat the #1 ranked Federer in straight sets on HC in Miami back in 2004 in their first match. The Dominating Federer of 2004.

The fact that Roger is now in “Nadal’s head “ ( sarcasm off) doesn’t change that Nadal beat him regularly throughout most of his career.

 

[DarthFed]

Sorry you can’t erase 12 years as much as you would like to.
Not

12 out of the 15 years they’ve played. In fact Nadal beat the #1 ranked Federer in straight sets on HC in Miami back in 2004 in their first match. The Dominating Federer of 2004.

The fact that Roger is now in “Nadal’s head “ ( sarcasm off) doesn’t change that Nadal beat him regularly throughout most of his career.

H2H off clay stands at 14-10, major finals 3-2. The proper context is that Rafa owns Fed on clay and clay alone. Off clay, Roger has the clear edge though lesser than you'd expect given then Grand Canyon difference in their resumes on grass and hards. And did I mention Roger just kicked Rafa's ass at age 38... that should count triple

 

[Moxie]

H2H off clay stands at 14-10, major finals 3-2. The proper context is that Rafa owns Fed on clay and clay alone. Off clay, Roger has the clear edge though lesser than you'd expect given then Great Canyon difference in their resumes on grass and hards. And did I mention Roger just kicked Rafa's ass at age 38... that should count triple

Even you know those numbers you posted above only changed in the very recent past. I wouldn't gloat about that.

 

[DarthFed]

Even you know those numbers you posted above only changed in the very recent past. I wouldn't gloat about that.

So it only counts once Nads had the edge in non-clay matches? That came in 2013 and early 2014 by the way when he beat the corpse of Federer 4 times on HC. Roger was ranked below David Fucking Ferrer at that time in case you forgot.

In fact Roger never got lucky meeting the corpses of Nadal (2015 and 2016) and Djokovic (2017 - mid 2018) a lot. But Fed has been there in shit periods like 2013 and late 2018 to hand 4 wins each to Nadal and Djoker. I will be generous and not include other weak periods for Roger (like this year) but you get the point

 

[Moxie]

So it only counts once Nads had the edge in non-clay matches? That came in 2013 and early 2014 by the way when he beat the corpse of Federer 4 times on HC. Roger was ranked below David Fucking Ferrer at that time in case you forgot.

In fact Roger never got lucky meeting the corpses of Nadal (2015 and 2016) and Djokovic (2017 - mid 2018) a lot. But Fed has been there in shit periods like 2013 and late 2018 to hand 4 wins each to Nadal and Djoker. I will be generous and not include other weak periods for Roger (like this year) but you get the point

I didn't say it doesn't count, I only suggested you not gloat over it. We Fedal fans have all reminded Novak fans how long it took him to get to even/passed them in the H2H. Timing is everything, my friend. And the only one who really did a number on Roger in his salad days was Rafa.

 

[DarthFed]

I didn't say it doesn't count, I only suggested you not gloat over it. We Fedal fans have all reminded Novak fans how long it took him to get to even/passed them in the H2H. Timing is everything, my friend. And the only one who really did a number on Roger in his salad days was Rafa.

I was responding with facts to my good and bitter friend Jelena. As for Rafa and Nole well that is a bad argument anyways. They are a year apart.

 

[Nadalfan2013]

In slam h2h Rafa and Roger are tied 4-4 if we eliminate Rafa’s favorite surface which is clay. Now if we instead eliminate Roger’s favourite surface which is grass, the slam h2h would be 9-1 in favour of Rafa. See how silly it is to eliminate a surface for one’s convenience? Stop trolling.

 

[DarthFed]

In slam h2h Rafa and Roger are tied 4-4 if we eliminate Rafa’s favorite surface which is clay. Now if we instead eliminate Roger’s favourite surface which is grass, the slam h2h would be 9-1 in favour of Rafa. See how silly it is to eliminate a surface for one’s convenience? Stop trolling.

I wasn't eliminating anything, I'm not surprised you are having difficulty following the subject. See Rafa fans like yourself, Jelena, and Moxie like to talk about Rafa owning Federer everywhere, not just clay. Truth is that was never really the case, and the truth now is Roger has been taking Nadal to the shed on HC and grass at an age where he should be long retired.

 

[Nadalfan2013]

I wasn't eliminating anything, I'm not surprised you are having difficulty following the subject. See Rafa fans like yourself, Jelena, and Moxie like to talk about Rafa owning Federer everywhere, not just clay. Truth is that was never really the case, and the truth now is Roger has been taking Nadal to the shed on HC and grass at an age where he should be long retired.

Yes he should be long retired indeed. Federer's resurgence at such a late age and him not even sweating or taking a breath at 38 yrs old even at 12-12 in the 5th set is really "difficult" to understand for many tennis fans like us. Maybe he will peak in his 40's or 50's, we shall see. It's fascinating how he is so special and how he doesn't function like normal human beings.

 

[Moxie]

I was responding with facts to my good and bitter friend Jelena. As for Rafa and Nole well that is a bad argument anyways. They are a year apart.

It's not, really. It took Djokovic a long time to get to/pass either Roger or Rafa, but much longer to pass Rafa. They're "only a year apart." Yeah, that keeps getting said all of the time. But aren't you one who says how slow Roger was to start? If that matters, then it matters how slow Novak was to start. And it matters how early Rafa got off from the blocks. As Indiana Jones said, it's not the years, it's the mileage. Now, why Roger is still able to go 5 hours is beyond me. Especially when he hardly could in his youth.

 

[MikeOne]

I wasn't eliminating anything, I'm not surprised you are having difficulty following the subject. See Rafa fans like yourself, Jelena, and Moxie like to talk about Rafa owning Federer everywhere, not just clay. Truth is that was never really the case, and the truth now is Roger has been taking Nadal to the shed on HC and grass at an age where he should be long retired.

but he's not retired and playing well; in fact, today's Roger, whilst less consistent, is better equipped to handle Nadal than 04-07 Roger.

You keep bringing this BS about age as if 04-07 Fed would do better vs today's Nadal and Djokovic but i have time and time again showed how BABY, IN DIAPERS, NOT YET ABLE TO BUY A BEER Novak and Nadal were already starting to beat 'prime' Fed in 04-07. So.... So, if baby, in diapers, not of legal age to buy alcohol Djoker and Nadal were giving 'prime' 'unbeatable' Fed problems, what would 11-19 Novak and Nadal do to prime Fed? scary, huh? Would 04-07 Fed even have a chance? I mean, how could prime fed be losing to these guys when they were still breast feeding from mommy?

 

[DarthFed]

It's not, really. It took Djokovic a long time to get to/pass either Roger or Rafa, but much longer to pass Rafa. They're "only a year apart." Yeah, that keeps getting said all of the time. But aren't you one who says how slow Roger was to start? If that matters, then it matters how slow Novak was to start. And it matters how early Rafa got off from the blocks. As Indiana Jones said, it's not the years, it's the mileage. Now, why Roger is still able to go 5 hours is beyond me. Especially when he hardly could in his youth.

Djokovic passed them in H2H within weeks of each other in 2016 actually. And it's fine if you think Roger is on sauce, it's a bit rich coming from a Nadal fan. Roger can still go 4-5 hours one match, he struggles to recover after a tough 5 setter unlike a couple guys. And also his game isn't anywhere near as physical as Nadal or Djokovic.

 

[Nadalfan2013]

Djokovic hasn’t surpassed Nadal in h2h in the goat debate. The flawed logic is that everyone speaks about “slam titles” over “overall titles” but then when it comes to head to head you guys use the “overall h2h” Instead of the “slam h2h”. You can’t have it both ways. If what matters most are the slam titles then what matters most are also the slam h2h and RAFA leads both 9-6 and 10-4.

 

[DarthFed]

but he's not retired and playing well; in fact, today's Roger, whilst less consistent, is better equipped to handle Nadal than 04-07 Roger.

You keep bringing this BS about age as if 04-07 Fed would do better vs today's Nadal and Djokovic but i have time and time again showed how BABY, IN DIAPERS, NOT YET ABLE TO BUY A BEER Novak and Nadal were already starting to beat 'prime' Fed in 04-07. So.... So, if baby, in diapers, not of legal age to buy alcohol Djoker and Nadal were giving 'prime' 'unbeatable' Fed problems, what would 11-19 Novak and Nadal do to prime Fed? scary, huh? Would 04-07 Fed even have a chance? I mean, how could prime fed be losing to these guys when they were still breast feeding from mommy?

Roger was better equipped back then, unless you're naive enough to believe he couldn't attack Rafa's weak second serves or wasn't talented enough to take his backhand early which has led to him having more success now vs. then. Roger was too stubborn to adapt his game against the one guy that gave him problems mostly because his game beat everyone else everywhere. Once his movement and skills declined he finally decided to be more aggressive off the return and backhand. We had this conversation tons of times back in the day. You thought Roger's strategy of blocking back Rafa's weak serve and willingly engaging in long rallies was a brilliant strategy. And you thought Roger wasn't talented enough to actually be aggressive on return or with his backhand (even though his backhand was great against everyone else).

Face it, Roger always had the game to do a lot more damage against Nadal off clay than he has done. Between being stubborn and being mentally affected by clay beatdowns Roger became vulnerable to Nadal everywhere. It still amuses me people argue Wimbledon 08 wasn't pathetic on paper. Nadal was very limited for grass court tennis at that point. So please try to explain to me how Roger losing to him at age 27 wasn't bad when he just beat a much more complete version at age 38. I made this argument many years before Roger turned it around off clay at ages 34-38. I'd say it proves the point pretty damn well.

As for Djokovic, the H2H was 5-1 after 2007 and something like 14-7 after 2010. From your idiotic ramblings you make it sound like pre-prime Novak was owning Roger like Rafa did. I also never have said prime Roger would own prime Novak, I don't think he would. Of course he would do a lot better than the old man version that Novak easily bullies around from the baseline since the old man can't defend anymore.

 

[Nadalfan2013]

Djokovic passed them in H2H within weeks of each other in 2016 actually. And it's fine if you think Roger is on sauce, it's a bit rich coming from a Nadal fan. Roger can still go 4-5 hours one match, he struggles to recover after a tough 5 setter unlike a couple guys. And also his game isn't anywhere near as physical as Nadal or Djokovic.

lol at least Nadal looks like an athlete and trains very hard physically, and still he sometimes looks tired in matches like a normal human being despite taking a long time between points. Federer looks more like an accountant then an athlete yet can play for 100 hours without sweating or breathing with 10 seconds between points, he seems like "superman".

 

[Moxie]

but he's not retired and playing well; in fact, today's Roger, whilst less consistent, is better equipped to handle Nadal than 04-07 Roger.

You keep bringing this BS about age as if 04-07 Fed would do better vs today's Nadal and Djokovic but i have time and time again showed how BABY, IN DIAPERS, NOT YET ABLE TO BUY A BEER Novak and Nadal were already starting to beat 'prime' Fed in 04-07. So.... So, if baby, in diapers, not of legal age to buy alcohol Djoker and Nadal were giving 'prime' 'unbeatable' Fed problems, what would 11-19 Novak and Nadal do to prime Fed? scary, huh? Would 04-07 Fed even have a chance? I mean, how could prime fed be losing to these guys when they were still breast feeding from mommy?

Mike, there is a lot of bullshit in here. And certainly no nuance or understanding of the machinations between the 3 over the past 12-15 years. Firstly, you're lumping early Nadal beating Roger, with early Novak beating him once or twice. That's a false equivalency, and I'm sure you know it. On top of that, the moments and years when each has been best aren't just exactly age-equivalent. The rest is just useless flourish, as well. Don Fabio told you about the legal drinking age in Serbia, and I can confirm about the legal drinking age in Spain, so you can stop using that one. You're here to down-grade Roger, and I think everyone knows that. It's not even like you show up regularly.