General Doping/PEDs Discussion

[GameSetAndMath]

Buddy, you can't just add "ultra aggression" to your game, just like that, "as if that's something 35 year old athletes simply do." You're ignoring the age factor. You're ignoring the rapid recoveries, the speed around the court, the reflexes, the effort it all takes, as if these things can be added to the game with the flick of a switch. They can't. Federer was already unusual in this regard in 2014, but it seems to have escalated rapidly now, since his long absence. This is far too unusual to be ignored...

Ya, you can't just add ultra aggression like the flick of a switch. But, Fed is generally an aggressive player by mentality all along. Going from aggressive to ultra aggressive is not a sudden transition, it is a gradual one.

Yeah, a gradual one that took place in secret over 7 months off the tour. The physical means to support ultra-aggression is achieved gradually too, no doubt, because "that's what 35 year old athletes simply do..." :cover

You are misunderstanding the whole point of playing aggressive tennis. It is to make sure that you don't need much endurance, stamina and physical prowess.

 

[Kieran]

Ya, you can't just add ultra aggression like the flick of a switch. But, Fed is generally an aggressive player by mentality all along. Going from aggressive to ultra aggressive is not a sudden transition, it is a gradual one.

Yeah, a gradual one that took place in secret over 7 months off the tour. The physical means to support ultra-aggression is achieved gradually too, no doubt, because "that's what 35 year old athletes simply do..." :cover

You are misunderstanding the whole point of playing aggressive tennis. It is to make sure that you don't need much endurance, stamina and physical prowess.

No I'm not, brother. I've played and coached aggressive tennis, and watched it got 40 years. It's a young man's game. It takes huge effort, reflexes and physicality. It takes power and reserves of energy. It isn't so simple as, pitty-patty, 2 shots, 3 shots, done! It burns guys out, all the bending and lunging and great effort to overwhelm. Aggressive tennis isn't just a matter of technique: if it was two-shot Pete would still be playing: instead he was feeling the effects of burn out aged 27. It's a tough one to keep punching so hard, short knockout blasts, then come back and do it again and again. And again.

The back suffers, the arm, the shoulder gets dragged from its socket. The knees are constantly bending and twisting, and it requires pace, speedy reflexes and a lot of nifty footwork. To suddenly show such physical attributes at close to prime nick "is not something 35 year old athletes simply do."

 

[Front242]

^ No it doesn't. I'm 42 and lift heavier weights than kids half my age and do more aggressive workouts than many of them and look in much better shape than many of them, even the ones on gear. And I'm not doping and have never taken steroids. This is just another example that age is just a number. Going back to tennis, there is zero reason why anyone at any age can't be ultra aggressive if they possess great shot making skills and have an excellent serve. It won't work any better for a guy 21 or 22 if he hasn't got both of those. Youth doesn't make your shot making skills or serve better and many young players on tour have crap stamina too actually so that point is invalid also.

 

[Kieran]

Front.

It's very difficult to reasonably discuss with somebody who posts what you just posted above, and yet who once posted this, about age, and ageing, and players getting older, but "going back in time, and none of them getting older."

So the biggest and best site discussing doping in tennis announced it's closure before the AO finals this year. Can't say I blame the admin really as the finals are pretty farcical. It's like we're going back in time and none of them get any older. RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR.

See how silly and self-serving it is? Not to mention hypocritical, and we can go much lower on the descriptions. But...I like you bro, so we won't.

All the red flags you used to wave, brother - they're waving freely on their own now, waving in your face, since you're compromised and being silly.

That's cool. We don't need our self-styled google advised David Walsh now. We have historical precedence. Let's have that run its course, eh?

 

[the AntiPusher]

Front.

It's very difficult to reasonably discuss with somebody who posts what you just posted above, and yet who once posted this, about age, and ageing, and players getting older, but "going back in time, and none of them getting older."

So the biggest and best site discussing doping in tennis announced it's closure before the AO finals this year. Can't say I blame the admin really as the finals are pretty farcical. It's like we're going back in time and none of them get any older. RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR.

See how silly and self-serving it is? Not to mention hypocritical, and we can go much lower on the descriptions. But...I like you bro, so we won't.

All the red flags you used to wave, brother - they're waving freely on their own now, waving in your face, since you're compromised and being silly.

That's cool. We don't need our self-styled google advised David Walsh now. We have historical precedence. Let's have that run its course, eh?

Kieran, Front ain't gonna man up..he is doing his version of Trumpism, deflecting..talking about himself being 42 and his efforts to talk about his desire to be superhuman with his workout..point is this is just like Captain America, Roger has taken the Super Soldier serum and Front doesn't want to address how he has masked his test results..he and GSM know damn well Fed results are not from a rejuvenated bh and a more aggressive game..if you believe that I will sell you a tale of how a reality tv personalities can run the White House:devil

 

[Front242]

Front.

It's very difficult to reasonably discuss with somebody who posts what you just posted above, and yet who once posted this, about age, and ageing, and players getting older, but "going back in time, and none of them getting older."

So the biggest and best site discussing doping in tennis announced it's closure before the AO finals this year. Can't say I blame the admin really as the finals are pretty farcical. It's like we're going back in time and none of them get any older. RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR.

See how silly and self-serving it is? Not to mention hypocritical, and we can go much lower on the descriptions. But...I like you bro, so we won't.

All the red flags you used to wave, brother - they're waving freely on their own now, waving in your face, since you're compromised and being silly.

That's cool. We don't need our self-styled google advised David Walsh now. We have historical precedence. Let's have that run its course, eh?

The difference of course is you seem to think Nadal is innocent and Federer is the only doper :cover Last time I checked there was no doping court case for Federer. And btw, my post above about them not getting any older didn't mean they're all doping, there are tons of legal things you can take these days that enhance many things.

 

[Kieran]

Of course, brother. That's why you said "RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR." It's FUBAR because you considered the players to be using legal things. :cover

You know, sometimes I think you're more intelligent than you let on...

 

[the AntiPusher]

Of course, brother. That's why you said "RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR." It's FUBAR because you considered the players to be using legal things. :cover

You know, sometimes I think you're more intelligent than you let on...

"You more intelligent than you let on"

to me what makes an intelligent poster if they're fair like Darth and KS..although I don't always agree with their tennis politics ( Federer) :laydownlaughing, they're fair ..except when it comes to Nadal for Darth :snicker..

 

[Front242]

Of course, brother. That's why you said "RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR." It's FUBAR because you considered the players to be using legal things. :cover

You know, sometimes I think you're more intelligent than you let on...

Ponder this. Sharapova was taking a substance that was only banned since the start of 2016 and while I don't agree with taking a substance that is meant for medical purposes to be used as a PED it was actually a legal enhancer for 10+ years. So you need to rethink things..the fault btw is the rubbish testing in the sport but they're all likely using whatever they can get away with and that probably means a similar scenario to Sharapova. My comment about them not getting younger btw was because it was the exact same finalists at AO 2009 and AO 2017. A lot of that had to do with the draws though.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Of course, brother. That's why you said "RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR." It's FUBAR because you considered the players to be using legal things. :cover

You know, sometimes I think you're more intelligent than you let on...

Ponder this. Sharapova was taking a substance that was only banned since the start of 2016 and while I don't agree with taking a substance that is meant for medical purposes to be used as a PED it was actually a legal enhancer for 10+ years. So you need to rethink things..the fault btw is the rubbish testing in the sport but they're all likely using whatever they can get away with and that probably means a similar scenario to Sharapova. My comment about them not getting younger btw was because it was the exact same finalists at AO 2009 and AO 2017. A lot of that had to do with the draws though.

Front you are still deflecting..I will leave it alone but I will say this..No one should Ever listen to you whine and rant ( there is another :devil word ole AP would use but not these days) about PEDs. You were given a blog from an outsider that had layers of carefully researched data yet You have ran from this topic like an alcoholic from an AA meeting.

 

[Front242]

Of course, brother. That's why you said "RIP tennis. The sport is FUBAR." It's FUBAR because you considered the players to be using legal things. :cover

You know, sometimes I think you're more intelligent than you let on...

Ponder this. Sharapova was taking a substance that was only banned since the start of 2016 and while I don't agree with taking a substance that is meant for medical purposes to be used as a PED it was actually a legal enhancer for 10+ years. So you need to rethink things..the fault btw is the rubbish testing in the sport but they're all likely using whatever they can get away with and that probably means a similar scenario to Sharapova. My comment about them not getting younger btw was because it was the exact same finalists at AO 2009 and AO 2017. A lot of that had to do with the draws though.

Front you are still deflecting..I will leave it alone but I will say this..No one should Ever listen to you whine and rant ( there is another :devil word ole AP would use but not these days) about PEDs. You were given a blog from an outsider that had layers of carefully researched data yet You have ran from this topic like an alcoholic from an AA meeting.

I didn't run from anything, I simply think the whole thing is utter rubbish. The reasons for Federer's great start to this year are 100% obvious: greatly improved backhand and first strike tennis which he's been doing for years now. No PEDs make you hit winners and no PEDs make your backhand better. You simply have to practice hard and basically all he's been doing is hitting the BH harder instead of the weaker BH he hit in the past, blocking back serves or chipping the return of serve, slicing, etc. /it's now used as a weapon as it should have been all along given his aggressive mindset. Now if you, Kieran and the author of that silly blog think you need PEDs to do that, then you need serious help. It's also been pointed out that the supposed stamina ( :cover ) you're all going on about is complete and utter nonsense since he's winning matches quicker and easier by way of his aggressive game plan. If he were out there grinding away for 5 hours every single match then it'd be obvious but he's not. You're all seeing things that aren't there and missing everything that IS there: ie, greatly improved backhand, which is the main and huge improvement this year and highly skilled shot making and an excellent serve, both of which he's had his whole career.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Ponder this. Sharapova was taking a substance that was only banned since the start of 2016 and while I don't agree with taking a substance that is meant for medical purposes to be used as a PED it was actually a legal enhancer for 10+ years. So you need to rethink things..the fault btw is the rubbish testing in the sport but they're all likely using whatever they can get away with and that probably means a similar scenario to Sharapova. My comment about them not getting younger btw was because it was the exact same finalists at AO 2009 and AO 2017. A lot of that had to do with the draws though.

Front you are still deflecting..I will leave it alone but I will say this..No one should Ever listen to you whine and rant ( there is another :devil word ole AP would use but not these days) about PEDs. You were given a blog from an outsider that had layers of carefully researched data yet You have ran from this topic like an alcoholic from an AA meeting.

I didn't run from anything, I simply think the whole thing is utter rubbish. The reasons for Federer's great start to this year are 100% obvious: greatly improved backhand and first strike tennis which he's been doing for years now. No PEDs make you hit winners and no PEDs make your backhand better. You simply have to practice hard and basically all he's been doing is hitting the BH harder instead of slicing. Now if you, Kieran and the author of that silly blog think you need PEDs to do that, then you need serious help. It's also been pointed out that the supposed stamina ( :cover ) you're all going on about is complete and utter nonsense since he's winning matches quicker and easier by way of his aggressive game plan. If he were out there grinding away for 5 hours every single match then it'd be obvious but he's not. You're all seeing things that aren't there and missing everything that IS there: ie, greatly improved backhand, which is the main and huge improvement this year and highly skilled shot making and an excellent serve, both of which he's had his whole career.

No No..You ain't gonna allowed to take the crowd's way out..not this thread not you..

As I mentioned before, this blog has layers for you to dissect, have at Pal or push on 4ever:devil

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Here is what Paul Annacone says about Fed's wins over Rafa this year. Folks, it is all about his aggressive game that did the magic at AO and that flipped the switch.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

[video=youtube]https://youtu.be/Tw1nVsYy_Lg[/video]
Here you go folks. The secret behind Roger's success.

 

[Front242]

What's the general consensus here...has Dopapova found a new way to cheat or is she just beating nobodies right now in Stuttgart? Haven't watched any of her matches but glad she lost today in any case.

 

[Kieran]

Nah, I think the WTA is so lame that Margaret Court could prolly win a few matches at Wimbledon, if she wasn't too busy to enter. We had a pregnant lady dispatch everyone without dropping a set in Oz, which is fine, but we also saw girls walk straight from the maternity ward - more or less - and snaffle the USO. After years outta the sport. The field is feeble, so I don't think even Sharapova is that stupid to take anything now.

My main problems with her aren't the taking of meldonium for all the years it was legal, but it's that she took it after it was made illegal, and that her defence before the CAS smacks of utter dishonesty, and then having them be so foolish as to accept parts of it, she's since waved the victim card about the place. This is a fatal lack of honesty, and a total lack of humility. Had she stuck to her original (and I suspect, partly true) version, and done her time, her return would still be shady, but less so...

 

[Front242]

Yup, it's pretty despicable that she made it out to be their fault and not hers. The fact that she took large doses of Meldonium pre big matches is just the icing on the cake. Guess all her supposed health problems must have been out of control before big matches :nono I actually agree with Bouchard, any cheat in sports should be banned for life. Only way to stop them imo.

 

[mightyjeditribble]

Nadal has now, at the age of 31, reached the SF of a grand slam with the smallest loss of games that he has ever had at any point in his career. He has again dominated the clay-court season (so far, still two matches to go, but even if he was to lose at RG it wouldn't really change the facts) in a way that he hasn't done since at least 2013.

I would like to call on Kieran to choose whether to:

1. Retract his insinuations and comments regarding Federer's form in the early part of the year, and admit that they were nothing but sour grapes;
2. Apply the same standards to his own favourite player, and, as he writes ask himself "is this too difficult to believe?", concluding that Nadal is doping (nonsense in my view);
3. Expose himself as a hypocrite of the highest order.

 

[MikeOne]

DEJA VU!!!! 2 sets under, going to the bathroom with the bag (I thought they cant do that) and back to play stronger than ever and he did the same in 3 matches.

Nadal has been accused of taking performance enhancement drugs.. in fact, it got bad enough that i think nadal has sued people.. i think he sued a french commentator or journalist.

people have a hard time understand how nadal and djokovic can pull these superhuman feats. Remember when rafa played like a hour match vs verdasco in AO semis and then took out fed in 5? People were suspicious

novak pulled similar feat when he beat murray in a marathon and came back and beat nadal in 5 hour match in AO finals

federer has pulled off similar feats.. i mean winning slams in 5 sets after age 35..

they have endurance and mental strength. I don’t think what djoker pulled off was that different than what he has done in past.. in fact, when he beat murray and nadal at ao, this was much more brutal. He beat rafa 6-2 in 4th set here... tough match but lucky he didn’t need 10-8 in 5th...

 

[Fiero425]

Nadal has been accused of taking performance enhancement drugs.. In fact, it got bad enough that i think Nadal has sued people.. i think he sued a French commentator or journalist.

People have a hard time understanding how Nadal and Djokovic can pull these superhuman feats. Remember when Rafa played like a hour match vs Verdasco in AO semis and then took out Fed in 5? People were suspicious.

Novak pulled similar feat when he beat Murray in a marathon and came back and beat Nadal in 5 hour match in AO finals.

Federer has pulled off similar feats.. I mean winning slams in 5 sets after age 35..

They have endurance and mental strength. I don’t think what Djoker pulled off was that different than what he has done in the past.. in fact, when he beat Murray and Nadal at '12 AO, this was much more brutal. He beat Rafa 6-2 in 4th set here... tough match, but lucky he didn’t need 10-8 in 5th...

I'm still suspicious! BTW, Nole took 5 hours to eliminate Murray, then almost 6 hours to finish off Nadal; 5:53 to be precise in 2012!