Fedal - XXXVII - Miami Finals

[the AntiPusher]

The better player won..just plain and simple..I don't think Roger was forced to slice the backhand not one time.. too easy for Roger.. Man I feel bad for Nadal.. what an extremely crushing blow for him and his team..this shall too shall pass

There were 2 times that Roger was forced to slice the backhand because the ESPN commentators mentioned it. Overall though Roger was able to hit slice when HE wanted to - not because Nadal forced him to.

Okay .. maybe I missed those two but my point is what you said.. Roger was able to hit slice when He wanted to..not because of Nadal...

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

From the horse's mouth, no clay tournaments until the French. Might as well rest.

 

[Haelfix]

As far as Roger, I think he hasn't played this well since the end of 2007. He's easily better than his 2008 and 2009 version, and probably about on par with his AO 2010 performance. So that's equally incredible from a longevity point of view and frankly pretty unheard of in tennis history.

Old players aren't supposed to reverse the clocks ticking!

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

My theory about this whole thing is that Roger is comfortable enough with this backhand that he is not feeling like he has to finish the point every chance he gets a forehand. So the forehand is more relaxed too. I remember all those times against Rafa the countless missed forehands.

Kieran, all the best to Missus brother .

 

[Fiero425]

As far as Roger, I think he hasn't played this well since the end of 2007. He's easily better than his 2008 and 2009 version, and probably about on par with his AO 2010 performance. So that's equally incredible from a longevity point of view and frankly pretty unheard of in tennis history.

Old players aren't supposed to reverse the clocks ticking!

I see some arm trouble in Roger's future! Swiping over those BH's at his age, I know I was going to the Advil before and after playing! :angel: :dodgy: :snicker - - - - http://fiero4251.blogspot.com/2016/08/fan-page-novak-nole-djokovic.html - - - -

 

[Busted]

Well, what do you say to that...? The guy is defying everything. Congrats Rodge !

Roger's kickin' ass in the mornin' and takin' names in the evening! Anybody still having the GOAT discussion just needs to give up the ghost. The man is 35 and just won the 3 biggest tournaments of the season so far - and looked 25 while doing it.

On another note - Nadal? You can see the limitations in his game now that for years he got away with - especially against Roger. Djokovic has exploited them for years but as long as Nadal was still beating Roger and Andy he didn't bother to make any changes. He literally has no Plan B to speak of. Hit more top and hit harder just ain't going to get it done off clay against Roger, Andy and Nole anymore. Time to go back to school and make some adjustments - starting with NOT standing 15 feet behind the baseline to return serve.

The first four games, Rafa was playing the correct way..then he went back to the loopy short balls .just 15 feet is extremely dumb plus he still is not gaining an advantage in the point, dropping the ball just past the service box...I am convinced it's Rafa not his team that allows him to stand that far back..Rafa should take that 2nd place trophy and toss it into the Key Biscayne bay ..I am not gonna bitch about this ..It is what it is..

True - it's ultimately Nadal who has to execute the strategy. It's like Roger in the old days in their matchup - go into the match with the game plan to hit over the ball more and when the going gets tough just didn't have the belief that he could do it consistently. And that's sort of where Nadal is right now. It's like he can't believe he's NOT in Roger's head anymore and Roger has stopped ALLOWING Nadal to out-psych him. And if you look at Rafa's face - he ain't happy about that. He really thought he'd go the rest of his career being able to out-tough Roger. Poor baby. At least he knows now that he's not going to have to play Roger on clay because Roger just told ESPN he'd probably only play the French Open and skip the rest of clay season - where Rafa's got a ton of points to defend.

 

[Kieran]

My theory about this whole thing is that Roger is comfortable enough with this backhand that he is not feeling like he has to finish the point every chance he gets a forehand. So the forehand is more relaxed too. I remember all those times against Rafa the countless missed forehands.

Kieran, all the best to Missus brother .

Thanks buddy, but it's not the old lady, it's the old lad, my old fella. He had a stroke. He's old, he's got Alzheimers, but it's not easy.
:hug

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

My theory about this whole thing is that Roger is comfortable enough with this backhand that he is not feeling like he has to finish the point every chance he gets a forehand. So the forehand is more relaxed too. I remember all those times against Rafa the countless missed forehands.

Kieran, all the best to Missus brother .

Thanks buddy, but it's not the old lady, it's the old lad, my old fella. He had a stroke. He's old, he's got Alzheimers, but it's not easy.
:hug

My bad. Both my grandparents dealt with this horrible disease. Hang in there brother!

 

[the AntiPusher]

The better player won..just plain and simple..I don't think Roger was forced to slice the backhand not one time.. too easy for Roger.. Man I feel bad for Nadal.. what an extremely crushing blow for him and his team..this shall too shall pass

From Roger's perspective, he took a long break and he knocked ten years off his age. I hope this isn't a trend we'll see.

For Rafa, I wouldn't see this as crushing. I haven't been watching much tennis, my ol;d lad isn't well, but in general up til the Big Matches, Rafa is actually playing great tennis. He just isn't holding himself together too well once there's something big at stake, and he's been like that since 2014. He gets anxious, he hurries the shots, he blows big chances. Even still, facing FUBAR-Fed, it's been an unlucky time for him, but I think that he could be prone to lapses against anyone, in a big final. Even last year, his only victory of note was in Monte Carlo, and he struggled there in the final to beat Le Monf, which is not really something he used to do.

Put it this way - if he'd faced Monfils in the semis of MC last year, he'd have destroyed him.

I saw this happen with a lot of players as they age, they become tentative, and big finals become too much for them. They weary easier, and physically they drain quicker, through anxiety, etc. The big matches aren't gonna be there forever for them, so they begin to fluff their lines. I'm proud of him so far this season though...

Welcome back brother and I will keep praying for you and your family..Kieran, I have been mentioning for the past few weeks , the Right way to play on the hardcourts especially against top players like Roger. JBA did, Berdych did , Krygrios did , Rafa did for the first part of the first set but abandoned his aggressive play..Yes he was unlucky and Roger was playing at a different level. E.g. You Have breakpoint against Roger and he is at the net. Why not give him a topspin lob to Roger's bh ..even if Roger returns the ball he is totally out of position and lost control of the court..Also there were numerous times when Roger hit the ball short, Rafa took the high percentage play hit the ball to the low part of the next crosscourt and Roger would just stretch and take it down the line with his fh..Rafa , you're the left make Roger hit that shot on a running bh..even if Roger tries to pull it dtl or cc, you are in the middle of the court and have total control..

That being said, I am proud of Rafa also..although the results wasn't much better than IW , he play a bit more aggressively but was unlucky..Really, I wanted these hardcourt titles for Nadal..I hope his team sees the same thing cause Djokovic and Murray will be back and the path to the championship will be like the Hobbits trying to return the ring of power to Mount Doom..

Again Welcome back brother , this is just a game, family is primary :clap

 

[Kieran]

As far as Roger, I think he hasn't played this well since the end of 2007. He's easily better than his 2008 and 2009 version, and probably about on par with his AO 2010 performance. So that's equally incredible from a longevity point of view and frankly pretty unheard of in tennis history.

Old players aren't supposed to reverse the clocks ticking!

Actually, nobody can reverse the clock ticking. That's the point of getting old. Unless there's something amiss, it can't be done...

 

[El Dude]

Nice to see you, Kieran - sorry to hear about your dad.

 

[Puppet Master]

Rafa is such a lovable character, he said he might fight for the title again in 2020 during the ceremony.
Roger: I have no words for the pefromance. God-like today. He hit a few half volleys that pretty much shocked Rafa.
Rafa: I have to say I am a tad disappointed. He didn't play Fed very hard at all, couldn't even break his serve once, let alone win a set. Too many errors, he is visibly stressed during these matches, and it has to go away ASAP. I hope he can recover some venom in his forehand for the clay season, he needs the DTL attacks desperately. I knew Roger would kill him here, I voted Rafa in 3 since it was basically my wish, it would have been so nice, Rafa would have been over the Moon with a title here, but it just wasn't meant to be.
Off to the clay season we go, boys and gals!!!

 

[El Dude]

A couple things about Rafa. I think Kieran nailed it, and it points to the downward spiral that happens to older players: they lose a fraction of their physical ability, then lose a bit of confidence, which erodes their overall game.

Further, I think what is going on with Rafa re: Roger is actually very similar to what Roger had to deal with throughout their matchups. Roger would dominate everyone else and then face Nadal and not be able to play his usual game, and couldn't really figure out how to counter Nadal...until now. But I understand the frustration that AntiPusher points to--of Nadal reverting back to the loopy balls that clearly don't work; this is what we had to deal with for years, with Roger doing the same thing, again and again, and never adapting his game to counter Nadal's approach.

 

[El Dude]

I'm surprised that Roger said he'll take all of clay season off (except Roland Garros). If anything I was wondering if he was thinking, "I'm playing so good, might as well come back and go for Monte Carlo as well as Rome."

But what surprises me is that he typically wants a warm-up tournament for Slams. It is April 2 now and Roland Garros begins in late May - so that would be an almost two month break. Not sure why that is necessary, and Rome seems well timed.

 

[Kieran]

The better player won..just plain and simple..I don't think Roger was forced to slice the backhand not one time.. too easy for Roger.. Man I feel bad for Nadal.. what an extremely crushing blow for him and his team..this shall too shall pass

From Roger's perspective, he took a long break and he knocked ten years off his age. I hope this isn't a trend we'll see.

For Rafa, I wouldn't see this as crushing. I haven't been watching much tennis, my ol;d lad isn't well, but in general up til the Big Matches, Rafa is actually playing great tennis. He just isn't holding himself together too well once there's something big at stake, and he's been like that since 2014. He gets anxious, he hurries the shots, he blows big chances. Even still, facing FUBAR-Fed, it's been an unlucky time for him, but I think that he could be prone to lapses against anyone, in a big final. Even last year, his only victory of note was in Monte Carlo, and he struggled there in the final to beat Le Monf, which is not really something he used to do.

Put it this way - if he'd faced Monfils in the semis of MC last year, he'd have destroyed him.

I saw this happen with a lot of players as they age, they become tentative, and big finals become too much for them. They weary easier, and physically they drain quicker, through anxiety, etc. The big matches aren't gonna be there forever for them, so they begin to fluff their lines. I'm proud of him so far this season though...

Welcome back brother and I will keep praying for you and your family..Kieran, I have been mentioning for the past few weeks , the Right way to play on the hardcourts especially against top players like Roger. JBA did, Berdych did , Krygrios did , Rafa did for the first part of the first set but abandoned his aggressive play..Yes he was unlucky and Roger was playing at a different level. E.g. You Have breakpoint against Roger and he is at the net. Why not give him a topspin lob to Roger's bh ..even if Roger returns the ball he is totally out of position and lost control of the court..Also there were numerous times when Roger hit the ball short, Rafa took the high percentage play hit the ball to the low part of the next crosscourt and Roger would just stretch and take it down the line with his fh..Rafa , you're the left make Roger hit that shot on a running bh..even if Roger tries to pull it dtl or cc, you are in the middle of the court and have total control..

That being said, I am proud of Rafa also..although the results wasn't much better than IW , he play a bit more aggressively but was unlucky..Really, I wanted these hardcourt titles for Nadal..I hope his team sees the same thing cause Djokovic and Murray will be back and the path to the championship will be like the Hobbits trying to return the ring of power to Mount Doom..

Again Welcome back brother , this is just a game, family is primary :clap

Cheers bro!

I think rafa prolly expected - as we all did - that Federer would show some negative reactions to playing such draining quarter- and semi-finals so close to the final, but guess what! :s

Rafa also didn't execute, as you and others have said. I remember after Oz we all weighed up things but I was kind of cautious with regards to Rafa because of his inability to stay calm in big matches. I didn't mind it so much in Oz because he'd played a gruelling semi - and these matches have effects on older players, in the natural course - but I kinda feel that in an alt-world, where Berdyck=h beat Federer, and then beat Nick, that Rafa would struggle against Tomas too. In a final. In the newspaper today I read a commentator mention how Rafa had struggled in the second set against Fog, just in the old-fashioned art of crushing him, which Rafa used to much better at, but now, he's tenative.

I'm not sure a Big Win will be enough for him, either, although I'd have him as the best player heading onto clay, because he's always been so great there, and it's a long time since he headed onto the red stuff playing as well as he is now...

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

I'm surprised that Roger said he'll take all of clay season off (except Roland Garros). If anything I was wondering if he was thinking, "I'm playing so good, might as well come back and go for Monte Carlo as well as Rome."

But what surprises me is that he typically wants a warm-up tournament for Slams. It is April 2 now and Roland Garros begins in late May - so that would be an almost two month break. Not sure why that is necessary, and Rome seems well timed.

This was the "I am tired I just played 4 weeks in a row" Roger speaking. I have a feeling he may ask for a wildcard somewhere after sitting for a month at home and playing tea party with the girls :snicker

 

[JesuslookslikeBorg]

no..feddo really turned tables on rafa.. 5 defeats in row to rafa but then 4 consecutive victories (could be wrong didn't check lol).

the only other instance I can think of it happening late career..was chris evert halting a 12 match or so losing streak to Navratilova from 1982-85 until evert won fo1985..even then martina won next match..wimbly1985 final. (her last win b4 then was wasting martina 6-0,6-0 on clay in 1981 I think.

(his early 40s pancho Gonzales bt laver 3 times consecutive after losses, I was looking at that the other day..1970-71 timeline sort of).

 

[kskate2]

Tea Party. LMAO!

 

[El Dude]

This was the "I am tired I just played 4 weeks in a row" Roger speaking. I have a feeling he may ask for a wildcard somewhere after sitting for a month at home and playing tea party with the girls :snicker

Sort of like how I (as a teacher, with the summers off with my daughters) am not entirely said to see summer vacation end and send the girls back to school?

But yeah...he could change his tune. I'd love to see him surprise us all and enter Monte Carlo on a whim, and then Rome. But I suspect it will only be Rome.

 

[JesuslookslikeBorg]

Hey,.

good news is that clay is arriving for rafa. and he is still 2nd in race to London rank charts.