Davis Cup

[britbox]

Bad loss for Team Oz... was expecting a little more this year.

 

[Andy22]

Yeah and I think Nadal said he like to play Davis cup this year.

 

[Denis]

Pretty sweeping reforms just went through:

https://www.daviscup.com/en/news/290057.aspx

- no more world group and several rounds a year, instead one week tournament at the end consisting out of 18 countries
- no more 5 sets

I think its great!

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Pretty sweeping reforms just went through:

https://www.daviscup.com/en/news/290057.aspx

- no more world group and several rounds a year, instead one week tournament at the end consisting out of 18 countries
- no more 5 sets

I think its great!

1. I am not in favor of removing 5 set matches.

2. In fact, I think they should go back to 5 set matches in the finals alone of all Masters series events.

3. I am kind of torn between the one week gala of DC and the old fashioned home and away tennis.
That is where heroes get formed out of even no name players.

4. I heard that there is another team event that is being brewed by some quarters (not the Laver cup) and
that is going to be in direct competition with this newly formed DC format, thus making a total mess of
everything.

 

[Denis]

1. I am not in favor of removing 5 set matches.

2. In fact, I think they should go back to 5 set matches in the finals alone of all Masters series events.

3. I am kind of torn between the one week gala of DC and the old fashioned home and away tennis.
That is where heroes get formed out of even no name players.

4. I heard that there is another team event that is being brewed by some quarters (not the Laver cup) and
that is going to be in direct competition with this newly formed DC format, thus making a total mess of
everything.

Point three I agree with. Not sure how they are going to create a good old Davis Cup atmosphere. Perhaps they will try to get some kind of World Cup vibe.

Point 4 is kind of pointless now isn’t it? Doubt the atp will go on with it.

Re point 1-2: terrible idea. It’s a team competition. 5 matches was already too much, and you want 5 sets as well? Ugh. 3x3 sets will do for me to decide a winner.

 

[Fiero425]

Pretty sweeping reforms just went through:

https://www.daviscup.com/en/news/290057.aspx

- no more world group and several rounds a year, instead one week tournament at the end consisting out of 18 countries
- no more 5 sets

I think its great!

I don't mind them making changes, but everytime they do, it devalues the records of present day players by artificially inflating their number of wins IMO! Historically I believe Nole will eventually own the Masters Series and most of their records, regardless of Nadal hogging clay titles! Fedalovicray initially dealt with BO5 in the finals making them very hard to win unlike now when the top players routinely have taken most of them! Winning 4 was a lot in a season, but Fedalovic have set records that may only be broken by really going the extreme and just go for that 10 point TB in the 3rd to make it even easier to win for the top echelon! Way back when there were dark horses who would come thru, esp. at the end of the season, but since the tour decided to go BO3, it's given the top players more opportunities to win since it isn't as grueling! The Davis Cup was barely holding onto its last vestiges of a proud history of athleticism, competition, civility, & grace! They might have eased into it by shortening early rounds, but to accommodate the top players and to consolidate their HOLD on running the show over the wellbeing of the rest of the players, they've gone this route even in a WORLD Team Championship! :whistle: o_O

 

[Denis]

Always appreciate your historical take on things Fiero, and in rant form of course

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Come on folks, best of 5 only increases the better player's chances of winning.

If they go to best of three from best of 5, or if they go from best of 3 to super tie breaker third set, it creates more possibilities of upsets than the other way around.

 

[Denis]

Come on folks, best of 5 only increases the better player's chances of winning.

If they go to best of three from best of 5, or if they go from best of 3 to super tie breaker third set, it creates more possibilities of upsets than the other way around.

There are advantages to that too no? Grandpa Fed also stays in contention with senile Stan a little longer that way as well.

 

[Fiero425]

Come on folks, best of 5 only increases the better player's chances of winning.

If they go to best of three from best of 5, or if they go from best of 3 to super tie breaker third set, it creates more possibilities of upsets than the other way around.

That's one way of looking at it; may even be true, but I'm looking at it thru the eyes of Nadal who gets into battles that last hours even in early rounds! I wasn't surprised when he WD from Cincy after winning Canada! He's one of many players that pay a price by even winning BO3! By him being wiped out, that gave other players a window to possibly win since he's #1! He probably would have lost early so it makes sense for him to just go ahead and withdraw before being embarrassed by some nobody he's never heard of! I don't mind the change, but I've given my view of where I think things are heading concerning wins, the records produced, and the subsequent undermining of history! :whistle:

 

[GameSetAndMath]

There are advantages to that too no? Grandpa Fed also stays in contention with senile Stan a little longer that way as well.

My preference is to use three sets in early rounds and five sets in final rounds / decisive matches. That way, we can ensure that winner did not fluke out.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

That's one way of looking at it; may even be true, but I'm looking at it thru the eyes of Nadal who gets into battles that last hours even in early rounds! I wasn't surprised when he WD from Cincy after winning Canada! He's one of many players that pays a price by even winning BO3! By him being wiped out, that gave other players a window to possibly win since he's #1! He probably would have lost early so it makes sense for him to just go ahead and withdraw before being embarrassed by some nobody he's never heard of! I don't mind the change, but I've given my view of where I think things are heading concerning wins, the records produced, and the subsequent undermining of history! :whistle:

Rafa plays long matches and it has nothing to do with BO5 or BO3. It has to do with his rituals and time wasting techniques. Remember Rafa vs. Djokovic in Madrid. They played for such a long time for just a 3-set match. You put a ritualistic guy against a ball bouncer, that is the end of life.

 

[Denis]

My preference is to use three sets in early rounds and five sets in final rounds / decisive matches. That way, we can ensure that winner did not fluke out.

I can see that. Still it becomes a bit muddy to me to change within a tournament.

 

[Moxie]

Point three I agree with. Not sure how they are going to create a good old Davis Cup atmosphere. Perhaps they will try to get some kind of World Cup vibe.

Point 4 is kind of pointless now isn’t it? Doubt the atp will go on with it.

Re point 1-2: terrible idea. It’s a team competition. 5 matches was already too much, and you want 5 sets as well? Ugh. 3x3 sets will do for me to decide a winner.

Thanks for the news, Denis. I am very curious about this Kosmos, and Gerard Piqué's involvement. (Doesn't that seem odd?) I agree that you have to revert DC to a best of 3 format. No one needs to work that hard for no points, which they took away a couple of years ago.

I also appreciate your point about the lack of DC atmosphere. Sure, it will be an international event for the venue, and maybe get a World Cup/Olympic vibe, but I think you have to expect it will take time to catch on. It will only be one venue. Which also means one surface. Since it will be the end of the year, it will more than likely be either indoor/outdoor HC, or clay, likely in So. America. They say they want to diversify where these events can take place, but how many random places have the facilities to put on such a big event? Then, won't it be like the Olympics or WC, asking 3rd world countries to develop these venues, and then not back them up with a good 250 or something, for their efforts? I'm not sure if this is the answer, but maybe a good try.

I really agree with GSM's point #3: in the old format, younger and lesser players got a chance to shine. If nothing else, because top guys would bail on DC. This format encourages top players to play. Lower-ranked players will likely lose an opportunity to gain traction, confidence and exposure. That would be a real loss, and one of the points, I thought, of DC.

 

[mrzz]

If they went for best of three, they should have kept 5 matches. For me the whole point about DC is depth. This way one man teams have even more chance (not to mention @Moxie 's point above about lower ranked players, which is a quite good one).

 

[GameSetAndMath]

If they went for best of three, they should have kept 5 matches. For me the whole point about DC is depth. This way one man teams have even more chance (not to mention @Moxie 's point above about lower ranked players, which is a quite good one).

They would probably require that the two singles matches be played by two different players.

 

[Denis]

Thanks for the news, Denis. I am very curious about this Kosmos, and Gerard Piqué's involvement. (Doesn't that seem odd?) I agree that you have to revert DC to a best of 3 format. No one needs to work that hard for no points, which they took away a couple of years ago.

I also appreciate your point about the lack of DC atmosphere. Sure, it will be an international event for the venue, and maybe get a World Cup/Olympic vibe, but I think you have to expect it will take time to catch on. It will only be one venue. Which also means one surface. Since it will be the end of the year, it will more than likely be either indoor/outdoor HC, or clay, likely in So. America. They say they want to diversify where these events can take place, but how many random places have the facilities to put on such a big event? Then, won't it be like the Olympics or WC, asking 3rd world countries to develop these venues, and then not back them up with a good 250 or something, for their efforts? I'm not sure if this is the answer, but maybe a good try.

I really agree with GSM's point #3: in the old format, younger and lesser players got a chance to shine. If nothing else, because top guys would bail on DC. This format encourages top players to play. Lower-ranked players will likely lose an opportunity to gain traction, confidence and exposure. That would be a real loss, and one of the points, I thought, of DC.

All agreed. I guess one nuance is that you still need to qualify for this event so there is at least once a year old style Davis Cup atmosphere potential.

 

[Mastoor]

This is shocking. They make new version of World Team Cup, the competition that ceased in 2012.

There are other absurds around this. For example, they won't be able to see Serbian players playing in Serbia, because there are no ATP or challenger tournaments and now there is no Davis Cup neither.

 

[Denis]

This is shocking. They make new version of World Team Cup, the competition that ceased in 2012.

There are other absurds around this. For example, they won't be able to see Serbian players playing in Serbia, because there are no ATP or challenger tournaments and now there is no Davis Cup neither.

This is only true if Serbia makes the semis of this years Davis Cup and the semis of the new event in eternity.

You think this is realistic?

 

[isabelle]

shame on ITF, they killed the most beautiful and thrilling competition really disgusting, now who's next ? will they kill Masters ? OG ? or even GS ??