ATP World Tour Finals 2017, London, UK

[DarthFed]

You make a good point. Also, it makes very little sense, as they'd be 1 & 2 going into the AO in either case, so no real motivation for overplaying. Darth and maybe GSM were angry at Roger for overplaying at Montreal for the sake of #1. I don't really get the reversal, with so much less to gain.

Completely different scenario. The issue with playing Montreal was that he intended to play both warmups before the USO and he didn't even practice at all after Wimbledon before going to Montreal. The common sense decision was to only play one warmup and if he was only going to do one it should've taken half a second to pick Cincy, an event he owns, the fastest hard court on tour or just about. Cincy has quicker points and quicker matches. He got hurt in Montreal because his form was poor and due to that he was getting moved around like a rag doll which is something that pretty much didn't happen before or since.

Playing Doha next year would not be overplaying, he will have to get in some match practice before AO. But even if the #1 is in front of him before AO next year I'd rather he play the Hopman Cup. I just won't be surprised if he goes for #1 if it's dangling there. But I think it's more ideal to play the few semi-serious exhibitions as it clearly worked great for him this year.

 

[DarthFed]

Roger was pretty terrible the first two sets. I didn't see the third set because the damn DVR only taped the first two hours. But I'm shocked he won the third set at all let alone by that score. Sascha must have donated quite a bit in the third because Roger was missing damn near everything when he got aggressive. Tactically I thought it was a poor match, Fed's confidence in his shots seemed shaken really early. And he was way too stubborn on the return, Sascha's serve was dialed in and he wasn't catching up to it at all. With how sloppy Sascha was this match I think Fed could've gotten out of there easier if he backed up a couple steps on the return.

Anyways he will gladly take the win but it will be interesting to see how he does vs Cilic. I hope he comes out ultra-aggressive and if he loses make it a quick match and rest up for the semis. Regardless he needs to get in a groove from the baseline otherwise he could get upset this weekend.

 

[El Dude]

I don't think Roger will do anything that jeopardizes his chances at the AO. It may be his best chance at #20...Novak is questionable, Andy might still be rusty, and Rafa is his bitch. :spank2: Who else poses a serious threat? Zverev, maybe?

Once we get to Wimbledon/US Open, Novak and Andy could be back in form, Zverev that much older, and other unforeseen developments.

All that said, I must admit to a secret fantasy: Roger plays Roland Garros, Rafa is upset by Thiem, Roger wins it.

 

[DarthFed]

A little early to say Rafa is his bitch. I also don't agree that AO is his best shot at #20 even though he certainly has a decent shot at it there. Wimbledon is always going to be his best chance going forward. Regardless of Nole and Murray as long as Roger is healthy he will be the favorite there next year most likely.

I seriously doubt Roger ever plays another RG and no way Thiem is beating Rafa at RG anytime in the next 5 years.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

. Nadal is supposed to play Brisbane and if he wins that he'd be right back to #1. I think Roger's fans want to see him back at #1 more than he wants to chase it..

Yep, forgot about Rafa playing in Brisbane. So, I am no longer in favor of Roger playing in Doha before AO.

 

[DarthFed]

Well if Rafa is playing Brisbane that would just mean that Roger plays Brisbane or Hopman Cup. If he's hunting #1 he will have to follow Rafa around...

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Well if Rafa is playing Brisbane that would just mean that Roger plays Brisbane or Hopman Cup. If he's hunting #1 he will have to follow Rafa around...

No, not a good idea. Even if Fedal final happens at Brisbane, that will only fetch Fed a net gain of 100 (250-150) not enough to get ahead of
Rafa before AO.

 

[Moxie]

Completely different scenario. The issue with playing Montreal was that he intended to play both warmups before the USO and he didn't even practice at all after Wimbledon before going to Montreal. The common sense decision was to only play one warmup and if he was only going to do one it should've taken half a second to pick Cincy, an event he owns, the fastest hard court on tour or just about. Cincy has quicker points and quicker matches. He got hurt in Montreal because his form was poor and due to that he was getting moved around like a rag doll which is something that pretty much didn't happen before or since.

Playing Doha next year would not be overplaying, he will have to get in some match practice before AO. But even if the #1 is in front of him before AO next year I'd rather he play the Hopman Cup. I just won't be surprised if he goes for #1 if it's dangling there. But I think it's more ideal to play the few semi-serious exhibitions as it clearly worked great for him this year.

I don't see how it's completely different. Front was speculating about his back, as his first serve % was not great. He's going to play Hopman Cup (according to GSM), so how is adding Doha not like playing Montreal, if he needs to rest before a Major? Sure, he'll probably be within a few hundred points of #1 before the AO, but what is the benefit? He and Nadal will be 1 and 2 going into AO, anyway. I don't really get your logic.

Roger was pretty terrible the first two sets. I didn't see the third set because the damn DVR only taped the first two hours. But I'm shocked he won the third set at all let alone by that score. Sascha must have donated quite a bit in the third because Roger was missing damn near everything when he got aggressive. Tactically I thought it was a poor match, Fed's confidence in his shots seemed shaken really early. And he was way too stubborn on the return, Sascha's serve was dialed in and he wasn't catching up to it at all. With how sloppy Sascha was this match I think Fed could've gotten out of there easier if he backed up a couple steps on the return.

Anyways he will gladly take the win but it will be interesting to see how he does vs Cilic. I hope he comes out ultra-aggressive and if he loses make it a quick match and rest up for the semis. Regardless he needs to get in a groove from the baseline otherwise he could get upset this weekend.

Sasha completely donated the 3rd, though Roger was very focused. But there were a lot of 2nd serve chances not taken. Sasha was the rookie in the equation. As to Cilic...oh, please. The man is a shred. Not even mentioning that he's going to be having PTSD about Wimbledon.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Moxie, DF was not suggesting adding Doha; he was suggesting playing in Doha in lieu of Hopman cup.

 

[DarthFed]

No, not a good idea. Even if Fedal final happens at Brisbane, that will only fetch Fed a net gain of 100 (250-150) not enough to get ahead of
Rafa before AO.

But Rafa has QF points coming off from Doha..I guess that is probably 45 points...so he'd still be short i guess

 

[GameSetAndMath]

But Rafa has QF points coming off from Doha..I guess that is probably 45 points...so he'd still be short i guess

Good catch. I am changing sides again.

If Roger becomes the undefeated champion of WTF, then Rafa's lead is exactly 140 points. With 45 points from Brisbane coming off, it would actually be only 95. So, if Roger can go to Brisbane and win it, he would indeed become #1, by a tiny margin of 5 points (if he defeats Rafa in the final there).

Busted, no we are not interested in seeding advantage at AO. In fact, as far as seeding is concerned #1 and #2 are the same. The reason we are interested is that, it would be nice to get to #1 at such old age even if it is for just a few weeks. For all we know, such an opportunity may not present again.

 

[Moxie]

Good catch. I am changing sides again.

If Roger becomes the undefeated champion of WTF, then Rafa's lead is exactly 140 points. With 45 points from Brisbane coming off, it would actually be only 95. So, if Roger can go to Brisbane and win it, he would indeed become #1, by a tiny margin of 5 points (if he defeats Rafa in the final there).

Busted, no we are not interested in seeding advantage at AO. In fact, as far as seeding is concerned #1 and #2 are the same. The reason we are interested is that, it would be nice to get to #1 at such old age even if it is for just a few weeks. For all we know, such an opportunity may not present again.

OK, I get it. Rafa just got the "old man" record for YE#1. Now you've got to go after it. I'll trust Roger to make the smart choice, I guess.

 

[Carol]

Where was Federer? I bet he wasn't in the same Hotel

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-t...l-and-co-freezing-miserableness-idUSKBN1DE2MX

 

[DarthFed]

Good catch. I am changing sides again.

If Roger becomes the undefeated champion of WTF, then Rafa's lead is exactly 140 points. With 45 points from Brisbane coming off, it would actually be only 95. So, if Roger can go to Brisbane and win it, he would indeed become #1, by a tiny margin of 5 points (if he defeats Rafa in the final there).

Busted, no we are not interested in seeding advantage at AO. In fact, as far as seeding is concerned #1 and #2 are the same. The reason we are interested is that, it would be nice to get to #1 at such old age even if it is for just a few weeks. For all we know, such an opportunity may not present again.

My thought is that if Roger does well enough at the slams he will have a chance at #1. He lost sight of that this year by playing Montreal with every intention of playing Cincy which would've been too much tennis before USO. He shouldn't worry about chasing it IMO

 

[GameSetAndMath]

My thought is that if Roger does well enough at the slams he will have a chance at #1. He lost sight of that this year by playing Montreal with every intention of playing Cincy which would've been too much tennis before USO. He shouldn't worry about chasing it IMO

After winning AO, Fed did not go crazy after #1. He took it easy. But, after winning Wimbledon also, it is difficult not to try for #1. Even though it backfired, I would not call it a colossal mistake at the time the decision was made (not in retrospect). Another issue was that he went to Montreal without conditioning himself. That was probably an important issue as well.

 

[the AntiPusher]

After winning AO, Fed did not go crazy after #1. He took it easy. But, after winning Wimbledon also, it is difficult not to try for #1. Even though it backfired, I would not call it a colossal mistake at the time the decision was made (not in retrospect). Another issue was that he went to Montreal without conditioning himself. That was probably an important issue as well.

He took it easy..

Took over 2 months off, Recycle.. oops I mean reclined to wait for the nice soft grass and cooler conditions instaed of playing the grueling clay tournaments. No Djoker, No Murray, No Rafa only had to deal with a crying like somebody’s prison bitch cough drop Cilic at SW19, recylce oops I meant recline waiting for the US open series, got Ambushed by Delpotro in NY, reclyced oops I meant reclined to the Asian hardcourt low bouncing indoors and now London.. Yeah he took it EASY

 

[GameSetAndMath]

He took it easy..

Took over 2 months off, Recycle.. oops I mean reclined to wait for the nice soft grass and cooler conditions instaed of playing the grueling clay tournaments. No Djoker, No Murray, No Rafa only had to deal with a crying like somebody’s prison bitch cough drop Cilic at SW19, recylce oops I meant recline waiting for the US open series, got Ambushed by Delpotro in NY, reclyced oops I meant reclined to the Asian hardcourt low bouncing indoors and now London.. Yeah he took it EASY

What is your point?

 

[DarthFed]

After winning AO, Fed did not go crazy after #1. He took it easy. But, after winning Wimbledon also, it is difficult not to try for #1. Even though it backfired, I would not call it a colossal mistake at the time the decision was made (not in retrospect). Another issue was that he went to Montreal without conditioning himself. That was probably an important issue as well.

He wasn't close to #1 until after Wimbledon though. Even before he got hurt I was calling it an idiotic move. He was going to play Cincy too and if he'd have gone deep he'd have played too much tennis before USO. The only thing worse than that overplaying would be if he got injured...

 

[DarthFed]

He took it easy..

Took over 2 months off, Recycle.. oops I mean reclined to wait for the nice soft grass and cooler conditions instaed of playing the grueling clay tournaments. No Djoker, No Murray, No Rafa only had to deal with a crying like somebody’s prison bitch cough drop Cilic at SW19, recylce oops I meant recline waiting for the US open series, got Ambushed by Delpotro in NY, reclyced oops I meant reclined to the Asian hardcourt low bouncing indoors and now London.. Yeah he took it EASY

You can't be a Rafa fan and throw those stones. There ain't even glass on the Rafa fans house when it comes to the PED accusations. Or should I call him Mr. TUE for his "much needed" therapeutic use exemptions.

 

[Moxie]

You can't be a Rafa fan and throw those stones. There ain't even glass on the Rafa fans house when it comes to the PED accusations. Or should I call him Mr. TUE for his "much needed" therapeutic use exemptions.

The only reason to think that Rafa lives in more of a glass house than Roger does is fully created by people like you. Just because you've been trolling Rafa longer doesn't make him more guilty. And just because you're so sure of Roger's innocence doesn't make it any more likely, either. I think you'd both do well to remind yourselves of Occam's Razor.