ATP World Tour Finals 2017, London, UK

[Federberg]

None of my streams are working but Fed's back was giving trouble in Basel so if he's serving crap, most likely his back is acting up again. He served like crap in Basel too and had back issues there. Anyway, he has this one in the bag now.

In his defence he sounds like he has a cold. His voice is a bit croaky. Same thing happened at Wimbledon actually. This fucking London weather! Cold and damp...

 

[Moxie]

Roger the man just showed Sasha the boy how it's done the adult way. That was experience and will over youthful lack of stamina. Seeing that, I think Zverev has a long way to go before he'll be a real contender in slams. That was not impressive to me at all. The old man was there for the taking

What a mess from Sasha in the last set. He's going to rue dropping that first set TB. But yes, he can look tired, as he did in that last set, and that just shouldn't be.

 

[Haelfix]

That was not a great match, from either player. Zverev really dropped focus in the third. For having such a big serve, it’s simply inexcusable to get double broken in the decider.

You have to bring your A game against the Federers of the world if you want to take the next step.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

TMF makes it to SF again. Was not expecting a triple break 3rd set though.

 

[Federberg]

What a mess from Sasha in the last set. He's going to rue dropping that first set TB. But yes, he can look tired, as he did in that last set, and that just shouldn't be.

Agreed. I don't question his will, but his mental stamina is a real problem.

 

[Carol]

Looking the scores I’ve seen that Roger-Zverev have had the two first sets very tied, what happened to Zverev in the third?

 

[El Dude]

Sascha looked like a big kid in the third set, kind of kicking around like a frustrated 12-year old.

But it is good to remember that he's still only 20-years old and probably going to finish #3! He is going to continue being a force in best-of-threes next year, but as Federberg said, he's got some work to do to win a Slam. But he will, and a bunch of them. I do think there's a scenario where he takes a big step forward in the second half next year, wins one of Wimbledon or the US Open, and finishes #1.

That said, if I was a betting man I'd say he wins his first in 2019 and finishes the year #1.

 

[Busted]

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about! Maybe you're thinking of Agassi because no one tried harder than Lendl to win Wimbledon and he was rarely if ever upset usually making his appointed rounds; 2 SF & 2 Finals! Few can sport as good a record as Ivan even though at a terribly disadvantage being a baseliner! He was just unlucky enough to not only have to deal with the slick and choppy grass, he had to endure the play of the surface's greatest champions in Becker, Edberg, Connors, Cash, & McEnroe!

Early in his career Lendl LOATHED Wimbledon. I still remember those two blowhards John Newcombe and Tony Trabert blubbering about it.

 

[Busted]

I was angry he played Montreal because I felt Cincy would be a better warm up for him. I don't care a hoot about yearend no 1. The man is the all time leader in weeks which is a greater reflection of dominance in my view

Roger did admit in the interview I posted earlier that he had overplayed - and that his biggest regret for the season was not being fit for Cincy and the US Open so he could chase #1. So...there ya go. He KNOWS he effed up by playing Montreal. Doubt he'll play it next year...

 

[Busted]

Roger's serving today is as bad as I've seen it for quite some time.

I would watch the match live. I'll watch the replay in a few hours. I wondered what happened in the middle of the 2nd because he was up a break when I went to do some work...

 

[El Dude]

So let me get this straight.

*Only two players are certain: Federer has clinched a SF slot and Cilic is out.
*The winner of Grigor-Goffin clinches a SF spot
*The winner of Sock-Zverev clinches a SF spot, the loser is out
*The loser of Busta-Thiem is out, but the winner isn't in unless the loser of Grigor-Goffin loses their third match

 

[El Dude]

That was not a great match, from either player. Zverev really dropped focus in the third. For having such a big serve, it’s simply inexcusable to get double broken in the decider.

You have to bring your A game against the Federers of the world if you want to take the next step.

Easier said than done, especially when there is only one "Federer of the world."

But I hear your point. Remember he's only 20, though - and he really showed that in the third set. He jumped from #21 to #3 this year, including two Masters; he's coming along quite nicely.

 

[El Dude]

I would watch the match live. I'll watch the replay in a few hours. I wondered what happened in the middle of the 2nd because he was up a break when I went to do some work...

He double faulted in the same game twice, and was broken. It was truly ugly. He just looked awful, and was mediocre at best in the 3rd set but Sascha imploded.

 

[Moxie]

Easier said than done, especially when there is only one "Federer of the world."

But I hear your point. Remember he's only 20, though - and he really showed that in the third set. He jumped from #21 to #3 this year, including two Masters; he's coming along quite nicely.

I have to thank you for pointing out the above. It was a pet peeve of my Dad's.

Also agreed that Zverev is only 20, and filling out a 6'6" frame takes time. He's got more strength to gain, and he'll have more stamina when he's stronger. It's hard to know how quickly he'll come up to full force, and he's come up fast, as it is.

 

[Federberg]

Roger did admit in the interview I posted earlier that he had overplayed - and that his biggest regret for the season was not being fit for Cincy and the US Open so he could chase #1. So...there ya go. He KNOWS he effed up by playing Montreal. Doubt he'll play it next year...

Let's hope he stays smart and keeps away from the red stuff next year as well

 

[El Dude]

I have to thank you for pointing out the above. It was a pet peeve of my Dad's.

Also agreed that Zverev is only 20, and filling out a 6'6" frame takes time. He's got more strength to gain, and he'll have more stamina when he's stronger. It's hard to know how quickly he'll come up to full force, and he's come up fast, as it is.

I think the question with Zverev is not if he'll be great, but how great. I don't see him having the dominance of the Trinity (but who does?), but more in the Edberg/Becker/Agassi range - which is still pretty damn good. But who knows...it is too soon to say about NextGen, but I could see it being like group born in the mid-to-late 70s (Moya, Kuerten, Rios, etc), with lots of very good players but no great ones - except for Zverev - which would make him stand out even taller. But I suspect at least one of the young Canucks will also be great (Shapo, Aliassime).

My one worry is his size. So far, so good, but tall players tend to have back or other issues.

 

[roberto]

What is "the red stuff"?

 

[Federberg]

What is "the red stuff"?

Clay

 

[Moxie]

I think the question with Zverev is not if he'll be great, but how great. I don't see him having the dominance of the Trinity (but who does?), but more in the Edberg/Becker/Agassi range - which is still pretty damn good. But who knows...it is too soon to say about NextGen, but I could see it being like group born in the mid-to-late 70s (Moya, Kuerten, Rios, etc), with lots of very good players but no great ones - except for Zverev - which would make him stand out even taller. But I suspect at least one of the young Canucks will also be great (Shapo, Aliassime).

My one worry is his size. So far, so good, but tall players tend to have back or other issues.

I agree. I think Zverev is the real deal for a lot of reasons. And I'm sure that his team will be conscious of keeping him well-toned to keep Big Man injuries at bay, to the best they can. But that's an unknown. Look at del Potro.

 

[El Dude]

I think del Potro's injuries go well beyond "Big Man injuries," especially when he mainly has problems with his arm, not legs or back. Delpo is just tragic, the biggest "what if" story of the last decade. Dial back to the end of 2009 and there's no reason not to expect him to have been vying with Andy for fourth best of a Big Five.