ATP Washington 500: Citiopen 2014

[Moxie]

TFO needs some work to do.

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

 

[Luxilon Borg]

TFO needs some work to do.

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back, the first since since johnny Mac.

 

[Moxie]

TFO needs some work to do.

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back since johnny Mac.

Good trivia! I liked the fact that, although he seemed to be floundering at the beginning, he pulled himself together, and even in the second, he gave himself some chances, even got a break back. Am I correct in understanding this was his first ATP level match? 4 & 4 is creditable.

 

[Luxilon Borg]

TFO needs some work to do.

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back since johnny Mac.

Good trivia! I liked the fact that, although he seemed to be floundering at the beginning, he pulled himself together, and even in the second, he gave himself some chances, even got a break back. Am I correct in understanding this was his first ATP level match? 4 & 4 is creditable.

First main draw match. He played qualies in 'Lanta.

Yes, he took his beating like a man. I think he has nothing to be ashamed of. Let's see what develops....

 

[herios]

TFO needs some work to do.

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back, the first since since johnny Mac.

Since the DY fiasco, I will stay on the conservative side. Wake me up when he starts winning ATP tourneys.

 

[El Dude]

TFO needs some work to do.

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back, the first since since johnny Mac.

Since the DY fiasco, I will stay on the conservative side. Wake me up when he starts winning ATP tourneys.

Uh, what do Donald Young and Francis Tiafoe have in common, beside the obvious shared nation and race? And if that is all you're talking about, how does that warrant a comparison? They are completely different human beings, and similar players.

And yes, DY has been a huge disappointment. I just don't see how the two are comparable in any significant way.

 

[Luxilon Borg]

TFO needs some work to do.

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back, the first since since johnny Mac.

Since the DY fiasco, I will stay on the conservative side. Wake me up when he starts winning ATP tourneys.

Uh, what do Donald Young and Francis Tiafoe have in common, beside the obvious shared nation and race? And if that is all you're talking about, how does that warrant a comparison? They are completely different human beings, and similar players.

And yes, DY has been a huge disappointment. I just don't see how the two are comparable in any significant way.

Agree..totally different situations. Where do a start?

-Francis has good coaching/DY's mother basically destroyed his career.

-Francis is 6 foot 1 at 16/DY is barely five ten.

-Francis seems totally grounded and appreciative of the USTA's help/DY was a spoiled, thankless brat.

-Francis has not received anywhere near the hype.

EDIT: DY stupidly turned pro at 16.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Bad one:

Rough news in Washington: Grigor Dimitrov has pulled out of the Citi Open due to "the flu and a sinus infection." #CitiOpen

Have to say that I'm glad he's sitting this one out, but not for the flu/infection that caused the withdrawal. He's running with the big dogs now, so Toronto and Cinci are the "warm-ups" to focus on before the Open. Hope he's back to full health shortly.

On the other hand Milos has a lot (690) to defend in the two masters and needed to tack
on Washington just in case he could not defend all his points.

Milos played Washington last year as well, it is in his calendar, not a back-up.

Yes, he did play. He got just 45 points there last year. Moreover, it is in the
"non-countable" points section of his break-up.

Bottomline: If he does not play in Washinton DC, his ranking points will not
go down even by 1. However, if he does play and scores anything more than
45 his ranking points would go up by whatever points he gets minus 45.
So, it acts as a back-up in case (which is almost a certainty) he cannot
reach finals again in Canada.

 

[Billie]

Herios the contrarian

I watched some of the match today, good showing for a kid, couldn't have been easy playing his first ATP match knowing a lot of people in the USA were watching, and even we in Canada got to see this live. There were some terrible shanks, but also some nice, hard hit forehands and backhands. Movement and anticipation were suspect tonight and he is too young to have a good 2nd serve, but that will come with practice, practice and some more practice. I don't know a lot about him to state anything further than this.

 

[Moxie]

Yeah, but he's 16. There's time. He's the youngest of the promising teenagers.

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back, the first since since johnny Mac.

Since the DY fiasco, I will stay on the conservative side. Wake me up when he starts winning ATP tourneys.

Uh, what do Donald Young and Francis Tiafoe have in common, beside the obvious shared nation and race? And if that is all you're talking about, how does that warrant a comparison? They are completely different human beings, and similar players.

And yes, DY has been a huge disappointment. I just don't see how the two are comparable in any significant way.

Agree..totally different situations. Where do a start?

-Francis has good coaching/DY's mother basically destroyed his career.

-Francis is 6 foot 1 at 16/DY is barely five ten.

-Francis seems totally grounded and appreciative of the USTA's help/DY was a spoiled, thankless brat.

-Francis has not received anywhere near the hype.

EDIT: DY stupidly turned pro at 16.

I don't know enough about the background on Young to make a judgement, but Annacone made the point on TV tonight that we should all remain calm, and not put too much pressure. The one place that Young and Tiafoe might share something in common is the early weight of expectation. Tiafoe has been exposed to the glare already. Hopefully, he can take his time in developing. He does seem rather level-headed. And I like that folks like PMac and Rafa have given him some private work-out sessions. It can only help. But we do need to give the kid space.

 

[TennisFanatic7]

I haven't seen any tennis today but looks like Tomic had a very strong win. Good to see Paire take a decent win too even if it was only against Dancevic.

Not many other results standing out but I notice the Yanks have Smyczek, Young, Ram and Ginepri joining Isner in the second round. Sock and Johnson have winnable ties too and Querrey vs Russell guarantees an American winner.

Some interesting R2s tomorrow -
Hewitt v Matosevic
Istomin v Tomic
Paire v Karlovic

 

[Luxilon Borg]

Despite some big flaws in his game, he has something you can't buy...he knows how to win. He won both the Orange Bowl and Easter bowl back to back, the first since since johnny Mac.

Since the DY fiasco, I will stay on the conservative side. Wake me up when he starts winning ATP tourneys.

Uh, what do Donald Young and Francis Tiafoe have in common, beside the obvious shared nation and race? And if that is all you're talking about, how does that warrant a comparison? They are completely different human beings, and similar players.

And yes, DY has been a huge disappointment. I just don't see how the two are comparable in any significant way.

Agree..totally different situations. Where do a start?

-Francis has good coaching/DY's mother basically destroyed his career.

-Francis is 6 foot 1 at 16/DY is barely five ten.

-Francis seems totally grounded and appreciative of the USTA's help/DY was a spoiled, thankless brat.

-Francis has not received anywhere near the hype.

EDIT: DY stupidly turned pro at 16.

I don't know enough about the background on Young to make a judgement, but Annacone made the point on TV tonight that we should all remain calm, and not put too much pressure. The one place that Young and Tiafoe might share something in common is the early weight of expectation. Tiafoe has been exposed to the glare already. Hopefully, he can take his time in developing. He does seem rather level-headed. And I like that folks like PMac and Rafa have given him some private work-out sessions. It can only help. But we do need to give the kid space.

Lets look at the reality of the situation:

I follow tennis 24/7 and only heard of Tiafoe tonight, possibly I saw his name in this years junior slam draws.

Contrast that with young who at 16 I saw play in the main draw of the Open, and had heard of THREE YEARS before, when people like Johnny Mac were raving about him.

Totally different times today, and Annacone does not need to plead for "patience". As discussed ad nauseum, the game is so physical today that to expect anything more than a few surprise results here and there, the emphasis should be on development.

Let's not forget how many wild card were given to Young and how many millions the USTA spent on him.

Let's also not forget that guys like Steve Johnson and Bradley Klahn took the college route, which has its pluses for player development.

 

[Moxie]

Since the DY fiasco, I will stay on the conservative side. Wake me up when he starts winning ATP tourneys.

Uh, what do Donald Young and Francis Tiafoe have in common, beside the obvious shared nation and race? And if that is all you're talking about, how does that warrant a comparison? They are completely different human beings, and similar players.

And yes, DY has been a huge disappointment. I just don't see how the two are comparable in any significant way.

Agree..totally different situations. Where do a start?

-Francis has good coaching/DY's mother basically destroyed his career.

-Francis is 6 foot 1 at 16/DY is barely five ten.

-Francis seems totally grounded and appreciative of the USTA's help/DY was a spoiled, thankless brat.

-Francis has not received anywhere near the hype.

EDIT: DY stupidly turned pro at 16.

I don't know enough about the background on Young to make a judgement, but Annacone made the point on TV tonight that we should all remain calm, and not put too much pressure. The one place that Young and Tiafoe might share something in common is the early weight of expectation. Tiafoe has been exposed to the glare already. Hopefully, he can take his time in developing. He does seem rather level-headed. And I like that folks like PMac and Rafa have given him some private work-out sessions. It can only help. But we do need to give the kid space.

Lets look at the reality of the situation:

I follow tennis 24/7 and only heard of Tiafoe tonight, possibly I saw his name in this years junior slam draws.

Contrast that with young who at 16 I saw play in the main draw of the Open, and had heard of THREE YEARS before, when people like Johnny Mac were raving about him.

Totally different times today, and Annacone does not need to plead for "patience". As discussed ad nauseum, the game is so physical today that to expect anything more than a few surprise results here and there, the emphasis should be on development.

Let's not forget how many wild card were given to Young and how many millions the USTA spent on him.

Let's also not forget that guys like Steve Johnson and Bradley Klahn took the college route, which has its pluses for player development.

You put a lot of things on the table, but I'm not clear on your point. And, hey, we've been touting Tiafoe around here for a few months now. Tiafoe has talked about going the college route, btw.

 

[Luxilon Borg]

Uh, what do Donald Young and Francis Tiafoe have in common, beside the obvious shared nation and race? And if that is all you're talking about, how does that warrant a comparison? They are completely different human beings, and similar players.

And yes, DY has been a huge disappointment. I just don't see how the two are comparable in any significant way.

Agree..totally different situations. Where do a start?

-Francis has good coaching/DY's mother basically destroyed his career.

-Francis is 6 foot 1 at 16/DY is barely five ten.

-Francis seems totally grounded and appreciative of the USTA's help/DY was a spoiled, thankless brat.

-Francis has not received anywhere near the hype.

EDIT: DY stupidly turned pro at 16.

I don't know enough about the background on Young to make a judgement, but Annacone made the point on TV tonight that we should all remain calm, and not put too much pressure. The one place that Young and Tiafoe might share something in common is the early weight of expectation. Tiafoe has been exposed to the glare already. Hopefully, he can take his time in developing. He does seem rather level-headed. And I like that folks like PMac and Rafa have given him some private work-out sessions. It can only help. But we do need to give the kid space.

Lets look at the reality of the situation:

I follow tennis 24/7 and only heard of Tiafoe tonight, possibly I saw his name in this years junior slam draws.

Contrast that with young who at 16 I saw play in the main draw of the Open, and had heard of THREE YEARS before, when people like Johnny Mac were raving about him.

Totally different times today, and Annacone does not need to plead for "patience". As discussed ad nauseum, the game is so physical today that to expect anything more than a few surprise results here and there, the emphasis should be on development.

Let's not forget how many wild card were given to Young and how many millions the USTA spent on him.

Let's also not forget that guys like Steve Johnson and Bradley Klahn took the college route, which has its pluses for player development.

You put a lot of things on the table, but I'm not clear on your point. And, hey, we've been touting Tiafoe around here for a few months now. Tiafoe has talked about going the college route, btw.

Sorry, I thought my point was clear. Tiafoe and Young are completely different stores. Different backgrounds, different attitudes, and certainly different approaches. No body is putting a time frame on Tiafoe to succeed.

Oh, another thing I did not mention, Young took BIG money from management companies and Nike before he did squat. He lost a lot on incentive from day one. Tiafoe is not going to be as marketable and he should look at any of these types of offers with suspicion and think long term.

I did hear that he was going for the education. This is very common with the children of immigrants. His mom and dad busted ass for him.

Another cool facet of this story is he has a twin brother who is a top high school baller...

 

[Luxilon Borg]

btw..if you guys have been discussing FT here for a few months, I missed it, and I say hats off for an early catch.

 

[El Dude]

Yeah, like Luxilon I've never heard anyone mention him and I'm gabbing about young guns all the time and tend to read any thread that talks about young players.

Anyhow, he looks raw but talented. I couldn't see him making any noise for another 2-3 years, but who knows.

Anyone else find his service motion unusual in a jerky kind of way?

 

[Luxilon Borg]

Yeah, like Luxilon I've never heard anyone mention him and I'm gabbing about young guns all the time and tend to read any thread that talks about young players.

Anyhow, he looks raw but talented. I couldn't see him making any noise for another 2-3 years, but who knows.

Anyone else find his service motion unusual in a jerky kind of way?

I mentioned his serve on the Teen thread. There are issues.

 

[Moxie]

btw..if you guys have been discussing FT here for a few months, I missed it, and I say hats off for an early catch.

Moose put us onto him early. I recommend you watch this video, to get the full background.

http://www.tennisfrontier.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2372

We've been a little full of ourselves since johnsteinbeck gave us the early heads up on Dominic Thiem, who we basically scooped the tennis world on. Jesuslookslikeborg has had Borna Coric on his radar for years, WAY before the rest of us even knew why. And we got Christian Garin early from the Spanish press. Without being too proud of ourselves, I think we've long pegged a few of these potential youngsters way before anyone else. Our members apparently make good scouts. :clap

 

[Luxilon Borg]

btw..if you guys have been discussing FT here for a few months, I missed it, and I say hats off for an early catch.

Moose put us onto him early. I recommend you watch this video, to get the full background.

http://www.tennisfrontier.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=2372

We've been a little full of ourselves since johnsteinbeck gave us the early heads up on Dominic Thiem, who we basically scooped the tennis world on. Jesuslookslikeborg has had Borna Coric on his radar for years, WAY before the rest of us even knew why. And we got Christian Garin early from the Spanish press. Without being too proud of ourselves, I think we've long pegged a few of these potential youngsters way before anyone else. Our members apparently make good scouts. :clap

We, and those who do all the good detective work SHOULD be feeling pretty good...a little smug actually.. and rightfully so...the mainstream press is not on this stuff..way cool that we have some good scouts.

 

[Correspondent Kiu]

I tell you guys something, when Francis was playing today, there were a few photographers in the pit, like everyone knew about the secret. The rest of the day, there was almost no one in the photo pit.

Order of play​

Top seeds will play Tuesday and Wednesday.