2019 Men’s Wimbledon SF: Roger Federer vs. Rafael Nadal

[calitennis127]

I think we need a mic drop emoji...

Brits are too corny to talk about mic drops. It's like a French tennis player having mental strength. It's nearly impossible to find in nature.

 

[Federberg]

Brits are too corny to talk about mic drops. It's like a French tennis player having mental strength. It's nearly impossible to find in nature.

and yet here we are...

 

[calitennis127]

and yet here we are...

LOL

 

[Moxie]

Nadal has not absolutely "owned" Djokovic at Roland Garros. Their level has been very comparable. Djokovic was the better player for long stretches in both 2013 and 2014, and of course he thrashed him in 2015.

Funny, because just after the match in 2015 and for some time you were pushing hard the idea that that was a close match and Nadal could have won it, as a way of insisting that there was nothing different in Nadal's level of tennis at that time.

 

[calitennis127]

Funny, because just after the match in 2015 and for some time you were pushing hard the idea that that was a close match and Nadal could have won it, as a way of insisting that there was nothing different in Nadal's level of tennis at that time.

I don't remember saying that Nadal could have won that particular match, but I do recall saying that people were being prematurely hysterical in saying that Nadal was finished.

Turns out I was right about that.

The way he played against Fognini at the US Open was completely in line with many of his prior hardcourt matches. People said he had "declined" simply as an excuse and a hysterical reaction to him losing. It was totally over-the-top.

 

[Moxie]

I don't remember saying that Nadal could have won that particular match, but I do recall saying that people were being prematurely hysterical in saying that Nadal was finished.

Turns out I was right about that.

The way he played against Fognini at the US Open was completely in line with many of his prior hardcourt matches. People said he had "declined" simply as an excuse and a hysterical reaction to him losing. It was totally over-the-top.

No, you weren't pushing that one to say he wasn't finished...it was about as you say above: nothing wrong with his level. And you said it so many times it's astonishing to me, (read: unlikely) that you don't remember how often you said that that was a "close" match.

 

[Federberg]

No, you weren't pushing that one to say he wasn't finished...it was about as you say above: nothing wrong with his level. And you said it so many times it's astonishing to me, (read: unlikely) that you don't remember how often you said that that was a "close" match.

As they say a broken clock is right twice a day. So it's always amusing to see him bring up something he got right a thousand years ago. Can you imagine what it would be like if he fessed up to the vast majority of statements that ended up... I want to say.... wrong but that seems so understated

 

[calitennis127]

No, you weren't pushing that one to say he wasn't finished...it was about as you say above: nothing wrong with his level. And you said it so many times it's astonishing to me, (read: unlikely) that you don't remember how often you said that that was a "close" match.

I'd like to see an exact quote. What I may have said is that the match could have been a lot different if the end of the first set had gone differently, instead of 7-5 to Djokovic.

And I stand by that.

 

[MikeOne]

BIG asterisk to that 15 Djoker win over Nadal, even cali knows Nadal was a shadow of himself that year, didn't win a single big clay court tournament before RG and was beaten regularly on clay that year.

the closest Djoker came to beating an in form Rafa on clay (at RG) was 2013, that was a classic and Djoker had his chances. Tactics matter, Nadal has made slight changes to better fend off Djokovic, mainly his down the line fh. This was shot that bailed Rafa out in that classic 2013 RG semis, he hit some ridiculous down the line fh;s which djokovic couldn't handle or even react too. Without that shot, Djokovic would've won that 2013 match as the nadal fh to djokovic bh wasn't working for Rafa before then. Rafa used that down the line fh against Novak in this year's Madrid final as-well, Novak was tired but that shot has changed the dynamics of Novak vs Nadal on clay, for sure.

Nadal has made slight adjustments to counter djokovic over the years, it's why the wimbledon semis last year was so close; Djokovic, in the past would've beaten Nadal easier on grass. Similarly, Federer has made some adjustments with his tactics vs Nadal, has helped him a bit. These 3 are GOATS for a reason, they can make adjustments, takes years but they can. The only lack of adjustment in this trio is Federer vs djokovic, fed has been owned by Djokovic lately, he hasn't yet been able to make adjustments. Djokovic himself has learned to play Federer, by going to Fed's fh more and not panicking when Federer gets hot, just staying the course, waiting for Fed to get back to normal.

 

[calitennis127]

As they say a broken clock is right twice a day. So it's always amusing to see him bring up something he got right a thousand years ago. Can you imagine what it would be like if he fessed up to the vast majority of statements that ended up... I want to say.... wrong but that seems so understated

I am glad that I do not have the approval of you, being the effeminate little twit that you are. You have slightly more testosterone than Moxie, which you use to be the biggest nag possible.

As for big-picture commentary and analysis, I have been more right than anyone on this board, particularly on the age question. I was the one saying back in 2011 that Federer would be top 5 until he was 35 while all you cliché-spouters were wondering "if this was it" when he was only 29.

My prediction was I want to say.... right but that seems so understated

 

[calitennis127]

BIG asterisk to that 15 Djoker win over Nadal, even cali knows Nadal was a shadow of himself that year, didn't win a single big clay court tournament before RG and was beaten regularly on clay that year.

the closest Djoker came to beating an in form Rafa on clay (at RG) was 2013, that was a classic and Djoker had his chances.

Djokovic was also 15 minutes away from winning the 2014 final. He was up a set and all he had to do was finish strong in the second set.....there is no way that Nadal would have come back from 2 sets to 0 down.

 

[Moxie]

I'd like to see an exact quote. What I may have said is that the match could have been a lot different if the end of the first set had gone differently, instead of 7-5 to Djokovic.

And I stand by that.

Here's one:

https://www.tennisfrontier.com/tenn...r-ever-djokovic-or-federer.80/page-3#post-847

Your post: "Broken, as I said multiple times on the Tennis Censorship forum, I mean Tennis Frontier (excuse me), I do not think that this year's quarterfinal at the French was as easy for Djokovic as the scoreline would indicate. He was very close to losing that second set, and had he done so, I think it was anyone's match to take at that point, with Nadal having all the momentum no less.

A 3-set loss on paper looks completely one-sided, but that isn't always the case (just look at Nadal's 2011 US Open win over Nalbandian in the third round for a perfect example). The second set was the key to this year's RG quarterfinal, and in 2015 Djokovic won it, unlike in 2014. People have talked about Nadal being so off and so poor this year, and really I just think it is a huge exaggeration. His only losses on clay in the main clay events were to Murray, Wawrinka, and Djokovic. And aside from 2013, he has pretty much always struggled on the summer hardcourt swing. He should not have lost to Lopez, but in his defense Lopez is one of the most irritating players to go up against because of how wicked his lefty serve is. It is tough to find a rhythm against him."

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

Djokovic was also 15 minutes away from winning the 2014 final. He was up a set and all he had to do was finish strong in the second set.....there is no way that Nadal would have come back from 2 sets to 0 down.

He had no chance to go 2 sets to 0 in 2014.

Apart from 2013 which frankly only became so close because of some ridiculous returns in late 4th set he has never been close to Nadals level at RG. I am willing to bet my house on him never beating Nadal there or even getting him to a 5th set again.

 

[calitennis127]

Here's one:

https://www.tennisfrontier.com/tenn...r-ever-djokovic-or-federer.80/page-3#post-847

Your post: "Broken, as I said multiple times on the Tennis Censorship forum, I mean Tennis Frontier (excuse me), I do not think that this year's quarterfinal at the French was as easy for Djokovic as the scoreline would indicate. He was very close to losing that second set, and had he done so, I think it was anyone's match to take at that point, with Nadal having all the momentum no less.

A 3-set loss on paper looks completely one-sided, but that isn't always the case (just look at Nadal's 2011 US Open win over Nalbandian in the third round for a perfect example). The second set was the key to this year's RG quarterfinal, and in 2015 Djokovic won it, unlike in 2014. People have talked about Nadal being so off and so poor this year, and really I just think it is a huge exaggeration. His only losses on clay in the main clay events were to Murray, Wawrinka, and Djokovic. And aside from 2013, he has pretty much always struggled on the summer hardcourt swing. He should not have lost to Lopez, but in his defense Lopez is one of the most irritating players to go up against because of how wicked his lefty serve is. It is tough to find a rhythm against him."

Wow, I have never been so impressed reading someone else's post on these boards. What insight. Please do send more links from that poster if you have any. B-)

But what exactly in what I said was wrong? I actually said that Djokovic's win at the French was not as easy as the scoreline would indicate.

 

[calitennis127]

He had no chance to go 2 sets to 0 in 2014.

Why not?

Apart from 2013 which frankly only became so close because of some ridiculous returns in late 4th set he has never been close to Nadals level at RG. I am willing to bet my house on him never beating Nadal there or even getting him to a 5th set again.

I can't wait for next year. Hopefully Djokovic won't flop against Thiem or anyone else before the final because then this is what Nadal will be thinking:

 

[Moxie]

Wow, I have never been so impressed reading someone else's post on these boards. What insight. Please do send more links from that poster if you have any. B-)

But what exactly in what I said was wrong? I actually said that Djokovic's win at the French was not as easy as the scoreline would indicate.

Except that just above you said he "thrashed" Nadal in that match. You say whatever suits your narrative at the time. In 2015, it was that Nadal's drop in level was exaggerated. Right now, you're on a Djokovic kick, so you have to change what you said about that particular match to make a different point.

 

[calitennis127]

Except that just above you said he "thrashed" Nadal in that match. You say whatever suits your narrative at the time. In 2015, it was that Nadal's drop in level was exaggerated. Right now, you're on a Djokovic kick, so you have to change what you said about that particular match to make a different point.

Well he did thrash him on the scoreboard, beating him in straight sets. But if you watch the match closely, it was closer than the score would indicate - just as Nadal's 6-1 record against Djokovic at the French is misleading. I see that series as closer in terms of playing level than 6-1 would normally indicate.

Can we all agree that Nadal being 6-1 against Djokovic at the French is a little bit different than him being 6-1 against Mardy Fish or Sam Querrey?

I don't think Djokovic is a perfect player.....far from it. I think Mike downplays some of his shortcomings. But clearly Djokovic has underachieved at the French Open in his career. It has been by far his weakest Slam, although his US Opens have not been the greatest either.

 

[Federberg]

I am glad that I do not have the approval of you, being the effeminate little twit that you are. You have slightly more testosterone than Moxie, which you use to be the biggest nag possible.

As for big-picture commentary and analysis, I have been more right than anyone on this board, particularly on the age question. I was the one saying back in 2011 that Federer would be top 5 until he was 35 while all you cliché-spouters were wondering "if this was it" when he was only 29.

My prediction was I want to say.... right but that seems so understated

I feel so emasculated because a keyboard warrior put me in my place.... or not...

Mate... stop with more right than anyone nonsense. There are some folks on here who could get away with BS like that. You're not one of them...

 

[The_Grand_Slam]

Why not?

Nadal was never behind in the scoreline.
He won his service game on 5-5 at love.

I can't wait for next year. Hopefully Djokovic won't flop against Thiem or anyone else before the final because then this is what Nadal will be thinking:

The one place Nadal doesn't fear Djokovic is on those PC courts

 

[Bonaca]

He had no chance to go 2 sets to 0 in 2014.

Apart from 2013 which frankly only became so close because of some ridiculous returns in late 4th set he has never been close to Nadals level at RG. I am willing to bet my house on him never beating Nadal there or even getting him to a 5th set again.

Dont bet, That’s my advise for you.