2018 NBA Finals: Warriors - Cavs (Part 4)

[DarthFed]

Buddy, you've been watching way too much American hot take sports shows (First Take, Undisputed, and any other garbage on Fox Sports). There is some truth to what you're saying in the sense that I think Lebron tends to get a pass for the fact that he can be a very difficult guy to play with (not on the court in terms of basketball, but mainly off the court), but this is way over the top and really isn't backed up by facts.

There have been many really great in depth features about Kyrie leaving, with a lot of credible inside information, and yeah, the relationship with Lebron wasn't good but both deserve blame for that. Between this and Durant's lack of "alpha" (which I agree with but don't think is too relevant), you've been going Skip Bayless on us lately (Ok just kidding about this part)/

Actually LeBron is hard to play with on the court too. Bosh and others have alluded to that and it makes sense as many have to adjust to him.

As for KD the leadership is a fair issue but he's as alpha as they come and I never doubted that. You don't have the finals he's had the past two years if you're not alpha.

 

[DarthFed]

No you misunderstand me, I have friends who generally are sceptical about Lebron's goathood. But it actually, in most cases, doesn't translate into hatred. It's more of an eye roll to be honest.

Please let me be very clear. My take on the Lebron-Kyrie dynamic is entirely my own construct. I have observed these guys enough to see how potentially destructive that relationship could be. Take a step back and actually listen to how Lebron talks about his team mates. As a human being, listen to it, I really don't think you are. You seem to just see Lebron as the best player in the world and everyone should just bend over and take what he's giving.

If you have another proud alpha in your team with his own set of accomplishments there is every possibility that you get a similar reaction to Kyrie. The fact that it took (from Kyrie's perspective) behind the scenes machinations to trade him to be the straw that broke the camel's back actually speaks well of him. I would actually counter your comments by saying it's not that I'm hating on Lebron, but you're in fact hating on Kyrie. Or more accurately you're failing to appreciate the human ego (healthy btw) involved in that dynamic.

I've listened to LeBron give interviews many times for 15+ years now and while he can't always hide his ego I really don't see him put teammates down in the media. I never heard him refer to Kyrie as a role player, rather he will talk about being the leader of the team.

Honestly the worst comment I've heard him make regarding teammates was a couple days ago "how much more picking up my teammates am I supposed to do". Even if he was 100% right you just don't say that. But I don't think that's the norm.

Kyrie isn't even the best player LeBron has played with btw, that'd be Wade. And you didn't hear similar complaints

 

[Federberg]

I've listened to LeBron give interviews many times for 15+ years now and while he can't always hide his ego I really don't see him put teammates down in the media. I never heard him refer to Kyrie as a role player, rather he will talk about being the leader of the team.

Honestly the worst comment I've heard him make regarding teammates was a couple days ago "how much more picking up my teammates am I supposed to do". Even if he was 100% right you just don't say that. But I don't think that's the norm.

Kyrie isn't even the best player LeBron has played with btw, that'd be Wade. And you didn't hear similar complaints

referring to your teammates as "my players" might be ok with you, but I guarantee that's not ok with a guy who has a healthy view of himself. That's pure sonning, and it wouldn't be ok with me. I'm really surprised these things aren't obvious to you. It's funny I've been watching Lebron for a long time too, and in the last few years I've found myself quite uncomfortable with some of the tone I get from him. It didn't really crystallise (I didn't understand why) until the Kyrie thing blew up. Hey.. maybe it's just me (it's not ) I've got a bastard of an ego. I'll accept that someone is better than me at something but I don't have to swallow that I'm Robin. Some people aren't made that way

 

[DarthFed]

referring to your teammates as "my players" might be ok with you, but I guarantee that's not ok with a guy who has a healthy view of himself. That's pure sonning, and it wouldn't be ok with me. I'm really surprised these things aren't obvious to you. It's funny I've been watching Lebron for a long time too, and in the last few years I've found myself quite uncomfortable with some of the tone I get from him. It didn't really crystallise (I didn't understand why) until the Kyrie thing blew up. Hey.. maybe it's just me (it's not ) I've got a bastard of an ego. I'll accept that someone is better than me at something but I don't have to swallow that I'm Robin. Some people aren't made that way

Referring to them as "my players" is quite a bit different to "my guys" and I've heard him say the latter many times but not the former. Not saying it hasn't happened but even then what was the context? And did he say that when Kyrie was there?

Regardless I think it's reaching that Kyrie was leaving because of LeBron's ego or his interviews. Some players can't stand being Robin and Kyrie is one of them. Simply put, if LeBron was an egomaniac who was a slightly worse player than Kyrie I doubt it goes down the same way.

The other notable one is Kobe who also got let off the hook in terms of public opinion. Guys like him and Kyrie basically said my legacy as #1 is way more important than being a big part of a championship contending team. But Kyrie isn't Kobe and if things go as I expect he will be seen for what he is real soon. Honestly it shocks me people are defending him after game 7. We all KNOW what that was about. He hated either result.

 

[Federberg]

Referring to them as "my players" is quite a bit different to "my guys" and I've heard him say the latter many times but not the former. Not saying it hasn't happened but even then what was the context? And did he say that when Kyrie was there?

Regardless I think it's reaching that Kyrie was leaving because of LeBron's ego or his interviews. Some players can't stand being Robin and Kyrie is one of them. Simply put, if LeBron was an egomaniac who was a slightly worse player than Kyrie I doubt it goes down the same way.

The other notable one is Kobe who also got let off the hook in terms of public opinion. Guys like him and Kyrie basically said my legacy as #1 is way more important than being a big part of a championship contending team. But Kyrie isn't Kobe and if things go as I expect he will be seen for what he is real soon. Honestly it shocks me people are defending him after game 7. We all KNOW what that was about. He hated either result.

I really don't see what was so bad about that. The guy was in a terrible situation. Does it mean that he's a bad team player, no. He has to prove who he is on the court, and frankly he was doing that before he got injured.

Anyway you and I are both stubborn bastards I doubt either of us will budge. I contend that Lebron's actions were a contributing factor. It's far too easy to say that Kyrie left because he was selfish and full of ego. He wanted to play in a different situation. In my view this year his play proved he had a point. We should all move on.

Just watching yesterdays game now. I have to say, Lebron is one tough somebody. When Draymond poked him in the eye one could have been forgiven for thinking Lebron was being dramatic. But that eye looks nasty. He's one phenomenal specimen

 

[DarthFed]

I really don't see what was so bad about that. The guy was in a terrible situation. Does it mean that he's a bad team player, no. He has to prove who he is on the court, and frankly he was doing that before he got injured.

Anyway you and I are both stubborn bastards I doubt either of us will budge. I contend that Lebron's actions were a contributing factor. It's far too easy to say that Kyrie left because he was selfish and full of ego. He wanted to play in a different situation. In my view this year his play proved he had a point. We should all move on.

Just watching yesterdays game now. I have to say, Lebron is one tough somebody. When Draymond poked him in the eye one could have been forgiven for thinking Lebron was being dramatic. But that eye looks nasty. He's one phenomenal specimen

That eye poke looked innocent enough so I too was shocked that it ended up being so bad. His eye looked way worse in game 2 if you saw that one, still was noticeable yesterday but he seriously looked like the devil in game 2!

I think the right thing was for him to show up to game 7. Hell, he and Al Horford were basically the only players on the team with a lot of playoff experience and emotional support in the biggest game of the young kids' lives would have been nice. And just the fact that he possibly hated the thought of his new team making the Finals without him is pretty childish IMO.

He is a great player for sure and I love watching him play, but I feel he is not too bright, and I think Boston will move him or simply let him go by the end of next season. And he better join a good team because I don't see him elevating a crappy team to the playoffs.

 

[Federberg]

That eye poke looked innocent enough so I too was shocked that it ended up being so bad. His eye looked way worse in game 2 if you saw that one, still was noticeable yesterday but he seriously looked like the devil in game 2!

I think the right thing was for him to show up to game 7. Hell, he and Al Horford were basically the only players on the team with a lot of playoff experience and emotional support in the biggest game of the young kids' lives would have been nice. And just the fact that he possibly hated the thought of his new team making the Finals without him is pretty childish IMO.

He is a great player for sure and I love watching him play, but I feel he is not too bright, and I think Boston will move him or simply let him go by the end of next season. And he better join a good team because I don't see him elevating a crappy team to the playoffs.

Lol! I think you have it in for him for than you think I have it in for Lebron. For the record I think Lebron is an outstanding person off the court (that's not to say he's not on the court, I'm just creating separation).

I don't think he believed Boston was winning that one. How many of us really thought they would? He stayed away because he didn't want to hang around while his old team were celebrating. I won't hold it against him too much. As for his intelligence? He's always come across as highly intelligent and thoughtful, flat earth nonsense aside

 

[Federberg]

Have to say I felt bad for Lebron as went to the bench just after KD's dagger 3 in the last minute. What the hell does he need to do. You know the Warriors dominance is verging on unfair when even I feel that emotion

 

[the AntiPusher]

Have to say I felt bad for Lebron as went to the bench just after KD's dagger 3 in the last minute. What the hell does he need to do. You know the Warriors dominance is verging on unfair when even I feel that emotion

Being a DUBS fan reminds me when i was a young 49ers fan, the west coast offense was just a work artisty .Watching KD , Da Splash brothers, Draymond and EagleDollar run it to pure perfection. Can't we nust appreciate what we are witnessing like Federer and Rafa?

 

[DarthFed]

Have to say I felt bad for Lebron as went to the bench just after KD's dagger 3 in the last minute. What the hell does he need to do. You know the Warriors dominance is verging on unfair when even I feel that emotion

What he needs to do is leave town haha. No one man is beating the Warriors 4 out of 7.

I also don't feel sorry for him at all because his moves as GM are a big part of the reason the team is like this. The other part that he couldn't have foreseen is...that Celtic we've been talking about Wherever he goes, which ironically could be Philly right after this Colangelo mess, has to tell him to just be player/coach. He is a garbage GM.

He also had a bad game last night for his standards. The average game from him would've been enough to win last night but probably only last night. They may win game 4 but probably not and if they do win it's just GS taking their foot off the pedal. Had Cleveland won last night I think the Warriors would've beaten them in game 4 for sure.

 

[the AntiPusher]

What he needs to do is leave town haha. No one man is beating the Warriors 4 out of 7.

I also don't feel sorry for him at all because his moves as GM are a big part of the reason the team is like this. The other part that he couldn't have foreseen is...that Celtic we've been talking about Wherever he goes, which ironically could be Philly right after this Colangelo mess, has to tell him to just be player/coach. He is a garbage GM.

He also had a bad game last night for his standards. The average game from him would've been enough to win last night but probably only last night. They may win game 4 but probably not and if they do win it's just GS taking their foot off the pedal. Had Cleveland won last night I think the Warriors would've beaten them in game 4 for sure.

Ty Lue won’t be back because those Boys quit on him.. even Lebron can’t save him. Who is the Finals MVP, Step or KD.. I say make it co MVP

 

[DarthFed]

It's close this time but I think KD gets it. Scoring wise they ended up having similar impact but KD was all-around better. Game 1 was obviously huge but game 3 clearly broke Clevelabd's remaining will and that game was all KD.

 

[DarthFed]

Ty Lue won’t be back because those Boys quit on him.. even Lebron can’t save him. Who is the Finals MVP, Step or KD.. I say make it co MVP

Assuming LeBron leaves town I'd say Lue will be gone because he clearly sucks. That team doesn't play hard or smart.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Assuming LeBron leaves town I'd say Lue will be gone because he clearly sucks. That team doesn't play hard or smart.

Why did he choose not to play Rodney Hood who was excellent in game #3? Lebron should tell Dan Gilbert to kiss his laffy taffy for good

 

[Federberg]

It's close this time but I think KD gets it. Scoring wise they ended up having similar impact but KD was all-around better. Game 1 was obviously huge but game 3 clearly broke Clevelabd's remaining will and that game was all KD.

I have to go with KD too. While I think Steph probably edged him in 3 games, the one game where KD was great he was astonishingly great. All those 43 points were heavily contested. I could watch that game again and again

 

[Federberg]

oh dear lord... I hope this isn't the start of some sort of fucked up narrative. Feels like some sort of answer to why the MJ v LJ debate should go on (I feel embarrassed for anyone who brings that nonsense up after this)

 

[kskate2]

Damn. The Lebrons swept in the finals again. He's taken some azz beatings over his finals career..

 

[DarthFed]

Why did he choose not to play Rodney Hood who was excellent in game #3? Lebron should tell Dan Gilbert to kiss his laffy taffy for good

They played him 27 minutes yesterday. He just wasn't going to duplicate game 3 and he is also really really atrocious on defense.

 

[DarthFed]

oh dear lord... I hope this isn't the start of some sort of fucked up narrative. Feels like some sort of answer to why the MJ v LJ debate should go on (I feel embarrassed for anyone who brings that nonsense up after this)

Wow, if Windhorst would admit that LeBron punched the blackboard after game 1 then it probably happened. That guy spends 24/7 hanging from LeBron's nuts and this is a story that obviously makes LeBron look bad. I don't think we've heard a story where he completely loses his cool and does something that stupid. That game 1 loss was obviously the ultimate gut punch for him.

 

[DarthFed]

Damn. The Lebrons swept in the finals again. He's taken some azz beatings over his finals career..

He is 1-8 in his last 9 finals games while putting up 34, 9, 10 on 54% shooting. It just shows how much stronger the Warriors are, because we saw this year that LeBron can singlehandedly beat most teams in this league in a 7 game series, but no one man is taking that juggernaut down. As crazy as it sounds I'm not totally convinced Houston would've beaten him with a hurt CP