2015 Australian Open Final: Djokovic vs. Murray

[Billie]

Well done Nole!! What a way to finish a major final. With determination, being calm and his strength back, it was a pleasure to watch it. Very proud of the effort.:clap

Welcome to the club: 8 Majors matches Agassi, Lendl, & Connors.

Hugs my Nole fans friends:hug:hug:hug

Hugs Billie to you too:hug Great pic with the 8 slam winners.
Do you know when will TSN feature the replay?

Amazing how we used to think 8 majors was "so many" titles to own! With Nadal and Federer's record, it's just not "half bad!" How times have changed! :nono :angel: :dodgy:

Herios: 8pm on TSN.

Fiero: yeah, 8 is an amazing number of majors, and that in the times of the game's greats like Roger and Nadal. Not too shabby for Nole, considering where he came from.

I don't think anybody had to work harder for his majors (looking at the competition that he faced) than Nole. I might be biased, but man this is impressive.:angel:

 

[tenisplayrla08]

Good win for Djokovic. I was looking for anyone who could beat him all tournament. Wawrinka's great performance against Nishikori in the qfs made me think he could handle Novak. He didn't have that level against Novak I'd say for sure. But even if he did, it still wouldn't have been easy and he definitely still could have lost. Murray played great this whole tournament I thought. I didn't think Rafa would be able to beat him after her beat Berdych and then he didn't beat Berdych so it didn't matter.
But in the end, the proof was in the first week. He coasted through the first week. And really coasted until Wawrinka.

Wawrinka-Nishikori in the 3rd set after Nishikori had finally worked up to a usable level was some really nice tennis. Watching Murray work over Berdych was really nice too. I've never seen his game work so great. He really is just amazing with his hands. So much touch. Immensely talented. Can change pace better than anyone on the planet and is just so smart. He just gives people so many looks and they just can't adjust quickly enough because he can change it again the next shot. I was extremely impressed with him. If he can put the final behind him he could have a great year.

Novak up to 8 now. Agassi and Connor's total. Ahead of John McEnroe, Venus Williams and Justine Henin now in the all time list for men and women.

 

[nehmeth]

What is Murray, 2-8 in slam finals?? No need to hate on the guy. He's already hating on himself

:-/

In fairness to Murray, he is facing some pretty serious opposition. He's just not at the same level. Still reaching those finals is an accomplishment in itself, like a second round would be to Potito Starace.

In fairness to Rafa - who watched everyone lose to Fed, he was the only one who had the fortitude to step up and start beating him.

In fairness to Nole who was #3 behind Fedal forever, he took the initiative and did what he had to, in order to start winning against these guys.

So forgive me, if I happen think Murray is a talented guy whose spine left him when Lendl quit.

 

[Kieran]

So forgive me, if I happen think Murray is a talented guy whose spine left him when Lendl quit.

I think he had a back operation to have it removed. :snicker

In fairness to Andy, he was never the most forward bloke on the court. How many times even today he'd be well-positioned to attack, but instead he'd reboot the rally with a neutral shot? Compare that to Fedal or Sampras, or any of the greats, who aim directly for the jugular. That level of bloodlust just isn't part of his game. He turns the hate inward, instead...

 

[GameSetAndMath]

What is Murray, 2-8 in slam finals?? No need to hate on the guy. He's already hating on himself

:-/

Although the basic point is valid, I would like to provide a technical correction. Andy is 2-6 in slams.
Has 25% winning record.

 

[nehmeth]

In fairness to Andy, he was never the most forward bloke on the court. How many times even today he'd be well-positioned to attack, but instead he'd reboot the rally with a neutral shot? Compare that to Fedal or Sampras, or any of the greats, who aim directly for the jugular. That level of bloodlust just isn't part of his game.

Very true Kieran.

 

[Denis]

What is Murray, 2-8 in slam finals?? No need to hate on the guy. He's already hating on himself

:-/

In fairness to Murray, he is facing some pretty serious opposition. He's just not at the same level. Still reaching those finals is an accomplishment in itself, like a second round would be to Potito Starace.

In fairness to Rafa - who watched everyone lose to Fed, he was the only one who had the fortitude to step up and start beating him.

In fairness to Nole who was #3 behind Fedal forever, he took the initiative and did what he had to, in order to start winning against these guys.

So forgive me, if I happen think Murray is a talented guy whose spine left him when Lendl quit.

Fair enough.

 

[Fiero425]

Hugs Billie to you too. :hug Great pic with the 8 Slam winners.
Do you know when will TSN feature the replay?

Amazing how we used to think 8 majors was "so many" titles to own! With Nadal and Federer's record, it's just not "half bad!" How times have changed! :nono :angel: :dodgy:

Herios: 8pm on TSN.

Fiero: Yeah, 8 is an amazing # of majors, and that in the times of the game's greats like Roger and Nadal. Not too shabby for Nole, considering where he came from.

I don't think anybody had to work harder for his majors (looking at the competition that he faced) than Nole. I might be biased, but man this is impressive. :angel:

I couldn't agree more! These "Big 4" are no doubt the best since Borg, Connors, & Lendl, McEnroe! Sampras had competition, but it was intermittent and with different people! Agassi was no real rival with Pete able to rise like the Phoenix in '02 to win his last USO over his favorite "pigeon" in the final! People don't remember how much he had sunk; hadn't won any title of any kind for over 2 years, limped into the USO ranked #22, but seeded #17 IIRC! Like Martina Navratilova in '91, no one gave him a chance, but steadily got better as the matches wore on! Martina didn't finish by taking out Seles in the final, but she was very impressive along the way, upsetting Sanchez in QF and Graf in the semi! We thought it was a golden age even then; look at it now with Federer, Nadal, and Djokovic who will more than likely surpass and be in the double digits in majors! Who would have thought such a thing? Not me that's for sure! I think of myself as a historian, watching tennis on tv since '73, with a lifetime subscription to Tennis and WT mags, and checked out the newspapers every Monday at the library to pick up any tennis news from around the world before the internet! I've never read, seen, or heard of anything better in tennis history! I'm sure the "oldsters" commiserate about how great the roaring 20's were with Tilden, then later the 4 Musketeers, they just didn't have the athleticism of these guys! If you thought the ball moved slowly in the previous era, you'd fall asleep at matches 50-80 years ago! I do ramble when I start to "hark back!" Sorry! Just couldn't have been a better night; Nole taking his 5th in style and Martina Hingis' return to AO to add to her trophy case again after all these years! Bravo! :clap :clap

 

[Billie]

A couple of good articles from AO website about today's final:

http://www.ausopen.com/en_AU/news/articles/2015-02-01/novak_quotes.html

I like this one from Craig O'Shannessy:

http://www.ausopen.com/en_AU/news/articles/2015-02-01/ao_analyser_forehands_rock.html

 

[GameSetAndMath]

In fairness to Andy, he was never the most forward bloke on the court. How many times even today he'd be well-positioned to attack, but instead he'd reboot the rally with a neutral shot? Compare that to Fedal or Sampras, or any of the greats, who aim directly for the jugular. That level of bloodlust just isn't part of his game.

Very true Kieran.

No, actually I don't think that happened today (as often as it would normally happen whne
Andy is playing). Today, very many times Andy was in a winning position in the rally and
overcooked his shot. There were way too many of such overcooked shots from Andy wasting a
winning position.

 

[Billie]

I enjoy reading your posts Fiero, I usually always learn something from tennis history from you.:angel:

I am also glad that Tignor's and Kieran's curse didn't work today, they had me worried in picking Nole to win.:eyepop:ras:

 

[nehmeth]

A couple of good articles from AO website about today's final:

http://www.ausopen.com/en_AU/news/articles/2015-02-01/novak_quotes.html

I like this one from Craig O'Shannessy:

http://www.ausopen.com/en_AU/news/articles/2015-02-01/ao_analyser_forehands_rock.html

Really liked this:

“I think it has deeper meaning, more intrinsic value now to my life because I'm a father and a husband. It's the first Grand Slam title I won as a father and a husband. Just feel very, very proud of it,” he explained.

“I try to stay on the right path and committed to this sport in every possible way that I have had in the last couple of years and try to use this prime time of my career really where I'm playing and feeling the best at 27. This is why I play the sport, you know, to win big titles and to put myself in a position to play also for the people around me.

“Getting married and becoming a father in the last six months was definitely something that gave me a new energy, something that I never felt before. And right now everything has been going in such a positive direction in my life. I'm so grateful for that. So I try to live these moments with all my heart.”

 

[brokenshoelace]

2-8 in slam finals is a terrible ratio regardless of opposition. I mean if Novak had lost this match he would have been successful less than 50% of the times in slam finals, and that's unacceptable, so what does that say about Murray's record? It doesn't help Murray's case that many of the finals he's lost weren't super close matches and he almost always faded midway through.

That said, yes, he is facing stiff competition, but he's talented enough to where he should have won a couple more (no specific matches in mind, to be clear, but just as an absolute idea). However, I don't think the main issue is that he's spineless. I think he's fine in that regard, though not as mentally tough as the other 3 (as far as maintaining focus, approaching the match the right way, not getting too down on himself, etc...) and that has cost him. Still, for the most part, the reason for his slam count (which is pretty good mind you, better than most) is just that he's not as good as the other 3, as highlighted in separate threads.

I do think that we shouldn't be too harsh on the guy and kick him when he's down. He's had a great career so far. I mean, if Federer's entire generation gets a pass for not winning more due to playing Federer (which is fair to some extent), Murray should get leniency (but not a pass) for playing in a loaded era at the top. He's still been super consistent outside of clay and has reached every slam final (other than RG) more than once. I mean, let's keep things in perspective, he's a great player.

 

[TennisFanatic7]

To be fair to Murray, considering he's faced Roger Federer (most major wins of all time) and Novak Djokovic (will at least make double figures) in every one of those eight slam finals (while also playing in the same era as Rafael Nadal, underlining just how difficult it is to reach 8 slam finals in the first place, let alone win them), do you expect him to have a better winning percentage than 25%?

He'd certainly have won a few more if he'd been lucky enough to face the likes of Mark Philippoussis and Mariano Puerta in some of his earlier major finals

 

[Billie]

That is a great part for us, Nole fans, Nehmeth, don't know about others though.

I have to give credit to Jelena, she was amazing in the last couple of matches with her support and motivation from thousands of kms away. She kept tweeting, sending him positive vibes, photos of the little boy. She was so nervous today when Nole started to physically struggle that she took the baby and the dogs for a short walk. These things are valuable for Nole as he is very emotional and really feeds off good vibrations. :angel:

 

[Fiero425]

I enjoy reading your posts Fiero, I usually always learn something from tennis history from you.:angel:

I am also glad that Tignor's and Kieran's curse didn't work today, they had me worried in picking Nole to win.:eyepop:ras:

You are too kind! Thanks! :wave :shy: It didn't look good starting with Nole being all at sea a couple nights ago! He fell on his hand, seemed to slide and twist something in an ankle, disruptions all night long in the stands, and Andy's new found aggressive play! With Nole's penchant for making matches more difficult for himself, he didn't disappoint the seers! He was pretty much on a roll and ready to close that match out in straights; didn't happen again! :nono uzzled I'm happy enough and will have bragging rights with the rest of the NOLE fans trying to hold off the nostalgia of Federer and Nadal's "comings and goings!" :angel: :dodgy: :ras:

 

[Billie]

I enjoy reading your posts Fiero, I usually always learn something from tennis history from you.:angel:

I am also glad that Tignor's and Kieran's curse didn't work today, they had me worried in picking Nole to win.:eyepop:ras:

You are too kind! Thanks! :wave :shy: It didn't look good starting with Nole being all at sea a couple nights ago! He fell on his hand, seemed to slide and twist something in an ankle, disruptions all night long in the stands, and Andy's new found aggressive play! With Nole's penchant for making matches more difficult for himself, he didn't disappoint the seers! He was pretty much on a role and ready to close that match out in straights; didn't happen again! :nono uzzled I'm happy enough and will have bragging rights with the rest of the NOLE fans trying to hold off the nostalgia of Federer and Nadal's "comings and goings!" :angel: :dodgy: :ras:

:heart: You should have seen me towards the end of the 2nd set. We call watching live Nole's matches Nolecoasters for a reason. He explained it in the presser:

Q. How do you explain looking as if you're almost out of it physically and mentally and then within two games managing to switch round to running. He thought you were cramping.

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: No, I wasn't cramping. I didn't call a timeout because I had no reason to call it. I was just weak. I went through the physical crisis in the matter of 20 minutes. And, honestly, didn't feel that too many times in my career. But knowing in the back of my mind that it was a similar situation two years ago in Australian Open final, 2013, where two sets went over two hours, was a similar battle. Then I felt that I had some physical edge over him in that match. That was in back of my mind. That was something that kept me going. And obviously the importance of the moment, being in finals of Grand Slam. I didn't want to give up. I try never to give up. Even though I went through this moment, I believed that I'm going to get that necessary strength. I'm going to have to earn it, and that's what I did. I started hitting the ball more, covering the court better, shortening the points, and allowed myself to come back to the match.

Q. Was it a dehydration issue or energy issue?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: No, I'm really professional in terms of hydrating myself and getting the necessary substance, food, you know, these energy gels and stuff that you need during the match. It's just that the length of the rallies and the physicality that we had in the first two sets have taken an energy from me. It's normal to expect that you can't always be, you know, at your 100%. So you go through some particular moments that you can call crises during matches like these. This is what I had in these 15, 20 minutes. After that I felt better.

Q. Is it a lingering result of the virus that you picked up in Doha?

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: It's hard to say because that was now two and a half weeks ago. Maybe. Maybe now it came up, the consequences of that, the consequences of not being able to really get myself 100% fit and ready for this tournament. This practice week here was more of a recovery week, not a practice week. As the tournament progressed, I felt better and better. But, you know, I think the end of the day the willpower that I had on the court today took me to where I am now.

Q. Early in the second set you fell over and seemed to have a few points where you were struggling with your ankle.

NOVAK DJOKOVIC: No, no, no, no. I wasn't. Again, same reason that I mentioned before. You know, just the length of the rallies. That's what has taken this physical toll on my body.


My take on all this: he hasn't had the proper off season (almost like Federer), played that IPTL, then spent all of his free time with his new baby, prepared a little, went to UAE and picked up a virus (all three of them were sick: Nole, Jelena and the baby). Hasn't recovered in Doha, came to AO and then all the sponsors' obligations (Jacob's Creek and ANZ), it was just too much. Luckily he was able to sustain it, but it wasn't easy on him. Hopefully he will cut out on his off court activities a bit for the rest of the season.

 

[Kieran]

He'd certainly have won a few more if he'd been lucky enough to face the likes of Mark Philippoussis and Mariano Puerta in some of his earlier major finals

I agree. If Murray had faced the same opposition Roger faced in his first 8 slam finals, he'd be better off than he is now, by far. It hasn't been an easy bunch to take down for Andy, but by the same measure, this only emphasises that he's not in not in the same league as the other "Three". Rafa's first 8 slam finals all involved Roger, except the first one (Puerta), out of which he was 6-2, and Novak faced Rafa, Roger or Andy in 7 of his first 8, out of which he was 5-3....

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

My husband who still lives in the era of Pete Sampras,yes he refuses to move on?

Went to bed at the end of the 3rd set and said to me?

'This is a men's final? well God help both players' he wasnt impressed with the level of either Novak or Murray,lesser extent of Murray.When I told him this morning the final score and it was a bagel to Novak,he said 'thank goodness Murray left the court in the 4th set'.....

 

[Fiero425]

He'd certainly have won a few more if he'd been lucky enough to face the likes of Mark Philippoussis and Mariano Puerta in some of his earlier major finals

I agree. If Murray had faced the same opposition Roger faced in his first 8 slam finals, he'd be better off than he is now, by far. It hasn't been an easy bunch to take down for Andy, but by the same measure, this only emphasizes that he's not in the same league as the other "Three". Rafa's first 8 Slam finals all involved Roger, except the first one (Puerta), out of which he was 6-2, and Novak faced Rafa, Roger or Andy in 7 of his first 8; out of which he was 5-3....

That was the reason I downgraded Sampras' GOAT resume; too many of those weak finals with "also rans" and "never weres!" :angel: As I posted before, Sampras never had a sustain rivalry, even though historians try to make Agassi his foil! Pete won MOST of their major matches; usually with little fuss or muss! I still remember back in '90 USO; I thought nothing of this kid! I figured Agassi would roll him so I went out to play myself and expected to catch the end! The one that was "rolled" was Andre who was smoked in about an hour and a half! I never saw the match until Classic channel put it out there years later! It was a dismantling and to this day I still wonder about Agassi, his following, and of course the underachieving; "coming and going" like Nadal it seems! :nono :angel: :cover