Rolex Paris Masters 1000, Bercy

[Fiero425]

Seems presumptuous. He could end up in a group with Roger, Goffin and Thiem. The later two are very beatable. Or Nadal, Zverev and Thiem. All three of them would be vulnerable - Thiem's played like caca since he lost to DelPo at the USO, Zverev would be tired from playing in Milan this week and Nadal will be playing injured. Okay...who am I kidding...even beating an injured Nadal is probably over-reaching for Sock...

I thought I read Sasha was skipping Next Gen to rest up! :sleep:

 

[Busted]

All I have to say about Sock winning a Masters 1000 event is - If Dimitrov can win one in this decimated field this year...then it makes complete sense that Sock would win one, too. They're about the same talent level - average. This is the 3rd major event this year where the winner didn't have to beat anyone inside the Top 15 (Cincy, USO, Paris). If this keeps up pretty soon the quality of the men's tour going to be as shitty as the women's. This is like parity in football - only worse because tennis has relied on the top 4 guys to keep the interest high. As all the empty seats in Paris proved.

 

[Busted]

I thought I read Sasha was skipping Next Gen to rest up! :sleep:

Is he? I hadn't read that. If so...kinda says what he thinks of his age group peers, doesn't it? He's a big boy now and they're all still little fishes. That seemed like a slam dunk title to me...so if he loses 3 matches in London - does he kick himself for skipping Milan?

OK...went and checked the ATP site...they have removed Zverev's photo from the list of players attending.

 

[Fiero425]

All I have to say about Sock winning a Masters 1000 event is - If Dimitrov can win one in this decimated field this year...then it makes complete sense that Sock would win one, too. They're about the same talent level - average. This is the 3rd major event this year where the winner didn't have to beat anyone inside the Top 15 (Cincy, USO, Paris). If this keeps up pretty soon the quality of the men's tour going to be as shitty as the women's. This is like parity in football - only worse because tennis has relied on the top 4 guys to keep the interest high. As all the empty seats in Paris proved.

You're kidding? Baby Fed is still "head and shoulders" above a player like Sock even with his mental flaws! He's more than a mindlessly aggressive player and has all the shots! Sock's a serve and FH alone; not much else! His type of play can't be sustained! As soon as he goes against an elite player who isn't impressed by his power, he won't do much better than his brethren with the same deficiencies; Querrey, Harrison, Isner and so many others from the States! Comparable differences would be in football with a top QB; his backup might even save them in a game due to injury, but he won't take them to a Super Bowl! There are levels that exist & Sock just ain't "there" yet! :whistle:

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

Seems presumptuous. He could end up in a group with Roger, Goffin and Thiem. The later two are very beatable. Or Nadal, Zverev and Thiem. All three of them would be vulnerable - Thiem's played like caca since he lost to DelPo at the USO, Zverev would be tired from playing in Milan this week and Nadal will be playing injured. Okay...who am I kidding...even beating an injured Nadal is probably over-reaching for Sock...

You are right, I wasn't being fair to Sock. He accomplished something that is pretty big for him actually. He may even beat someone in London, who knows...confidence is a funny thing.

 

[mrzz]

And? what’s your point?

No point, Carol, just teasing and having lighthearted fun.

 

[El Dude]

I agree that Dimitrov is a far more talented player than Sock - more multi-dimensional. Grigor is an underachiever, Sock is not.

 

[herios]

You're kidding? Baby Fed is still "head and shoulders" above a player like Sock even with his mental flaws! He's more than a mindlessly aggressive player and has all the shots! Sock's a serve and FH alone; not much else! His type of play can't be sustained! As soon as he goes against an elite player who isn't impressed by his power, he won't do much better than his brethren with the same deficiencies; Querrey, Harrison, Isner and so many others from the States! Comparable differences would be in football with a top QB; his backup might even save them in a game due to injury, but he won't take them to a Super Bowl! There are levels that exist & Sock just ain't "there" yet! :whistle:

Grigor can have all the shots if he is losing this often it does not mean a thing.
Pretty lame to not been able to come even close to a title which in the end was disputed by Sock and Krajinovic.

 

[Fiero425]

Grigor can have all the shots if he is losing this often it does not mean a thing.
Pretty lame to not been able to come even close to a title which in the end was disputed by Sock and Krajinovic.

I've discounted Paris for over 20 years! It's been a joke since the inception of the event where it can determine the last qualifier for the YEC, but the players are usually spent or skipping it to prepare for the last event of the season! Paris is the one event that has so many anonymous upset wins during the week with pretty poor finals! :cuckoo:

 

[herios]

I

I agree that Dimitrov is a far more talented player than Sock - more multi-dimensional. Grigor is an underachiever, Sock is not.

I am tired of rooting for Grigor. Very inefficient when it comes to results.
Talents means yada if it is not converted in accomplishments.

 

[herios]

I've discounted Paris for over 20 years! It's been a joke since the inception of the event where it can determine the last qualifier for the YEC, but the players are usually spent or skipping it to prepare for the last event of the season! Paris is the one event that has so many anonymous upset wins during the week with pretty poor finals! :cuckoo:

Joke or not, it counts In a resume.

 

[El Dude]

I

I am tired of rooting for Grigor. Very inefficient when it comes to results.
Talents means yada if it is not converted in accomplishments.

Sure. I was tired of rooting for Grigor a few years ago, but have since accepted for who he is and is not. But he's still fun to watch.

 

[Fiero425]

Joke or not, it counts In a resume.

Grigor's Cinci. Masters win more impressive without even seeing it!

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Is he? I hadn't read that. If so...kinda says what he thinks of his age group peers, doesn't it? He's a big boy now and they're all still little fishes. That seemed like a slam dunk title to me...so if he loses 3 matches in London - does he kick himself for skipping Milan?

OK...went and checked the ATP site...they have removed Zverev's photo from the list of players attending.

No, he won't kick himself for skipping Milan even if he loses all matches in London (which he will not). This is because, London offers lot more money (even if he loses all matches) and a chance to get some points. Milan is an experimental event with no points (even if you win the event) and much less money. Further, playing in London will be a huge experience and might potentially improve his game and attitude.

 

[El Dude]

Milan is like a glorified Juniors tournament. Zverev has fully graduated, so it makes sense to skip and play with the big boys.

I mean, I exaggerate - but even the fact that it offers no points kind of diminishes it. I'm excited about it, but it is more a way to showcase new and lesser known talent. Zverev has already graduated from that; he hasn't yet reached his potential and is not in the same league as the Big Four, but he's a true top 10 player already.

 

[Fiero425]

Milan is like a glorified Juniors tournament. Zverev has fully graduated, so it makes sense to skip and play with the big boys.

I mean, I exaggerate - but even the fact that it offers no points kind of diminishes it. I'm excited about it, but it is more a way to showcase new and lesser known talent. Zverev has already graduated from that; he hasn't yet reached his potential and is not in the same league as the Big Four, but he's a true top 10 player already.

The scoring changes made giving any credit for winning the event prohibitive! I think we need some rule changes, but that's extreme with TB's at 3 all and NO-Ad scoring! You're barely warmed up, then almost halfway out the door! I think Rafa would have to retire because he'd never win another match! :whistle:

 

[Federberg]

I can't see how this NextGen thing will ever really take off. Every player there will be doing everything they can to qualifier for the big thing. It's going to be a losers consolation type of thing. Call me a reactionary but I don't like a lot of the rule changes they're trying to make either. Why people constantly think that changes need to be made I'll never understand. It's not a valid argument to me that because other sports have the equivalent of on court coaching it means it's a good thing to bring to tennis. That's a unique selling point for tennis ffs

 

[GameSetAndMath]

I can't see how this NextGen thing will ever really take off. Every player there will be doing everything they can to qualifier for the big thing. It's going to be a losers consolation type of thing. Call me a reactionary but I don't like a lot of the rule changes they're trying to make either. Why people constantly think that changes need to be made I'll never understand. It's not a valid argument to me that because other sports have the equivalent of on court coaching it means it's a good thing to bring to tennis. That's a unique selling point for tennis ffs

I do like the idea of a WTF for young players that they are trying to do now. But, I don't like the rule changes. This is much better than WTA has: a regular WTF and a loser's WTF.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Roger played only four ATP 1000 events this year (this means he skipped more of them than he played in), but he made the finals of all four and won three of them. Amazing hit ratio.

 

[Fiero425]

Roger played only four ATP 1000 events this year (this means he skipped more of them than he played in), but he made the finals of all four and won three of them. Amazing hit ratio.

Very impressive! Not sure if anyone will beat that ratio except maybe Nole in 2015 playing in 8 of 9 Masters, made each final, and won 6! Anyone in the 'next gen' capable of that kind of excellence? Doubtful! It should be a wild 2018 after a rather mundane '06 Redux with Nadal and Federer "splitting the spoils!" The only thing that makes thing hopeful in watching tennis is we did get some new winners of "1000's" with Sasha & Grigor sharing 3! That's more of the Masters going to players outside the "Big 4" in over a decade!