Roland Garros Day 7: Saturday, May 31 - Order of Play

[Moxie]

I'll never understand why the French refuse to get a light above Chatrier.

The new expansion/renovation plans are scheduled for completion by 2018. They'll include lights and some roofs.

Sadly a bit late for fans of many of the top players right now though :nono

What are you going to do, though? All of these improvements involve public funds and political machinations. Complaints about the USO are worse. In a time of global economic difficulties, I don't think improving tennis facilities are top priority. They're all getting upgraded, eventually. But, let's be real…no lights or roofs on tennis stadiums is the definition of a "first-world problem."

 

[Moxie]

I think it's safe to assume that The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now.

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

Your comment was about The Big Four, and Broken just went down the list of them, with his opinions. Didn't make it a Nadal-thing, he just started with him. I agree with him that it's early to say they're done, including what you just said about Murray, who you claim as your favorite of them. Murray's coming back from back surgery, and now he's on clay, his least favorite surface. I don't really think he's anywhere near "done." It's really silly to be so black and white. Have a little patience.

 

[TennisFanatic7]

What an odd performance from Murray today. Didn't play too bad in the opening set, just his serve that was troubling him, then he looked as if he had it sussed until suddenly deciding to capitulate in the fourth.

I was undecided whether I wanted the light to fade or not in the fifth set. It worries me that he's serving first tomorrow as his serve has often been dodgy in the opening stages of matches this year, but if he gets through the first game and holds I think he'll manage to get the victory.

Leonardo Mayer put up a surprisingly decent fight against Rafa at times today. The Monfils Fognini match was entertaining but christ, how much of an utter douchebag is Fabio? Throwing his racket away, getting warned for bad language, sulking like an idiot for stages in the match, and then pictured leaving the court with his middle finger up. That match was there for the taking today and if Murray and Gasquet end up losing tomorrow, he'd have been the highest seed left in the quarter if he'd have concentrated and put Monfils away today. Some people like Fognini because he's a character or whatnot, but I have less and less time for the guy every time he plays.

 

[brokenshoelace]

I think it's safe to assume that The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now.

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

 

[brokenshoelace]

I'll never understand why the French refuse to get a light above Chatrier.

The new expansion/renovation plans are scheduled for completion by 2018. They'll include lights and some roofs.

Thank goodness. Though I really don't think it should have taken them that long to put some lights. It's not like this is a new issue and while I'm not an expert about the logistics, it shouldn't require some long term plan. Oh well, better late than never.

 

[Moxie]

What an odd performance from Murray today. Didn't play too bad in the opening set, just his serve that was troubling him, then he looked as if he had it sussed until suddenly deciding to capitulate in the fourth.

I was undecided whether I wanted the light to fade or not in the fifth set. It worries me that he's serving first tomorrow as his serve has often been dodgy in the opening stages of matches this year, but if he gets through the first game and holds I think he'll manage to get the victory.

Leonardo Mayer put up a surprisingly decent fight against Rafa at times today. The Monfils Fognini match was entertaining but christ, how much of an utter douchebag is Fabio? Throwing his racket away, getting warned for bad language, sulking like an idiot for stages in the match, and then pictured leaving the court with his middle finger up. That match was there for the taking today and if Murray and Gasquet end up losing tomorrow, he'd have been the highest seed left in the quarter if he'd have concentrated and put Monfils away today. Some people like Fognini because he's a character or whatnot, but I have less and less time for the guy every time he plays.

Mayer fought a bit in the 2nd, but it was what he had. Personally, I'd like to see Rafa working on the things that will get him the bigger wins later, not coasting against guys that aren't going to beat him, anyway.

I'm completely over Fabio Fognini. As Broken said, he completely tanked that last game. He swears in Italian and dares umps to call him on it. (Bernardes understands him, and gives no quarter on that.) I've liked his game, and have found him amusing in the past, but now I just think he's vile.

 

[Moxie]

I'll never understand why the French refuse to get a light above Chatrier.

The new expansion/renovation plans are scheduled for completion by 2018. They'll include lights and some roofs.

Thank goodness. Though I really don't think it should have taken them that long to put some lights. It's not like this is a new issue and while I'm not an expert about the logistics, it shouldn't require some long term plan. Oh well, better late than never.

I won't bore you with the logistics, though you can google it. You may, or may not remember that they were considering relocating the whole complex. But that was going to cost upwards of $1billion…and I'm not exaggerating. The machinations are complicated, but it's a public works project, so expect delays. (They've already put it off from a projected 2016.)

 

[Kirijax]

I think it's safe to assume that The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now.

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

Your comment was about The Big Four, and Broken just went down the list of them, with his opinions. Didn't make it a Nadal-thing, he just started with him. I agree with him that it's early to say they're done, including what you just said about Murray, who you claim as your favorite of them. Murray's coming back from back surgery, and now he's on clay, his least favorite surface. I don't really think he's anywhere near "done." It's really silly to be so black and white. Have a little patience.

LOL. You guys are the ones that keep making it a Nadal thing.

 

[Moxie]

I think it's safe to assume that The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now.

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

Your comment was about The Big Four, and Broken just went down the list of them, with his opinions. Didn't make it a Nadal-thing, he just started with him. I agree with him that it's early to say they're done, including what you just said about Murray, who you claim as your favorite of them. Murray's coming back from back surgery, and now he's on clay, his least favorite surface. I don't really think he's anywhere near "done." It's really silly to be so black and white. Have a little patience.

LOL. You guys are the ones that keep making it a Nadal thing.

Now, that's just childish, and you didn't read. Who are the Big Four? Nadal, Djokovic, Federer and Murray, in order of current ranking. Who else do you expect anyone to talk about? And, ahem, it's you who brought in the Big 4.

 

[Kirijax]

I think it's safe to assume that The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now.

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

It was a post about Murray and being included in the former Big Four. And you wrongly assumed the Big One did not mean Nadal. Like I said, well done in trying to defend your favorite boy as if someone had slammed him when all you did was completely assume wrong. You make your fellow Nadalists proud. Well done indeed indeed. :clap

 

[Moxie]

I think it's safe to assume that The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now.

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

It was a post about Murray and being included in the former Big Four. And you wrongly assumed the Big One did not mean Nadal. Like I said, well done in trying to defend your favorite boy as if someone had slammed him when all you did was completely assume wrong. You make your fellow Nadalists proud. Well done indeed indeed. :clap

I bolded your original post, which BS responded to. It didn't mention Murray in particular. It was about the big 4. (And you did mention a notion of a big "1 and a half.") I don't think I wrongly assumed when you said Big 1, you didn't mean Nadal, nor do I suspect BS did. We didn't assume anything on that. However, as that was still something for you to elucidate, BS, and I, responded to the Big 4 comment. Before you assume prejudice on the part of others, why don't you look first at your post, which we were responding to?

Tempest in a teapot, really.

 

[Kirijax]

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

It was a post about Murray and being included in the former Big Four. And you wrongly assumed the Big One did not mean Nadal. Like I said, well done in trying to defend your favorite boy as if someone had slammed him when all you did was completely assume wrong. You make your fellow Nadalists proud. Well done indeed indeed. :clap

I bolded your original post, which BS responded to. It didn't mention Murray in particular. It was about the big 4. (And you did mention a notion of a big "1 and a half.") I don't think I wrongly assumed when you said Big 1, you didn't mean Nadal, nor do I suspect BS did. We didn't assume anything on that. However, as that was still something for you to elucidate, BS, and I, responded to the Big 4 comment. Before you assume prejudice on the part of others, why don't you look first at your post, which we were responding to?

Tempest in a teapot, really.

Which you both keep bringing around to Nadal. I'm not really interested in talking about him at this point, so I'll leave you Nadal fans to it. I'd like you guys to reread my post as well. But I'm done talking about this so Nadalchat all you want.

 

[Moxie]

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

It was a post about Murray and being included in the former Big Four. And you wrongly assumed the Big One did not mean Nadal. Like I said, well done in trying to defend your favorite boy as if someone had slammed him when all you did was completely assume wrong. You make your fellow Nadalists proud. Well done indeed indeed. :clap

I bolded your original post, which BS responded to. It didn't mention Murray in particular. It was about the big 4. (And you did mention a notion of a big "1 and a half.") I don't think I wrongly assumed when you said Big 1, you didn't mean Nadal, nor do I suspect BS did. We didn't assume anything on that. However, as that was still something for you to elucidate, BS, and I, responded to the Big 4 comment. Before you assume prejudice on the part of others, why don't you look first at your post, which we were responding to?

Tempest in a teapot, really.

Which you both keep bringing around to Nadal. I'm not really interested in talking about him at this point, so I'll leave you Nadal fans to it. I'd like you guys to reread my post as well. But I'm done talking about this so Nadalchat all you want.

If you don't want to talk about Nadal, then I'm not sure why you brought up the Big Four. But let's move on. Let me ask you this: what would you like to talk about? You've said there is a "Big One and a Half." So…what would you like to posit about that? You suggested your mention was Murray. Who is your biggest "one and a half?" That could be a fun debate.

 

[brokenshoelace]

I think it's safe to assume that The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now.

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

It was a post about Murray and being included in the former Big Four. And you wrongly assumed the Big One did not mean Nadal. Like I said, well done in trying to defend your favorite boy as if someone had slammed him when all you did was completely assume wrong. You make your fellow Nadalists proud. Well done indeed indeed. :clap

It wasn't just a post about Murray since you said "it's now the big one and a half." I'm not math expert, but this means that 3 members of the big 4 are no longer that "big." Two are gone completely and one of them is reduced to being a "half."

So no, it wasn't just about Murray. Please, stop trying to backpedal when what you wrote is write there for all of us to see.

 

[Kirijax]

You think playing against Nadal on clay scares no one? And people are kidding themselves if they think Andy Murray is just going to disappear off the face of the earth. He'll be making plenty of finals and winning titles for the next couple of years. He's not done by any means.

Anyway, there's a good chance of seeing at least 3 of the big 4 in the semis in this very tournament, and there's still a chance we see all 4 of them so I think this is a bit premature.

However, yes, with Roger getting old, Nadal getting older/being injured/having mileage, the big four are not going to dominate like before, and we've seen that already.

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

It was a post about Murray and being included in the former Big Four. And you wrongly assumed the Big One did not mean Nadal. Like I said, well done in trying to defend your favorite boy as if someone had slammed him when all you did was completely assume wrong. You make your fellow Nadalists proud. Well done indeed indeed. :clap

It wasn't just a post about Murray since you said "it's now the big one and a half." I'm not math expert, but this means that 3 members of the big 4 are no longer that "big." Two are gone completely and one of them is reduced to being a "half."

So no, it wasn't just about Murray. Please, stop trying to backpedal when what you wrote is write there for all of us to see.

And you can please stop trying to act like you understood what was being said. You completely missed it. But good job in bringing it around to Nadal no matter what. Impressive. And it was about Murray. I simply stated how he is no longer part of the Big Four which means there is no Big Four so I simply said what I think is the Big Whatever right now. But you immediately took offense to it meaning your dear sweet Nadal is no longer The Big One.

This is the French Open we're talking about. Nadal has won the last 8 of 9 FOs and has played fantastic the first week. Who else would be The Big One? Djoko? The guy who has never won and has a dodgy wrist? The guy who has the worst overhead in the history of No. 1s and doesn't know the rules? And yet you got all tied up in knots thinking Djoko was The Big One and Nadal the half. And that led you to completely getting all turned around and upside down. Please read with an open mind before you get all "Rafensive". This isn't going anywhere and I'm tired of talking about it. If you want to keep reading posts with Rafa-colored glasses go right ahead. I'm moving on. I suggest you do the same.

 

[mrzz]

Probably absurd question:

Is there a chance that Nadal is "saving" his serve for latter rounds?

Probably absurd comment:

Do most players read a book called "how not to play Nadal", and miss the word "not"? The guy makes a good approach shot turn in to a bad one... so DO NOT go the net after an originally bad one... Isn't it obvious?

 

[Moxie]

Said nothing about Nadal in my quote and yet you turned into a Nadal thing. Well done! I am losing confidence by the tournament in Murray ever returning to 2012-13 level. He is my favorite of the big four so it would be great to see him return but if he flops in Queens and Wimby he's probably done.

"The Big Four is a thing of the past and scares no one. It's the Big One and a Half now."

You said that the big four scare no one now. And you said big one and a half (I'm assuming Nadal is the half). And how did I turn it into a Nadal thing when I talked about Nadal, Murray AND Federer? You mentioned the big four. Of course I'll be talking about players within the big four.

You talk about the big four, of which Nadal is a part, then you claim you said nothing about him. Well done indeed.

It was a post about Murray and being included in the former Big Four. And you wrongly assumed the Big One did not mean Nadal. Like I said, well done in trying to defend your favorite boy as if someone had slammed him when all you did was completely assume wrong. You make your fellow Nadalists proud. Well done indeed indeed. :clap

It wasn't just a post about Murray since you said "it's now the big one and a half." I'm not math expert, but this means that 3 members of the big 4 are no longer that "big." Two are gone completely and one of them is reduced to being a "half."

So no, it wasn't just about Murray. Please, stop trying to backpedal when what you wrote is write there for all of us to see.

And you can please stop trying to act like you understood what was being said. You completely missed it. But good job in bringing it around to Nadal no matter what. Impressive. And it was about Murray. I simply stated how he is no longer part of the Big Four which means there is no Big Four so I simply said what I think is the Big Whatever right now. But you immediately took offense to it meaning your dear sweet Nadal is no longer The Big One.

This is the French Open we're talking about. Nadal has won the last 8 of 9 FOs and has played fantastic the first week. Who else would be The Big One? Djoko? The guy who has never won and has a dodgy wrist? The guy who has the worst overhead in the history of No. 1s and doesn't know the rules? And yet you got all tied up in knots thinking Djoko was The Big One and Nadal the half. And that led you to completely getting all turned around and upside down. Please read with an open mind before you get all "Rafensive". This isn't going anywhere and I'm tired of talking about it. If you want to keep reading posts with Rafa-colored glasses go right ahead. I'm moving on. I suggest you do the same.

I'm sorry you're bailing, because a good debate is always worthwhile. However, your above sort of implies that you had lots of things in your mind that weren't really stated. Either state your case, and argue the points, or don't, but it's not down to others to put words in your mouth until you write them down. Your argument has only become more opaque. I wish you'd try again, rather than becoming irritated with others, and then pulling up shop and going home. :angel:

 

[Moxie]

Probably absurd question:

Is there a chance that Nadal is "saving" his serve for latter rounds?

Probably absurd comment:

Do most players read a book called "how not to play Nadal", and miss the word "not"? The guy makes a good approach shot turn in to a bad one... so DO NOT go the net after an originally bad one... Isn't it obvious?

The Nadal serve, and it's comings and goings continues to be a mystery. :emperor:

As to "how to play Nadal," and the playbook: part of the problem is that most players try to do what they can, but there's only so much they can do, particularly on clay. If they stay back, they lose in the rally; if they approach, they often get passed. Don't act like it's easy. Only a few have the answer, and then only sometimes. If a player approaches, it's because he's trying to mix it up from getting killed from the baseline. Don't blame them if that doesn't work, either. They're not stupid…they're just not as good.

 

[mrzz]

Probably absurd question:

Is there a chance that Nadal is "saving" his serve for latter rounds?

Probably absurd comment:

Do most players read a book called "how not to play Nadal", and miss the word "not"? The guy makes a good approach shot turn in to a bad one... so DO NOT go the net after an originally bad one... Isn't it obvious?

The Nadal serve, and it's comings and goings continues to be a mystery. :emperor:

As to "how to play Nadal," and the playbook: part of the problem is that most players try to do what they can, but there's only so much they can do, particularly on clay. If they stay back, they lose in the rally; if they approach, they often get passed. Don't act like it's easy. Only a few have the answer, and then only sometimes. If a player approaches, it's because he's trying to mix it up from getting killed from the baseline. Don't blame them if that doesn't work, either. They're not stupid…they're just not as good.

Never said it was easy... only that people sometimes seem suicidal... and I now they are not stupid (well, most of them), that's why Iḿ interested in the answer...

I'll give an example: obviously Mayer was not going to win, however: First set, first games, when he was being agressive from the baseline, he was missing shots by some inches. If he could hit them in, it could be a bit more competitive. What he does? Gets passive from the baseline and approches the net with mediocre shots. And gets killed. So he was on a strategy that had a, say, 20% chance to make it more competitive, and what he does? Changes to one where he has 20000% chance to be slaughtered.

On the second, he gave his best, didn't suicide, and also thanks to Nadal serve, made it competitive. One set like this should teach a lot to a tennis player ranked below 50. That's the main reason I think that's the attitude they should bring. Of course they can still be beaten 6x1 or 6x0 like this, but it is always better to come down fighting, and learning, than watching. Specially if you are a guy who can strike (as Mayer can).

 

[Moxie]

^ I think you presume too much that people can play outside of their comfort zone for any length of time. The answer to Nadal is much more what Djokovic has done, what Nishikori was doing, what Soderling and Davydenko beat him on: be aggressive, take the ball early, neutralize the spin. But that's still easier said than done. For the guys like Mayer, who don't have that in their game, you can't expect that they'd manufacture on one day, even if it would make good sense. You have to have that tool, before you can employ it.