2018 ATP General News

[mrzz]

You might see this in other sources, but I got a detailed coverage here in Brazil: Bellucci got a 5 months ban for use of prohibited substance, however he alledged -- and proved -- that the traces of a diuretic found on his samples were due to contamination on manipulated vitamins he took. The traces found on him match the traces found on the legal vitamins he routinely takes. He got the minimum possible sentence as ITF saw it was an honest mistake, and basically punished him for being not cautious enough.

Here' s a link in Portuguese for the ones who would like to venture -- oddly enough is on "mainstream" media.

Edit: Better link here.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

You might see this in other sources, but I got a detailed coverage here in Brazil: Bellucci got a 5 months ban for use of prohibited substance, however he alledged -- and proved -- that the traces of a diuretic found on his samples were due to contamination on manipulated vitamins he took. The traces found on him match the traces found on the legal vitamins he routinely takes. He got the minimum possible sentence as ITF saw it was an honest mistake, and basically punished him for being not cautious enough.

Here' s a link in Portuguese for the ones who would like to venture -- oddly enough is on "mainstream" media.

The trouble with diuretics is that they are masking agents and are usually used to mask the other more serious drugs the offender may be taking.

 

[Moxie]

The trouble with diuretics is that they are masking agents and are usually used to mask the other more serious drugs the offender may be taking.

Yes, and the articles note that. But it says that the vitamins he got from the US and Canada were WADA approved, and contaminated, but matched the vitamins he usually takes. (If I got all of that right, @mrzz. Thanks for the chance to practice my Portuguese. ) It does seem a plausible case.

 

[mrzz]

The trouble with diuretics is that they are masking agents and are usually used to mask the other more serious drugs the offender may be taking.

Yep, found this out now, but on the links I provided -- and others I found here -- it shows that Bellucci invested a lot in proving his innocence, among other things sending samples of hair and nails for different labs across the globe, surely to show that the traces of diuretic did not masked traces of anything else. Ironically the last thing Bellucci should use is diuretics, one physical issue he has, diagnosed since his junior days, causes excessive sweating...

Yes, and the articles note that. But it says that the vitamins he got from the US and Canada were WADA approved, and contaminated, but matched the vitamins he usually takes. (If I got all of that right, @mrzz. Thanks for the chance to practice my Portuguese. ) It does seem a plausible case.

You got it all right! Parabéns, cara amiga.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

ATP folks are still untrustworthy. They said an year ago that they are stopping the practice of silent ban and will immediately announce if anyone tested positive for anything. Belluci tested positive on July 18th. He was notified on Sep 18th. His five months punishment was from Sep. 1st to Jan 31st. The final decision on the case was taken on Dec. 31st. They are telling us now.

They should have told us on the same day (viz. Sep. 18th) that they notified Belluci that he tested positive and they are investigating the situation as per their own rules. If they are not following their own rules, how do you trust them?

 

[Moxie]

ATP folks are still untrustworthy. They said an year ago that they are stopping the practice of silent ban and will immediately announce if anyone tested positive for anything. Belluci tested positive on July 18th. He was notified on Sep 18th. His five months punishment was from Sep. 1st to Jan 31st. The final decision on the case was taken on Dec. 31st. They are telling us now.

They should have told us on the same day (viz. Sep. 18th) that they notified Belluci that he tested positive and they are investigating the situation as per their own rules. If they are not following their own rules, how do you trust them?

Here's where I don't agree with your disgruntlement: Now that they have sorted the case out, it has become public. However, when the initial bad test was taken, and until the case was adjudicated, doesn't it put the player in a bad position, should the tests prove false, or that there prove to be attenuating circumstances, as in Belluci's case? I actually do think that the ITF should keep things quiet until they investigate, because even the suggestion taints a player's career. However, now they have ruled, and they did come out with it. That seems fair.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Here's where I don't agree with your disgruntlement: Now that they have sorted the case out, it has become public. However, when the initial bad test was taken, and until the case was adjudicated, doesn't it put the player in a bad position, should the tests prove false, or that there prove to be attenuating circumstances, as in Belluci's case? I actually do think that the ITF should keep things quiet until they investigate, because even the suggestion taints a player's career. However, now they have ruled, and they did come out with it. That seems fair.

That was the old scenario, where they will announce the situation only after they have reached the final verdict. But, as a result whenever somebody is not playing, there was a suspicion as to whether they are under investigation. In order to actually prevent this suspicion, after the Meldopova case, the ITF/ATP/WTA jointly announced that from now on, they will immediately announce to the public once somebody is tested positive. These folks think rules don't apply to themselves. They said the will follow this scheme and they are not following.

See this article when they announced silent ban is over on Aug. 25, 2016. Here is the key statement: "Acknowledging the sport’s reputation has been damaged by a lack of transparency surrounding doping violations, the ITF yesterday announced that from next month any provisional suspensions would be publicly announced"

I don't see why that is considered tainting a person's career. After all in the regular court system, if somebody is charged with a crime, then immediately the papers publish it. For all you know the person might be found innocent after the trial and the verdict. It must be the same case here. Once you tested positive, it should be made public immediately.

 

[Moxie]

I do actually get your point. If a player tests positive, and the ITF makes it public, then everyone can see the process as to whether and if they are guilty. As long as the presumption of innocence is there. Otherwise, a player will be tainted. We've seen it before. But I do agree that the whole culture needs to change, and, if they can make it transparent from the outset, without smearing the player, so much the better.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

I do actually get your point. If a player tests positive, and the ITF makes it public, then everyone can see the process as to whether and if they are guilty. As long as the presumption of innocence is there. Otherwise, a player will be tainted. We've seen it before. But I do agree that the whole culture needs to change, and, if they can make it transparent from the outset, without smearing the player, so much the better.

Although I have long been advocating this as my opinion, this is not just my opinion anymore. It is the official policy of ATP/ITF/WTA.
They proudly announced in Aug. 2016 that they will no longer entertain silent bans and will be up front about any positive testing.
But, then when it came time to act on their new policy, they did not.

This is ridiculous. They got all the positive publicity of revamping the system when they made the announcement and then they are not following it up with action.

See their promise here . They did announce it later 2016 that it is all official from now on and we will disclose immediately.

 

[Front242]

The heat in the Australian summer is extreme and it's when we see the most cramping episodes. It can't be the case that all these clowns don't drink enough water and then keel over as they have to surely realize they need to hydrate better in extreme heat and humidity. Diuretics are the most plausible reason and I've been saying it for years. They try and mask the doping but end up draining their bodies of hydration and cramp up. Obviously not all the crampers are cheats but I'd hazard a guess the stat of those who cramp at the AO to be around 80% guilty of diuretic use.

 

[shawnbm]

^ I pray you’re wrong, but you make a compelling point about the potential masking that might be going on.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Fed is looking really great this past week. I think Fed may be as big as favorite to repeat as champion as he was to capture Wimbledon 2017. Although Rafa is the world’s number one ranked player, I dont Expect much competitive banter from Rafa fans the next few weeks and months.

 

[Moxie]

Fed is looking really great this past week. I think Fed may be as big as favorite to repeat as champion as he was to capture Wimbledon 2017. Although Rafa is the world’s number one ranked player, I dont Expect much competitive banter from Rafa fans the next few weeks and months.

While I do agree with your first point, I don't agree with the 2nd. Why shouldn't we engage in competitive banter? What would be the fun in that?

 

[the AntiPusher]

While I do agree with your first point, I don't agree with the 2nd. Why shouldn't we engage in competitive banter? What would be the fun in that?

I never said that we shouldn’t engage but there isnt gonna be a lot.. is just my thoughts

 

[Moxie]

I never said that we shouldn’t engage but there isnt gonna be a lot.. is just my thoughts

Are you saying you're going to abdicate from the conversation if Roger wins the AO? I'm not really seeing that. And I won't be. In the meantime, though, I'll still be thinking Rafa might finally get that 2nd AO he's rather due.

 

[DarthFed]

Rafa isn't overdue for anything off clay. He's already overachieved plenty. Roger is overdue for #20 though. More overdue for showing he can still play at Flushing Meadows too. Well past time he becomes King of New York. That's my hope for this year, AO and USO. He can then come back in 2019 and win his last one at Wimbledon

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Rafa isn't overdue for anything off clay. He's already overachieved plenty. Roger is overdue for #20 though. More overdue for showing he can still play at Flushing Meadows too. Well past time he becomes King of New York. That's my hope for this year, AO and USO. He can then come back in 2019 and win his last one at Wimbledon

At least a partial reason for that is that USO courts have slowed down over the years. Assuming Novak, the King of Slow Hard Courts, comes alive by that time he will probably win it.

Orange is the new Black. AO is the new fast hardcourt slam.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Are you saying you're going to abdicate from the conversation if Roger wins the AO? I'm not really seeing that. And I won't be. In the meantime, though, I'll still be thinking Rafa might finally get that 2nd AO he's rather due.

No.. none of what you are saying.. My thoughts are Rafa has a chance although Roger is a huge favorite. This board doesn’t always welcome competitive banter which stifles most non Fed conversations.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Rafa isn't overdue for anything off clay. He's already overachieved plenty. Roger is overdue for #20 though. More overdue for showing he can still play at Flushing Meadows too. Well past time he becomes King of New York. That's my hope for this year, AO and USO. He can then come back in 2019 and win his last one at Wimbledon

Good Lord you are as greedy as a 6 year old child in a candy store. Roger has Everthing but a Hot wife.

 

[Moxie]

No.. none of what you are saying.. My thoughts are Rafa has a chance although Roger is a huge favorite. This board doesn’t always welcome competitive banter which stifles most non Fed conversations.

"This board doesn't always welcome competitive banter?" It "stifles most non Fed conversations?" You are mistaking the "board" with the posters. There is no moderation here. Conversation is completely free, and I would challenge you as to how you've been "stifled." If your fellow posters are pushing on you, push back. There is no board POV and no one is being censored. Fight back or not, but that's on you.