2015 Wimbledon Final: Djokovic v. Federer II

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Murat Baslamisli

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nehmeth said:
mrzz said:
As I said in the other thread I agree with the ones who say that If Federer serves like he did today he wins. And, no, that does not depend on the returner. The returner cannot control the % of first serves in, and all those aces of today would have been aces against anyone.

I do agree the returner cannot control the % of first serves in, but the returner can influence the server to go for a little more than he should. Novak has a tendency to do that with Roger. We'll see what happens tomorrow.

I don't know...they probably train a bit, maybe watch the women's final...:snicker
 

Riotbeard

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nehmeth said:
mrzz said:
As I said in the other thread I agree with the ones who say that If Federer serves like he did today he wins. And, no, that does not depend on the returner. The returner cannot control the % of first serves in, and all those aces of today would have been aces against anyone.

I do agree the returner cannot control the % of first serves in, but the returner can influence the server to go for a little more than he should. Novak has a tendency to do that with Roger. We'll see what happens tomorrow.

Also Novak protects his own serve so much better than Andy. I think this will see some important tie-breaks early on.
 

Murat Baslamisli

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Like Nehmeth said, Nole makes Roger go for more and it throws Roger's game off. We have seen it many times. I am of the belief that going for some body serves as opposed to aiming for the lines all the time, and punishing the weak replies either with the next shot or with a volley should be a strategy for Roger. Maybe not all the time but at those moments where Nole is recognizing the serve patterns and coming up with Nole like returns.
 

Backhand_DTL

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GameSetAndMath said:
I belong to the camp who think that if Roger serves like today, he will win the match (unless Novak does a go for broke return like he did in USO SF on a lot of serves). Also, I am fairly confident that Roger will continue to serve that way.

Novak is definitely not looking sharp in this whole tourney. However, we could explain that as saying he did not need to be. On the other hand, it may be lead to lingering habits.
In my opinion the thing Novak has going for him is that he served quite well himself (I think his first serve percentage today was 76 % as well and he is around 70 % for the tournament) but his return and ground game were rather below average by his standards. Also Roger recently often had a hard time dealing with Novak's serve, especially in last year's final and in Rome this year or even in Dubai where he just got into a few service games but managed to break twice.

So I don't expect many close service games for either player but the few close ones to be of huge importance. Roger's advantage might be that he is comfortable with focussing on holding his own serve and waiting for an opening on return, whereas Novak sometimes doesn't handle it well when he is unable to regularly get into an opponent's service games.
 

nehmeth

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Riotbeard said:
nehmeth said:
mrzz said:
As I said in the other thread I agree with the ones who say that If Federer serves like he did today he wins. And, no, that does not depend on the returner. The returner cannot control the % of first serves in, and all those aces of today would have been aces against anyone.

I do agree the returner cannot control the % of first serves in, but the returner can influence the server to go for a little more than he should. Novak has a tendency to do that with Roger. We'll see what happens Sunday (thanks Murat) :wave

Also Novak protects his own serve so much better than Andy. I think this will see some important tie-breaks early on.

:puzzled
That really isn't saying much.

If Nole starts out serving crisp and clean, he's good. If he's all wobbly and falling into the court? :cover

Believing he will be sharp, focused and hitting his groundies much deeper than the service line Sunday.
 

Riotbeard

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nehmeth said:
Riotbeard said:
nehmeth said:
I do agree the returner cannot control the % of first serves in, but the returner can influence the server to go for a little more than he should. Novak has a tendency to do that with Roger. We'll see what happens tomorrow.

Also Novak protects his own serve so much better than Andy. I think this will see some important tie-breaks early on.

:puzzled
That really isn't saying much.

If Nole starts out serving crisp and clean, he's good. If he's all wobbly and falling into the court? :cover

Believing he will be sharp, focused and hitting his groundies much deeper than the service line.

True of all of Novak's game. If he doesn't play well, kiss it goodbye. The point is though if Novak is playing pretty well, he will be much tougher to break than Andy.
 

Carol

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I hope to see a good match, not some trainer calls (if it's not too necessary) not smashing the racquets and a serial of bad words, just an entertaining and competitive final ;) :popcorn
 

GameSetAndMath

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Nobody has defended their Wimbledon title, since Roger last did so in 2007.
 

GameSetAndMath

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My only fear is whether Fed has peaked just a little early. Even if so, I hope he can maintain that level for one more match.
 

Moxie

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GameSetAndMath said:
Nobody has defended their Wimbledon title, since Roger last did so in 2007.

You come up with the best little factoids, GSM. :hug Which is kind of why it surprises me that you're always spooked about the Tignor whammy. But I guess we're all about 80% stats and 20% superstition. :D
 

GameSetAndMath

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It is time to consult the bookies. They are giving 6/5 for Fed and 4/5 for Novak. Works out to approximately 55% chance of winning for Novak and 45% for Fed. These are almost identical to the Fed vs. Andy match percentages as per the bookies.
 

I.Haychew

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I want both of them to win. That said...Federer in three.
 

calitennis127

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Kieran said:
Novak hasn't look sharp in this event, but he's been okay. Apparently after the Anderson match ended, Becker (or someone in his entourage) said, "welcome to Wimbledon," signalling that Nole's Parisian funk was ending. I felt that Stan was affected adversely by Paris too, running out of steam here, But Novak has had a cozy draw, and handled everything efficiently, but not brilliantly.

I'm sure he'll be even better on Sunday. So far, he's cut his cloth to fit, and no more than this...


Someone wants Federer to lose I see.....
 

calitennis127

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As everyone knows, I like both players in this match, and I will be happy for whoever the winner is. I can see both players winning, and I could give reasons why. It is very tough to call and I think both players have a great chance. There is no clear-cut favorite.

That said, my gut instinct on this match is that it favors Federer. I just feel that this is his moment, at his event. He has worked his tail off to get back to the Wimbledon final. This is his Super Bowl, while Djokovic has 8 Super Bowls throughout the year, including all 4 Slams. Plus I think Federer has a bit of a motivational edge based on what happened last year and him wanting the 8-Slam Wimbledon record in addition to the 4-Slam cushion on Nadal.

But in terms of the tennis, if Federer starts getting just a little shaky on serve, Djokovic has the ability to pounce and get some decisive breaks. If Djokovic is sharp and the backhand is clicking, he could force the very best out of Federer and Federer's game could start to break down. On the other hand, if Djokovic is a little bit sloppy and patchy, then Federer could consolidate his serve easily and play some aggressive games when returning to seize the 1 or 2 breaks he needs if his serve is clicking.

So I am going to give a slight edge to Federer, but if Djokovic wins, I will not be surprised at all. This is a 55-45 or 60-40 scenario at the most.
 

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Carol35 said:
I hope to see a good match, not some trainer calls (if it's not too necessary) not smashing the racquets and a serial of bad words, just an entertaining and competitive final ;) :popcorn


Last time Fed said "I know how to beat him (Djoker)" he smashed the racquet and lose.
 

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Novak has to up his game tremendously to make final competitive
 

brokenshoelace

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One thing that worries me for Roger is what happens once Novak starts picking up his serve and reading it. Obviously Roger needs to serve well but I have no reason to believe he won't, given how he's been serving at Wimbledon this year. But in their matches, there always comes that stage where Novak turns into rubber man and starts coming with ludicrous returns on the full stretch that land on the baseline and suddenly it's a 30-30 or deuce game with a lot of pressure on Federer.

On the flipside, I think Djokovic has developed the most underrated first serve/second serve combination on tour, and Roger's return of the Djokovic serve has historically been extremely poor, and that was one of the main differences in last year's final. I don't expect Roger to return much better so that's a problem. It also gives Novak way too many easy put aways on 1-2 punches.

The other huge difference last year was Roger's forehand. In fact, I really have no idea how the match was so competitive given how pedestrian it looked (I guess that's a testament to Federer), especially since the backhand to backhand cross court exchanges will generally go Novak's way. I think at this point, Novak has a better rally forehand and because of his superior movement and defense, when they engage in these cross court exchanges he can still get to these angled forehands Federer hits and take Roger out of position with his own angles from really improbable positions. To escape that pattern, Fed needs to be able to change directions and go up the line, which he struggled with last year, but was doing phenomenally well against Murray. I think Roger will hit his forehand a lot better if his match with Murray is any indicator. He was super sharp.

It'd be interesting to see if he gets pop and depth on his sliced backhands since he doesn't want to go toe-to-toe with Djokovic from the backhand side, especially since Novak overpowers him these days. Good news is Roger's down the line backhand generally is on point against Novak and it's an important shot to keep Djokovic honest.

This is way too close to call. If Federer's forehand and serving are on point, I think he wins this. That level of offensive prowess on grass is unrivaled, provided he actually brings that level of sharpness and cleanliness in his game. But if even one of the serve or the forehand is slightly off, Djokovic takes it.