What is stan's ceiling?

[Iona16]

I have to say I was pretty stunned to read this article today.

Raz Mirza feels Stan Wawrinka must be considered favourite to win the French Open

http://www1.skysports.com/tennis/news/12111/9276376/raz-mirza-feels-stan-wawrinka-must-be-considered-favourite-to-win-the-french-open

I've seen similar articles/suggestions on social media and newspaper sites today. For anyone to suggest that Rafa is not the favourite for RG is ludicrous. Would I put Stan as a favourite? Yes, but certainly not the favourite or 2nd favourite.

When I think of the years I watched Andy:
- maintain a top 4 slot
- reach masters finals
- win masters events
- reach slam finals
- win a slam
- win a 2nd slam

Even after winning a slam it was still 'big 3' + 1 to some people. Now we have suggestions that he's been replaced in the 'big 4' and now I have Riotbeard calling him blooming Murphy.

Apologies for the rant.

re: Stan
I think he could win another masters but I don't see him winning another slam.

 

[TsarMatt]

I can see Stan possibly winning Roland Garros, providing Nadal gets an early exist or winds up not facing him somehow. The dirt is probably his best surface, so if a few things go his way, adding a second major to his list wouldn't be too implausible a thought.

 

[Moxie]

I have to say I was pretty stunned to read this article today.

Raz Mirza feels Stan Wawrinka must be considered favourite to win the French Open

http://www1.skysports.com/tennis/news/12111/9276376/raz-mirza-feels-stan-wawrinka-must-be-considered-favourite-to-win-the-french-open

I've seen similar articles/suggestions on social media and newspaper sites today. For anyone to suggest that Rafa is not the favourite for RG is ludicrous. Would I put Stan as a favourite? Yes, but certainly not the favourite or 2nd favourite.

When I think of the years I watched Andy:
- maintain a top 4 slot
- reach masters finals
- win masters events
- reach slam finals
- win a slam
- win a 2nd slam

Even after winning a slam it was still 'big 3' + 1 to some people. Now we have suggestions that he's been replaced in the 'big 4' and now I have Riotbeard calling him blooming Murphy.

Apologies for the rant.

I think you have a right to your rant, Iona. Basically, it's referred to (most jeeringly by Kieran) as 'jumping on the bandwagon.' This is also a kind of blindness that forgets immediately what some have done over time, because they don't feel the immediate gratification of "what have you done for me lately?" Add in that some folks are salivating over anyone who might just take Nadal at RG.

Speaking of "Murphy," how's he doing? Next stop Madrid?

 

[Iona16]

I have to say I was pretty stunned to read this article today.

Raz Mirza feels Stan Wawrinka must be considered favourite to win the French Open

http://www1.skysports.com/tennis/news/12111/9276376/raz-mirza-feels-stan-wawrinka-must-be-considered-favourite-to-win-the-french-open

I've seen similar articles/suggestions on social media and newspaper sites today. For anyone to suggest that Rafa is not the favourite for RG is ludicrous. Would I put Stan as a favourite? Yes, but certainly not the favourite or 2nd favourite.

When I think of the years I watched Andy:
- maintain a top 4 slot
- reach masters finals
- win masters events
- reach slam finals
- win a slam
- win a 2nd slam

Even after winning a slam it was still 'big 3' + 1 to some people. Now we have suggestions that he's been replaced in the 'big 4' and now I have Riotbeard calling him blooming Murphy.

Apologies for the rant.

I think you have a right to your rant, Iona. Basically, it's referred to (most jeeringly by Kieran) as 'jumping on the bandwagon.' This is also a kind of blindness that forgets immediately what some have done over time, because they don't feel the immediate gratification of "what have you done for me lately?" Add in that some folks are salivating over anyone who might just take Nadal at RG.

Speaking of "Murphy," how's he doing? Next stop Madrid?

I don't begrudge Stan his success but yes, I do think some people are getting carried away. The article I posted a link for takes the biscuit.

Next stop for "Murphy" is Madrid. He's taking part in a charity event with Rafa and Iker Casillas - saw that on Rafa's twitter feed today. Although fans are intrigued that Andy and his team traveled to Paris yesterday. It was a short trip as he has to be in Scotland on Wednesday. What was he doing in Paris? The rumour mill was in overdrive.

Sorry, off topic.

 

[Riotbeard]

I don't think it's denigrating Murphy (did I really mess that up... He is my second favorite member of the big 4) or any of the big four to propose a shake up may be occurring or at least ask the question. It is a weird time, and Stan has been the most consistent player this season. To clarify, I am not a Stan fan. I like the guy, but I am not gonna root for him at RG unless he faces Murphy, rafa or fed in the final.

I also believe in asking questions and making predictions before things happen. Stan already has a slam and a masters, now is definitely the time to be asking this question. Do we have to wait till multiple slams and masters to ask if he will win multiple? Should I open another thread about another injured big 4 players and their prospects? Or why isn't rafa doing well? Lets talk about the guy doing stuff!

This is a good natured rant. I am a Novak fan, and wish he had won, but I say let's talk about the prospects of the guy winning some stuff, not talk about why the more popular players lose.

 

[Moxie]

I don't think it's denigrating Murphy (did I really mess that up... He is my second favorite member of the big 4) or any of the big four to propose a shake up may be occurring or at least ask the question. It is a weird time, and Stan has been the most consistent player this season. To clarify, I am not a Stan fan. I like the guy, but I am not gonna root for him at RG unless he faces Murphy, rafa or fed in the final.

I also believe in asking questions and making predictions before things happen. Stan already has a slam and a masters, now is definitely the time to be asking this question. Do we have to wait till multiple slams and masters to ask if he will win multiple? Should I open another thread about another injured big 4 players and their prospects? Or why isn't rafa doing well? Lets talk about the guy doing stuff!

This is a good natured rant. I am a Novak fan, and wish he had won, but I say let's talk about the prospects of the guy winning some stuff, not talk about why the more popular players lose.

I get all of what you're saying except that Stan is NOT the most consistent player this season, so far. A Major and a MS is very good, but a walkabout in between doesn't describe consistency.

 

[Riotbeard]

I don't think it's denigrating Murphy (did I really mess that up... He is my second favorite member of the big 4) or any of the big four to propose a shake up may be occurring or at least ask the question. It is a weird time, and Stan has been the most consistent player this season. To clarify, I am not a Stan fan. I like the guy, but I am not gonna root for him at RG unless he faces Murphy, rafa or fed in the final.

I also believe in asking questions and making predictions before things happen. Stan already has a slam and a masters, now is definitely the time to be asking this question. Do we have to wait till multiple slams and masters to ask if he will win multiple? Should I open another thread about another injured big 4 players and their prospects? Or why isn't rafa doing well? Lets talk about the guy doing stuff!

This is a good natured rant. I am a Novak fan, and wish he had won, but I say let's talk about the prospects of the guy winning some stuff, not talk about why the more popular players lose.

I get all of what you're saying except that Stan is NOT the most consistent player this season, so far. A Major and a MS is very good, but a walkabout in between doesn't describe consistency.

Winning 3 out of 5 tournaments entered seems about as consistent as anybody to me.

 

[Moxie]

I have to say I was pretty stunned to read this article today.

Raz Mirza feels Stan Wawrinka must be considered favourite to win the French Open

http://www1.skysports.com/tennis/news/12111/9276376/raz-mirza-feels-stan-wawrinka-must-be-considered-favourite-to-win-the-french-open

I've seen similar articles/suggestions on social media and newspaper sites today. For anyone to suggest that Rafa is not the favourite for RG is ludicrous. Would I put Stan as a favourite? Yes, but certainly not the favourite or 2nd favourite.

When I think of the years I watched Andy:
- maintain a top 4 slot
- reach masters finals
- win masters events
- reach slam finals
- win a slam
- win a 2nd slam

Even after winning a slam it was still 'big 3' + 1 to some people. Now we have suggestions that he's been replaced in the 'big 4' and now I have Riotbeard calling him blooming Murphy.

Apologies for the rant.

I think you have a right to your rant, Iona. Basically, it's referred to (most jeeringly by Kieran) as 'jumping on the bandwagon.' This is also a kind of blindness that forgets immediately what some have done over time, because they don't feel the immediate gratification of "what have you done for me lately?" Add in that some folks are salivating over anyone who might just take Nadal at RG.

Speaking of "Murphy," how's he doing? Next stop Madrid?

I don't begrudge Stan his success but yes, I do think some people are getting carried away. The article I posted a link for takes the biscuit.

Next stop for "Murphy" is Madrid. He's taking part in a charity event with Rafa and Iker Casillas - saw that on Rafa's twitter feed today. Although fans are intrigued that Andy and his team traveled to Paris yesterday. It was a short trip as he has to be in Scotland on Wednesday. What was he doing in Paris? The rumour mill was in overdrive.

Sorry, off topic.

What's the rumor?

 

[Riotbeard]

I don't think it's denigrating Murphy (did I really mess that up... He is my second favorite member of the big 4) or any of the big four to propose a shake up may be occurring or at least ask the question. It is a weird time, and Stan has been the most consistent player this season. To clarify, I am not a Stan fan. I like the guy, but I am not gonna root for him at RG unless he faces Murphy, rafa or fed in the final.

I also believe in asking questions and making predictions before things happen. Stan already has a slam and a masters, now is definitely the time to be asking this question. Do we have to wait till multiple slams and masters to ask if he will win multiple? Should I open another thread about another injured big 4 players and their prospects? Or why isn't rafa doing well? Lets talk about the guy doing stuff!

This is a good natured rant. I am a Novak fan, and wish he had won, but I say let's talk about the prospects of the guy winning some stuff, not talk about why the more popular players lose.

I get all of what you're saying except that Stan is NOT the most consistent player this season, so far. A Major and a MS is very good, but a walkabout in between doesn't describe consistency.

Winning 3 out of 5 tournaments entered seems about as consistent as anybody to me.

I certainly wouldn't call it inconsistent. It's not like Rafa, Fed, or Novak in their great years, but it's better or as good as any of them as far as I can tell this year, unless you wanna split hairs about definitions of consistency.

 

[Iona16]

I don't think it's denigrating Murphy (did I really mess that up... He is my second favorite member of the big 4) or any of the big four to propose a shake up may be occurring or at least ask the question. It is a weird time, and Stan has been the most consistent player this season. To clarify, I am not a Stan fan. I like the guy, but I am not gonna root for him at RG unless he faces Murphy, rafa or fed in the final.

I also believe in asking questions and making predictions before things happen. Stan already has a slam and a masters, now is definitely the time to be asking this question. Do we have to wait till multiple slams and masters to ask if he will win multiple? Should I open another thread about another injured big 4 players and their prospects? Or why isn't rafa doing well? Lets talk about the guy doing stuff!

This is a good natured rant. I am a Novak fan, and wish he had won, but I say let's talk about the prospects of the guy winning some stuff, not talk about why the more popular players lose.

To be honest it was a general rant at the tennis world in general - not really directed at your thread. I'm sorry it appeared that way. Stan has shook up tennis as we know it and your thread is obviously time appropriate.

Andy has been called many things but never Murphy. Let's stick to Murray please.

 

[Iona16]

@moxie

That he was meeting with a prospective coach. That was the main one.

 

[Moxie]

I don't think it's denigrating Murphy (did I really mess that up... He is my second favorite member of the big 4) or any of the big four to propose a shake up may be occurring or at least ask the question. It is a weird time, and Stan has been the most consistent player this season. To clarify, I am not a Stan fan. I like the guy, but I am not gonna root for him at RG unless he faces Murphy, rafa or fed in the final.

I also believe in asking questions and making predictions before things happen. Stan already has a slam and a masters, now is definitely the time to be asking this question. Do we have to wait till multiple slams and masters to ask if he will win multiple? Should I open another thread about another injured big 4 players and their prospects? Or why isn't rafa doing well? Lets talk about the guy doing stuff!

This is a good natured rant. I am a Novak fan, and wish he had won, but I say let's talk about the prospects of the guy winning some stuff, not talk about why the more popular players lose.

I get all of what you're saying except that Stan is NOT the most consistent player this season, so far. A Major and a MS is very good, but a walkabout in between doesn't describe consistency.

Winning 3 out of 5 tournaments entered seems about as consistent as anybody to me.

I certainly wouldn't call it inconsistent. It's not like Rafa, Fed, or Novak in their great years, but it's better or as good as any of them as far as I can tell this year, unless you wanna split hairs about definitions of consistency.

Well, and losing in the R16 in IW and Miami and playing like crap in DC. But as you say, I won't split hairs with you. A pretty good start, overall. I'm remembering some of the less than convincing recent performances, which is bad on me, since I was saying that we all have short-term memories when it comes to accessing players.

 

[Riotbeard]

I don't think it's denigrating Murphy (did I really mess that up... He is my second favorite member of the big 4) or any of the big four to propose a shake up may be occurring or at least ask the question. It is a weird time, and Stan has been the most consistent player this season. To clarify, I am not a Stan fan. I like the guy, but I am not gonna root for him at RG unless he faces Murphy, rafa or fed in the final.

I also believe in asking questions and making predictions before things happen. Stan already has a slam and a masters, now is definitely the time to be asking this question. Do we have to wait till multiple slams and masters to ask if he will win multiple? Should I open another thread about another injured big 4 players and their prospects? Or why isn't rafa doing well? Lets talk about the guy doing stuff!

This is a good natured rant. I am a Novak fan, and wish he had won, but I say let's talk about the prospects of the guy winning some stuff, not talk about why the more popular players lose.

I get all of what you're saying except that Stan is NOT the most consistent player this season, so far. A Major and a MS is very good, but a walkabout in between doesn't describe consistency.

Winning 3 out of 5 tournaments entered seems about as consistent as anybody to me.

I certainly wouldn't call it inconsistent. It's not like Rafa, Fed, or Novak in their great years, but it's better or as good as any of them as far as I can tell this year, unless you wanna split hairs about definitions of consistency.

Well, and losing in the R16 in IW and Miami and playing like crap in DC. But as you say, I won't split hairs with you. A pretty good start, overall. I'm remembering some of the less than convincing recent performances, which is bad on me, since I was saying that we all have short-term memories when it comes to accessing players.

I do think we have trouble (including myself) computing the information that has been transmitted in the 1st quarter of this season. Madrid could completely change the image. Rafa could start playing better, Novak's injury could be more minor than it seemed Saturday... But let's spill some ink on the new guy!

Stan might also be the type of player with baffling loses that then goes on a tear. Excluding the final, he pretty much destroyed everyone he played in monte carlo. Looked scary good against David, where Fed just looked good against Novak, that is why I picked Stan to win... We don't know yet what his season will look like, so it's all conjecture.

 

[Moxie]

^ Agreed, there's a lot of conjecture. Dimitrov and Dolgopolov were also the flavor of the month for about a NY minute. I'm going to sit back and see how it goes, a bit.

 

[herios]

I am giving the benefit of doubt for Stan for his poor showings at IW and Miami as he was returning of a injury lay-off since the end of January and he skipped events he was going to play in Febryuary.
If the top 4 get the benefit of doubt whenever they play poorly after being injured, he deserves it as well.
Nobody among us knows exactly how much he had to rest and avoid training to allow his back to recover.
If he would be smart he would skip Portugal, although he will lose 250 points. If I would be him, I would go after one of the post Wimbledon clay events in Europe instead, because in that timeframe, top players take a 4-5 week of break and one week of play could be very manageable.

 

[Kieran]

I think the feeling is that inconsistency is more Stan's default setting, where as it's anomalous in the likes of Rafa, Nole and Roger...

 

[Riotbeard]

I think the feeling is that inconsistency is more Stan's default setting, where as it's anomalous in the likes of Rafa, Nole and Roger...

I agree that this is the prevailing thought, the point of the thread is asking whether or not that is a flawed perspective given his performance over the last last two seasons.

I am not sure either way, it's possible he could go back to pre-2013 or just 2013 Stan for the rest of the season. I also wonder if Stan were a younger guy, we would see these last two seasons in the same light. If Dimitrov had identical results over the last two seasons, would we bring up losses from 2012 as evidence for what we expect from him over the rest of 2014? I am not sure we would. What is impressive also is Stan's results show a progression to where he is now over a 15-16 month period instead of an anomalous performance after years of hovering around the 20s and somehow winning a slam.

I think the fact that people got so comfortable with the old stan for years, makes it difficult to think there might really be a new Stan that could hold together for some time.

 

[Front242]

Out of interest why is Murray being called Murphy lol? Does he really look like Alex Murphy aka Robocop ? Not to me anyway Or which Murphy might this be ? John Murphy is a pretty common name over here just like John Doe in the US

 

[Riotbeard]

Out of interest why is Murray being called Murphy lol? Does he really look like Alex Murphy aka Robocop ? Not to me anyway Or which Murphy might this be ? John Murphy is a pretty common name over here just like John Doe in the US

I accidentally called him murphy in the first post of the thread. My keyboard and brain are often disconnected...

 

[Front242]

^ ROFL! A pretty basic answer then haha.