Stacey Allaster proposed changes to excessive grunting in the WTA

[Vince Evert]

That's pretty gutless of the WTA.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

At the AO I think it was in 2012,they did a reading per a decimal meter on Maria Sharapova and it read louder than a circular saw.

 

[Sundaymorningguy]

I think the reason why Maria gets singled out is because like I said over the years her shrieks have actually increased in terms of noise. Yes, Azarenka is loud, but it isn't like she is increasing the intensity of her shriek like Sharapova.

 

[tented]

At the AO I think it was in 2012,they did a reading per a decimal meter on Maria Sharapova and it read louder than a circular saw.

Seriously? :eyepop

That's not only annoying, it's got to be unhealthy for your ears to be listening to something that loud for so long.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

At the AO I think it was in 2012,they did a reading per a decimal meter on Maria Sharapova and it read louder than a circular saw.

Seriously? :eyepop

That's not only annoying, it's got to be unhealthy for your ears to be listening to something that loud for so long.

It was done by engineering technicians,they had the pleasure of recording and listening...

 

[Kirijax]

I read somewhere that the decimals were higher than a jumbo jet landing. lol

 

[MashaFan]

This is taken directly from the Official WTA Rulebook:

"Any continual distraction of regular play, such as grunting, shall be dealt with in accordance with the Hindrance Rule.

Deliberate Hindrance: Any hindrance caused by a player that is ruled deliberate will result in the loss of a point."

So they do consider grunting a hindrance. Let's get that matter settled immediately.

I might be banned for this again (and I don't really care - I'm more or less done with this forum anyways) although I haven't broken any rules but here is my last reply to tented who've banned me for a period of time for no reason at all but for replying his challenge to comment on his rule quote above - If what I say is a reason to ban me or to dismiss my arguments perhaps this article is good enough for tented and other tennis experts on this forum to consider instead: Get it Right: Grunting & Hindrance

Don't be surprised when I'm not responding after this anymore or this reply is censured after a while because I then probably have been banned again - This is how "justice" is done on Tennis Frontier

Let me preface this by saying this is not going to be a rant about the aesthetics of grunting. Some find it annoying, while others, such as myself, aren’t bothered by it at all. That’s completely acceptable; I’m not here to force my opinion on others, nor would I appreciate others forcing their opinion on me. However, I am here to address facts......

Now that I’ve discuss what hindrance is, I need to address why grunting is not. Hindrance exists because a player cannot act as they please with an intent to distract their opponent. Any noise which BEGINS when the ball is in the opponent’s court can be treated as hindrance; a grunt begins when a player is paying their own shot.......

It also needs to be said that the volume of said noise is irrelevant in determining if hindrance has taken place; it is the timing of said noise that is crucial in determining if hindrance should be called.

Note the following:

I'm not attacking those who despise shrieking - grunting or screaming on court - That's their prerogative although I just wonder why these persons still find it necessary to complain any chance they get after more then 10 years with this phenomena - Sometimes I wonder if these persons are adults - All I am saying (and have proven) is that they who argue that that shrieking - grunting or screaming on court is hindrance and/or cheating don't have any ground for their statements

I'm sorry that the likes of tented get so upset (yeah - upset enough to ban me) when confronted with these facts and are unwilling to discuss the issue at hand (hindrance and cheating) - All I read are arguments based on personal emotions and opinions in stead of facts and attacks on Maria Sharapova

 

[kskate2]

This is taken directly from the Official WTA Rulebook:

"Any continual distraction of regular play, such as grunting, shall be dealt with in accordance with the Hindrance Rule.

Deliberate Hindrance: Any hindrance caused by a player that is ruled deliberate will result in the loss of a point."

So they do consider grunting a hindrance. Let's get that matter settled immediately.

I might be banned for this again (and I don't really care - I'm more or less done with this forum anyways) although I haven't broken any rules but here is my last reply to tented who've banned me for a period of time for no reason at all but for replying his challenge to comment on his rule quote above - If what I say is a reason to ban me or to dismiss my arguments perhaps this article is good enough for tented and other tennis experts on this forum to consider instead: Get it Right: Grunting & Hindrance

Don't be surprised when I'm not responding after this anymore or this reply is censured after a while because I then probably have been banned again - This is how "justice" is done on Tennis Frontier

Let me preface this by saying this is not going to be a rant about the aesthetics of grunting. Some find it annoying, while others, such as myself, aren’t bothered by it at all. That’s completely acceptable; I’m not here to force my opinion on others, nor would I appreciate others forcing their opinion on me. However, I am here to address facts......

Now that I’ve discuss what hindrance is, I need to address why grunting is not. Hindrance exists because a player cannot act as they please with an intent to distract their opponent. Any noise which BEGINS when the ball is in the opponent’s court can be treated as hindrance; a grunt begins when a player is paying their own shot.......

It also needs to be said that the volume of said noise is irrelevant in determining if hindrance has taken place; it is the timing of said noise that is crucial in determining if hindrance should be called.

Note the following:

I'm not attacking those who despise shrieking - grunting or screaming on court - That's their prerogative although I just wonder why these persons still find it necessary to complain any chance they get after more then 10 years with this phenomena - Sometimes I wonder if these persons are adults - All I am saying (and have proven) is that they who argue that that shrieking - grunting or screaming on court is hindrance and/or cheating don't have any ground for their statements

I'm sorry that the likes of tented get so upset (yeah - upset enough to ban me) when confronted with these facts and are unwilling to discuss the issue at hand (hindrance and cheating) - All I read are arguments based on personal emotions and opinions in stead of facts and attacks on Maria Sharapova

For your information MashaFan, you've never been banned on this site (tennisfrontier.com). Maybe you were banned on other websites (tennisdigital or tennis.com). I'm not sure about those other sites as I was not a mod there. So if you're going to accuse someone of something, you should at least have your facts in order first.

Let me say this again, you haven't been banned here yet, but that can always be arranged if you insist.

 

[tented]

^ This is true. If you had been banned, you would have been notified in writing, and the software would have automatically put the word "Banned" directly under your username (where "Pro" is).

Neither of those things ever occurred, so you weren't banned.

Normally, I wouldn't discuss such things in public, but since you made the decision to lie publicly, I'll reply in public, too.

 

[MashaFan]

For your information MashaFan, you've never been banned on this site (tennisfrontier.com). Maybe you were banned on other websites (tennisdigital or tennis.com). I'm not sure about those other sites as I was not a mod there. So if you're going to accuse someone of something, you should at least have your facts in order first.

Let me say this again, you haven't been banned here yet, but that can always be arranged if you insist.

Really? Well I was in the process of replying tented in this thread (on 25-01-2015) when I suddenly got a ban screen after I hit the "Post Reply" button - I was then not able to log on here for months - I actually asked hoergren to talk to tented (I couldn't do it myself) about the reason why since I as far as I could see had not broken any rules - hoergren told me that he asked tented about it but all he get was a "thanks for your information" reply - hoergren is my witness that it was Tennis Frontier and not any other site and that I've my facts straight - Then for a month or so ago I suddenly could log on again - So you tell me - what was I to think?

I may not be liked - I may be sarcastic in my comments - I may be seen as obnoxious or difficult but I've never been rude to any member of this site nor have I ever posted condescending comments about WTA players - All you can accuse me for is that I'm a fierce fan of Maria Sharapova and I'll always argue with those who attack her person for no good reasons

So how come that I in the middle of a debate suddenly received a ban screen and that this lasted for months? - Every time during those months the Tennis Frontier ban screen popped up when I tried to access it - Wouldn't you be pissed if that had happened to you I wonder?

 

[tented]

^ You were not banned, so don't keep implying, if not insisting, you were. It sounds like you share an IP address(es) which was blocked (perhaps temporarily) because spammers were also using it. But obviously you can access the site now, and obviously you were never banned. End of story.

The purpose of this thread isn't to discuss your personal situation. If you wish to continue doing so, send me and/or kskate a PM. Anything else about this which is posted here will be deleted.

 

[kskate2]

For your information MashaFan, you've never been banned on this site (tennisfrontier.com). Maybe you were banned on other websites (tennisdigital or tennis.com). I'm not sure about those other sites as I was not a mod there. So if you're going to accuse someone of something, you should at least have your facts in order first.

Let me say this again, you haven't been banned here yet, but that can always be arranged if you insist.

Really? Well I was in the process of replying tented in this thread (on 25-01-2015) when I suddenly got a ban screen after I hit the "Post Reply" button - I was then not able to log on here for months - I actually asked hoergren to talk to tented (I couldn't do it myself) about the reason why since I as far as I could see had not broken any rules - hoergren told me that he asked tented about it but all he get was a "thanks for your information" reply - Then for a month or so ago I suddenly could log on again - So you tell me - what was I to think?

I may not be liked - I may be sarcastic in my comments - I may be seen as obnoxious or difficult but I've never been rude to any member of this site nor have I ever posted condescending comments about WTA players - All you can accuse me for is that I'm a fierce fan of Maria Sharapova and I'll always argue with those who attack her person for no good reasons

So how come that I in the middle of a debate suddenly received a ban screen and that this lasted for months? - Every time during those months the Tennis Frontier ban screen popped up when I tried to access it - Wouldn't you be pissed if that had happened to you I wonder?

I don't know how many other ways to say this. You have never been banned at tennisfrontier.com, period. If you were having an issue w/ the site, maybe it was your ISP, a cached browser or any number of technical reasons that I'm not about to get into w/o seeing your environment. I can tell you this, anyone who is banned from tennisfrontier.com gets notified through pm and and/or an email that such a thing has happened. It's also discussed among all the mods. No conversation of that magnitude has happened regarding your account. And I can guarantee you that you can't produce a pm or an email that states the same.

As for your conversation w/ Hoergen, I don't know anything about that. Hoergren never contacted me directly about you and Tented never mentioned you having a problem getting into your acct.

 

[MashaFan]

My "personal situation" aside I'm still waiting for tented to answer my previous questions concerning his statement that the WTA actually has a valid rule which states that grunting - shrieking - screaming while hitting the ball is hindrance - I'm hoping that he can take the time to address each of my questions below instead of dismissing them with phrases like There are so many logical fallacies in here it's hard to know where to begin without taking the courtesy to specify these "logical fallacies" - For his convenience - IF tented really is right about the WTA rule he has quoted then:

a) Why have the umpires - WTA officials and tennis commentators - not to speak about the players and their coaches - ignored the rule which tented quotes in spite of the fact that this issue has been loudly debated in the more than 10 years since this issue has been on the table? - Like tented surely someone with some higher up position in the WTA and with extensive knowledge about the WTA rules would have pointed out that this rule exists during all these years?

b) Why has no ITF or WTA official - to my knowledge - ever publicly pointed out for the shriekers - grunters - screamers that this rule exists and that they are violating this rule and therefor can be penalized for hindrance during the more than 10 years this debate has been going on?

c) Why is it necessary to take any actions in the future when there - according to tented - already exists a WTA rule which states that grunting - shrieking - screaming is hindrance and all it needs is to be enforced?

d) What has tented to say about the arguments in the following link?: Get it Right: Grunting & Hindrance

Logic tells me that tented has no case - Logic tells me that tented has misinterpreted the rule he's quoting and there in fact is NO rule which prohibits shrieking - grunting - screaming while hitting the ball but I'm eager to see what he has to say