Rogers Cup Final - Nadal v. Raonic

[Kieran]

Rafa beat them. End of story. He was immense this week.

But whatever about Novak, it's just prejudice to claim that JJ is better on hards than Rafa. It's ridiculous, actually, given everything we know. JJ is starting out, so you have nothing to base this opinion upon.

Nothing!

Do shots mean anything to you at all?

Anything?

Yeah. Especially those that land in. Rafa gets a lot of those types of shots...

 

[DarthFed]

He's got 7 on HC's Cali, he's done alright for himself.

Oh the irony at work here.

Mr. "Getting to the semifinals of a major is nothing" is now talking about winning 7 Masters Series events on hardcourts over an 11-year period as a huge deal.

It is nothing actually because you haven't won anything by making the semis of a GS. This isn't rocket science but then I'm arguing with someone who legitimately thought Raonic would win today.

Your logic is that titles are accomplishments, and anything less than a title means you haven't won anything. This may be a great attitude to have if you're at the top of the sport, but logically it doesn't make sense. You have to win 5 or 6 matches to reach a final at a Masters or Slam event, for which you are rewarded ranking points and race points.

If we are to apply your attitude of "getting to the semis is nothing" to the grand scheme of 11 years of playing on tour, then we can also quite easily say that winning 7 MS hardcourt titles doesn't amount to much either. I am simply holding your own logic and attitude against you here.

These are great players we are talking about here. Finals and semis are accomplishments to the likes of Berdych, Raonic, Isner, etc. When talking the top 4 and even DP, an accomplishment is holding the trophy on Sunday. Nothing more, nothing less. You make the semi of a GS as a top player you can say the tournament wasn't a total disaster but you still haven't done anything. I've had this argument before with certain people who think Roger losing in a QF at a slam is not an awful result. The QF at a slam is usually the first time the top players are playing anyone halfway decent.

 

[Moxie]

Darth's point is well-taken, Cali. Getting "close" isn't getting the job done.

At the risk of seeming to gloat: you're the guy who touts what a talent Nalbandian is, yet he has 2 MS titles, period...in a 13-year career, and yet you have the nerve to act like winning 7 - just on HCs - in 11 years, 'ain't no thang.' (I suppose I shouldn't mention the other 18 off of them.)

You can keep tap-dancing to this same song, but, since Nadal keeps racking up titles, no one's buying it. Now you're trying to sell of Janowicz as better than Nadal...and basically no one even knew who he was until Bercy last year. You're grasping at every straw that flies by trying to undersell Nadal.

 

[tented]

Darth's point is well-taken, Cali. Getting "close" isn't getting the job done.

At the risk of seeming to gloat: you're the guy who touts what a talent Nalbandian is, yet he has 2 MS titles, period...in a 13-year career, and yet you have the nerve to act like winning 7 - just on HCs - in 11 years, 'ain't no thang.' (I suppose I shouldn't mention the other 18 off of them.)

You can keep tap-dancing to this same song, but, since Nadal keeps racking up titles, no one's buying it. Now you're trying to sell of Janowicz as better than Nadal...and basically no one even knew who he was until Bercy last year. You're grasping at every straw that flies by trying to undersell Nadal.

You, Darth, Kieran, Broken, Murat, et al. are allowing this to continue. In a way, you have only yourselves to blame.

 

[Kieran]

Darth's point is well-taken, Cali. Getting "close" isn't getting the job done.

At the risk of seeming to gloat: you're the guy who touts what a talent Nalbandian is, yet he has 2 MS titles, period...in a 13-year career, and yet you have the nerve to act like winning 7 - just on HCs - in 11 years, 'ain't no thang.' (I suppose I shouldn't mention the other 18 off of them.)

You can keep tap-dancing to this same song, but, since Nadal keeps racking up titles, no one's buying it. Now you're trying to sell of Janowicz as better than Nadal...and basically no one even knew who he was until Bercy last year. You're grasping at every straw that flies by trying to undersell Nadal.

You, Darth, Kieran, Broken, Murat, et al. are allowing this to continue. In a way, you have only yourselves to blame.

It's good fun, don't take it away from me!

The thing is, Cali is so anti-Rafa that from now on I think I'll call him afaR...

 

[Didi]

Well going to cinema turned out to be a brillant decision. Seriously, congrats to Nadal. Credit where credit is due. This year he has beaten Gulbis, Federer, Berdych, Del Potro, Janowicz and Djokovic on hardcourts. Apart from Murray and possibly Tsonga, that's the whole hardcourt elite. One cannot ask for more. I'm surprised how well his knees have recovered and responded. I mean back in 2005 when he won Montreal and Madrid Indoors I told myself no way on earth are these legs going to last more than 1-2 years on hardcourts. Now it's 2013 and he's still winning and winning despite having a ridiculous mileage for his age. I still don't see him winning the US Open to be honest but he doesn't have to. A solid trip to the semis and a solid showing in Asia should do the trick for the year end #2 and therefore #1 after Melbourne 2014.

 

[rafanoy1992]

I could argue this tournament is probably Nadal's best tournament of the year from top to bottom. The way he was aggressive from the baseline and the way he was serving throughout the tournament were astounding. It felt like he was 22 years old again. Let's hope he continues this excellent form to Cincy and the US Open.

 

[zalvar]

Cali.

You dislike Nadal, that much is clear, but before the match you predict he'll lose and then when he wins, you blame his opponent. Give us a break, eh? The guy is a tennis giant and he swats fellers like Raonic and JJ in his sleep, yet you predicted both of them would beat him. For no reason other than you hoped they would, which loses you credibility.

You predicted Raonic to win, and your reason is that you can't believe Nadal would win five matches in a row on hards.

He won Indian Wells!

Janowicz and Djokovic have more hard-court game than Nadal. They lost those matches more than Nadal won them.

As for today, Raonic is simply terrible from the baseline. As I watched the match today, I realized why I thought he was nothing when I first saw him two years ago. Beating him is nothing to be proud of.

How about beating Nole in the semis? Can he be proud of that or Noles' baseline game is not good either maybe?

Djokovic hit 7 double faults and served 10 percentage points lower than Nadal. He gave it away with sloppiness.

PLS! Rafa was leading 15-40 on Novak's serve in the 2nd set(*) and hit two unforced errors and a couple of 0-30 on the 3rd set. Both of them were sloppy at times. You cant use one excuse for Novak then ignore the same thing happening to Rafa.

 

[zalvar]

I could argue this tournament is probably Nadal's best tournament of the year from top to bottom. The way he was aggressive from the baseline and the way he was serving throughout the tournament were astounding. It felt like he was 22 years old again. Let's he continues this excellent form to Cincy and the US Open.

I think it's his best tournament this year as well. The whole clay season, he had big challenges from Novak and Ferrer. And we all saw the scares in the French Open. This week has been great from Rafa.

 

[Moxie]

I could argue this tournament is probably Nadal's best tournament of the year from top to bottom. The way he was aggressive from the baseline and the way he was serving throughout the tournament were astounding. It felt like he was 22 years old again. Let's he continues this excellent form to Cincy and the US Open.

I think you must be right. I looked back at Barcelona, but that one's like shooting fish in a barrel for him, and not the same level of competition. Given that we haven't known how Rafa would come back, he's been really hard to predict...and in different ways: the Wimbledon 1st round loss was as surprising as his level of play and win in Montreal. Like you, I hope he keeps this level up, but I also hope he doesn't push the knee too hard. From here on in, it's all gravy and there's not reason not to protect his longevity.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

A great week for Rafa!!!
Loved his aggressive play from the baseline
His serve was great too throughout the tournament
Well done Rafa!!!
I wonder if he will play Cincy now?

 

[rafanoy1992]

I could argue this tournament is probably Nadal's best tournament of the year from top to bottom. The way he was aggressive from the baseline and the way he was serving throughout the tournament were astounding. It felt like he was 22 years old again. Let's he continues this excellent form to Cincy and the US Open.

I think you must be right. I looked back at Barcelona, but that one's like shooting fish in a barrel for him, and not the same level of competition. Given that we haven't known how Rafa would come back, he's been really hard to predict...and in different ways: the Wimbledon 1st round loss was as surprising as his level of play and win in Montreal. Like you, I hope he keeps this level up, but I also hope he doesn't push the knee too hard. From here on in, it's all gravy and there's not reason not to protect his longevity.

I'm curious to see how he approaches Cincinnati. I know he will try to play well but at the same time he will try to preserve his knees for the US Open and Fall season. What do you think of his approach will be in Cincy, Moxie?

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Can any tournament come up with a trophy design in such a way
that it cannot be bitten by Rafa?

 

[Moxie]

I could argue this tournament is probably Nadal's best tournament of the year from top to bottom. The way he was aggressive from the baseline and the way he was serving throughout the tournament were astounding. It felt like he was 22 years old again. Let's he continues this excellent form to Cincy and the US Open.

I think you must be right. I looked back at Barcelona, but that one's like shooting fish in a barrel for him, and not the same level of competition. Given that we haven't known how Rafa would come back, he's been really hard to predict...and in different ways: the Wimbledon 1st round loss was as surprising as his level of play and win in Montreal. Like you, I hope he keeps this level up, but I also hope he doesn't push the knee too hard. From here on in, it's all gravy and there's not reason not to protect his longevity.

I'm curious to see how he approaches Cincinnati. I know he will try to play well but at the same time he will try to preserve his knees for the US Open and Fall season. What do you think of his approach will be in Cincy, Moxie?

Really no idea. If he's going to play, I would hope he knows he doesn't have to good too deep. But we all know he tends to play to win. I guess that's why I'd like to see him bail on it. Go into the USO fresh, and with big confidence, based on Montreal.

 

[zalvar]

I personally want him to go to Cincy and try to win. I think it'll be his last Masters 1000, no? He's not signed up for the last 2 (Shanghai and Paris Indoors) according to his website. Maybe he'll change his mind.

 

[rafanoy1992]

I personally want him to go to Cincy and try to win. I think it'll be his last Masters 1000, no? He's not signed up for the last 2 (Shanghai and Paris Indoors) according to his website. Maybe he'll change his mind.

Personally, I don't really have a preference. What I mean, I want him to win (I'm a huge Rafa fan) but the same time if he can reach at least the Quarterfinals, I would be fine with it. The reason I say this because this season feels "weird."

He missed the Australian Open, then he went on to win 7 of 9 tournaments. Then, he shockingly lost in the 1st round of Wimbledon. After all of that, he arguably played his best tennis at Montreal. So, really anything can happen at this point on. Let's just hope he doesn't lose early at the US Open though:nono

 

[Riotbeard]

Congrats to Rafa, et al. Still can't really comment on this tournament without it bothering my mind, so I leave it at that.

 

[zalvar]

I personally want him to go to Cincy and try to win. I think it'll be his last Masters 1000, no? He's not signed up for the last 2 (Shanghai and Paris Indoors) according to his website. Maybe he'll change his mind.

Personally, I don't really have a preference. What I mean, I want him to win (I'm a huge Rafa fan) but the same time if he can reach at least the Quarterfinals, I would be fine with it. The reason I say this because this season feels "weird."

He missed the Australian Open, then he went on to win 7 of 9 tournaments. Then, he shockingly lost in the 1st round of Wimbledon. After all of that, he arguably played his best tennis at Montreal. So, really anything can happen at this point on. Let's just hope he doesn't lose early at the US Open though:nono

haha, yeah it does feel weird. I don't mind a quarters finish in Cincy either. I just meant he shouldn't withdraw

 

[tented]

Congrats to Rafa, et al. Still can't really comment on this tournament without it bothering my mind, so I leave it at that.

Some wouldn't even do this, so hats off to you, Riotbeard. You're a gentleman and a scholar.

 

[Riotbeard]

Congrats to Rafa, et al. Still can't really comment on this tournament without it bothering my mind, so I leave it at that.

Some wouldn't even do this, so hats off to you, Riotbeard. You're a gentleman and a scholar.

haha thanks!