Novak Djokovic Hiatus

[Federberg]

That Thiem match was a nadir for Novak, and I would add yesterday's, though not quite as bad. I wonder if you saw the Querrey upset at Wimbledon 2016, though. That was the first time he started acting like this. He completely went away in the 2nd set (lost it 6-1, after a close first set that he lost in a TB,) and then, after fighting much of the 4th, he suddenly seemed like he couldn't face a 5th, nor indeed the rest of Wimbledon, and he swatted around some loose balls and went home. Granted, it wasn't surprising to see a letdown after completing the Nole Slam, but he's never quite shaken that "letdown" mentality or whatever has gotten into him. I thought he looked like his old self when he beat del Potro then Thiem in Rome last year, but then he collapsed v. Zverev in the final.

good point I forgot about the Querrey match. I reckon a big part of the reason for his success against del Potro and Thiem in Rome was that they played him as if it was the old Novak. Zverev was just too young and disrespectful to care. And that is the essential point for me. It is getting increasingly likely that Novak has blown away all of his credit with the locker room. Unlike Roger and Rafa he won't get the benefit of the doubt and he'll have a long time rebuilding the fear. With Fedal their talent is just too extreme for the respect to dissipate easily, and frankly those guys are stone cold winners and would never give up without a serious fight

 

[El Dude]

As I said in the prediction thread I started, I think Novak either wins no more Slams, or maybe 3 more - less likely in-between.

If his problems are mostly mental, then it is both good and bad news. The bad news is that mental problems are less tangible and thus hard to pinpoint and correct; the good news is that if they are corrected, it could be a quick and complete switch. In other words, one match and Novak could be Novak again.

That said, I'm not convinced it is entirely mental. Underlying injuries can lead to a lack of confidence. If he can't hit the ball like he used to, he could be tentative and it becomes a vicious spiral.

As for spirituality, while I hear the point that I can lead to contentment, but I don't see Novak content with how he's playing. If he were truly content he probably wouldn't play. Further, it is possible to be both "existentially content" but hungry to perform in the moment of a match.

Anyhow, if he doesn't pull it together this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he calls it quits and doesn't play in 2019.

 

[Moxie]

good point I forgot about the Querrey match. I reckon a big part of the reason for his success against del Potro and Thiem in Rome was that they played him as if it was the old Novak. Zverev was just too young and disrespectful to care. And that is the essential point for me. It is getting increasingly likely that Novak has blown away all of his credit with the locker room. Unlike Roger and Rafa he won't get the benefit of the doubt and he'll have a long time rebuilding the fear. With Fedal their talent is just too extreme for the respect to dissipate easily, and frankly those guys are stone cold winners and would never give up without a serious fight

I don't completely agree about Rome. I think there was a glimmer of Novak-Past for a couple of days, and then it faded again, so Zverev capitalized. (Also, I think that Thiem showed, with RG, that he's not prepared mentally to be Rafa and Novak in successive matches.) But I take your point about locker room cred, and Djokovic's has been dented badly. And kids are dangerous, in part because they don't have a lot to fear, and often don't have much to lose by playing all-out.

 

[Moxie]

As I said in the prediction thread I started, I think Novak either wins no more Slams, or maybe 3 more - less likely in-between.

If his problems are mostly mental, then it is both good and bad news. The bad news is that mental problems are less tangible and thus hard to pinpoint and correct; the good news is that if they are corrected, it could be a quick and complete switch. In other words, one match and Novak could be Novak again.

That said, I'm not convinced it is entirely mental. Underlying injuries can lead to a lack of confidence. If he can't hit the ball like he used to, he could be tentative and it becomes a vicious spiral.

As for spirituality, while I hear the point that I can lead to contentment, but I don't see Novak content with how he's playing. If he were truly content he probably wouldn't play. Further, it is possible to be both "existentially content" but hungry to perform in the moment of a match.

Anyhow, if he doesn't pull it together this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he calls it quits and doesn't play in 2019.

I don't actually agree that if the problem is mental that he might flip the switch and be back to his old self. Confidence in your body and your game doesn't come back overnight, and Novak is building up a lot of scar tissue. I do, however, agree that the mental bit can be overcome, whereas injuries and the changes they create in one's game are a greater potential problem for an athlete.

Like you, I don't quite agree with @BalaryKar that spirituality can lead to some kind of neutering of drive. I know that Pepe Imaz is a controversial figure for some, especially amongst Novak fans, and I don't really know his role or usefulness, but a quieting of the mind can be helpful for tennis players. Leave the doubts and mistakes behind, stay in the moment. Nadal and Federer have generally been excellent at this. For all their talents, I think this is amongst their greatest attributes. (IMO, Roger was born confident, and Rafa was born focused.) In his presser yesterday, Djokovic looked genuinely lost. Whatever striving for Zen, he's not finding it atm.

 

[Obsi]

That Thiem match was a nadir for Novak, and I would add yesterday's, though not quite as bad. I wonder if you saw the Querrey upset at Wimbledon 2016, though. That was the first time he started acting like this. He completely went away in the 2nd set (lost it 6-1, after a close first set that he lost in a TB,) and then, after fighting much of the 4th, he suddenly seemed like he couldn't face a 5th, nor indeed the rest of Wimbledon, and he swatted around some loose balls and went home. Granted, it wasn't surprising to see a letdown after completing the Nole Slam, but he's never quite shaken that "letdown" mentality or whatever has gotten into him. I thought he looked like his old self when he beat del Potro then Thiem in Rome last year, but then he collapsed v. Zverev in the final.

The cause of Djokovic’s collapse in the third set against Daniel was not mental. Novak was gassed. His physical fitness is inadequate.

Djokovic doesn’t have problem with motivation anymore.

 

[Johnsteinbeck]

It's too soon. The guy cleaned W, USO, AO and RG in a row less than two years ago. There's bound to be a letdown. He's been a streak player of sorts. 2008, 2011, 2015/16. Unfortunately for him, his 'safe slam' changed surface when he had entered a rough patch.

borrowing this from the IW thread, i think it bears a very valid point - Novak right now doesn't have the safe haven of the AO anymore, partly due to reasons that are not up to him. maybe he realizes that the USO actually are more becoming to him. i really feel he should consider re-aligning his comeback year to get it in perfect tune for that (because nothing short of a slam win will really help him re-gain his confidence and status).

 

[Moxie]

The cause of Djokovic’s collapse in the third set against Daniel was not mental. Novak was gassed. His physical fitness is inadequate.

Djokovic doesn’t have problem with motivation anymore.

Not only is that not what it looked like, that's not even what he said about it. He said "it felt like his first match on the ATP." He was at sea and it was pretty evident. The commentators couldn't help but remark, and they acted pretty shocked.

 

[Obsi]

He said "it felt like his first match on the ATP.”

Can you prove Djokovic was talking about the collapse in the third set? Maybe he was talking what happened after he had the set point in the first set. He played good until that moment.

 

[Moxie]

Can you prove Djokovic was talking about the collapse in the third set? Maybe he was talking what happened after he had the set point in the first set. He played good until that moment.

I thought he was talking about the match in general. He started out well, but he also gave away the lead in the first, then lost it in a TB. It was the 3rd that really looked like a capitulation, which did look to be partly fitness, but not wholly, by any means.

 

[Obsi]

I thought he was talking about the match in general. He started out well, but he also gave away the lead in the first, then lost it in a TB. It was the 3rd that really looked like a capitulation, which did look to be partly fitness, but not wholly, by any means.

I think he was talking what happened after he had the set point. His poor performance from that moment was due to lack of confidence and the collapse in the third set because of physical fitness.

 

[Andy22]

As I said in the prediction thread I started, I think Novak either wins no more Slams, or maybe 3 more - less likely in-between.

If his problems are mostly mental, then it is both good and bad news. The bad news is that mental problems are less tangible and thus hard to pinpoint and correct; the good news is that if they are corrected, it could be a quick and complete switch. In other words, one match and Novak could be Novak again.

That said, I'm not convinced it is entirely mental. Underlying injuries can lead to a lack of confidence. If he can't hit the ball like he used to, he could be tentative and it becomes a vicious spiral.

As for spirituality, while I hear the point that I can lead to contentment, but I don't see Novak content with how he's playing. If he were truly content he probably wouldn't play. Further, it is possible to be both "existentially content" but hungry to perform in the moment of a match.

Anyhow, if he doesn't pull it together this year, I wouldn't be surprised if he calls it quits and doesn't play in 2019.

Djokovic not playing 2019, yea right mate, most likely djokovic will back at his best by then, plus he wins at least 3 more slams at just AO.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Djokovic not playing 2019, yea right mate, most likely djokovic will back at his best by then, plus he wins at least 3 more slams at just AO.

You forgot that orange is the new black. AO is no longer the medium pace hard court GS. So, Novak will not win three more at AO.
May be three more USO, if he comes back to full form and USTA find ways to keep slowing down further.

 

[Moxie]

borrowing this from the IW thread, i think it bears a very valid point - Novak right now doesn't have the safe haven of the AO anymore, partly due to reasons that are not up to him. maybe he realizes that the USO actually are more becoming to him. i really feel he should consider re-aligning his comeback year to get it in perfect tune for that (because nothing short of a slam win will really help him re-gain his confidence and status).

I think that's what he'd have to do, anyway, but it's a good point about the surface change. I don't really see him being ready for either RG or W, in the sense of winning them. But if he's back to healthy, I'm sure he'll be glad to get back on N. Am. HCs. (And it's always nice to see you around, JS. )

 

[Andy22]

You forgot that orange is the new black. AO is no longer the medium pace hard court GS. So, Novak will not win three more at AO.
May be three more USO, if he comes back to full form and USTA find ways to keep slowing down further.

Point taken, Djokovic did poorly this year at AO, USO I Agee djokovic can win a few more. Now about USTA they do a awesome job making it fair for all players, its good how it is.

 

[atttomole]

Point taken, Djokovic did poorly this year at AO, USO I Agee djokovic can win a few more. Now about USTA they do a awesome job making it fair for all players, its good how it is.

How is it fair to all players?

 

[Federberg]

How is it fair to all players?

lol! I think you know the answer to that

 

[DarthFed]

I'm surprised he hasn't asked for it to be changed to clay like he did with Wimbledon.

 

[Andy22]

How is it fair to all players?

So, its fair because it gives all players game styles a chance, slow enough for clay court players to have chance to win, but little fast so the hard court specialist also do well. Plus it gives us chance to see the great nadal vs. Federer for the first time.

 

[Moxie]

So, its fair because it gives all players game styles a chance, slow enough for clay court players to have chance to win, but little fast so the hard court specialist also do well. Plus it gives us chance to see the great nadal vs. Federer for the first time.

That hasn't worked so far. Fingers crossed for this year.

 

[El Dude]

Plus it gives us chance to see the great nadal vs. Federer for the first time.

I think we've seen plenty of that for one lifetime.