Nadal under cover of Wada

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There does seem to be a possible conspiracy against Russian athletes - Sharapova / Russian olympians / Alexander Povetkin who was denied his shot at WBC heavyweight champion Deontay Wilder just a week before the fight - and the Fancy Bears seems like a concerted counterattack to the possible conspiracy -just my two cents -
 
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Moxie

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Agree on that to a large degree... the skill factor in tennis will always mean you can't turn a donkey into a racehorse under any circumstances... so the elite players will be elites.... but PEDs could easily swing the honours one way or another.
I would "Like" this, except for the last bit. You're implying that you think some of the elites may have used PEDs, to "sway the honors." Obviously not Nadal, as his records have been leaked, and his TUEs coincide with injury, including lay-off times. So who would you implicate? I'm guessing not Roger.
 
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I would "Like" this, except for the last bit. You're implying that you think some of the elites may have used PEDs, to "sway the honors." Obviously not Nadal, as his records have been leaked, and his TUEs coincide with injury, including lay-off times. So who would you implicate? I'm guessing not Roger.

I was talking generally about PEDs in tennis rather than approved TUEs.
 

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Yes, I see that. But you're evading the question.

Which athletes use PEDs and which athletes have TUEs aren't the same question. If Federer has no TUEs then does that mean there is no chance he has never taken PEDs of any description? Of course it doesn't.

However, having TUEs doesn't mean you've never illegally tried to gain an edge outside of formal channels. I'll assume RF is clean until some evidence says he isn't... but nothing would surprise me at all and that goes for any player.

My original post said no player will become an elite just based on PEDs but it could be a difference maker to get that extra edge ... and clearly is if other sports are anything to go by. Not sure why you are attempting to turn a pretty obvious general statement into a specific name and shame exercise.
 

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I read your exchange with Broken, and I agree with a lot of it. Certainly that PEDs don't turn a average player into an elite one. But you do take the opportunity to make an innuendo, beyond that, and I was asking you to clarify. It's not a general statement, especially given the title of the thread. Nadal, for one, has had his own records leaked, which means, I think, that he hasn't tested positive for a PED. So you're really only talking about a handful or two, perhaps, of other players.
 

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I read your exchange with Broken, and I agree with a lot of it. Certainly that PEDs don't turn a average player into an elite one. But you do take the opportunity to make an innuendo, beyond that, and I was asking you to clarify. It's not a general statement, especially given the title of the thread. Nadal, for one, has had his own records leaked, which means, I think, that he hasn't tested positive for a PED. So you're really only talking about a handful or two, perhaps, of other players.

You seem to be desperately trying to link illegally using PEDs and leakage of TUEs as one and the same thing.

TUEs are approved requests made to the ITF to use something for medicinal purposes.

PEDs are performance enhancing drugs... Usually used illegally without asking for permission.

Why do you think leaking a TUE database has any relation to illegally using PEDs?
 

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You seem to be desperately trying to link illegally using PEDs and leakage of TUEs as one and the same thing.

TUEs are approved requests made to the ITF to use something for medicinal purposes.

PEDs are performance enhancing drugs... Usually used illegally without asking for permission.

Why do you think leaking a TUE database has any relation to illegally using PEDs?
Welllll, tbh, I hadn't copped to the idea that it was only the TUE database, and I thought it was their testing history, since some folks made such a deal of it. Globally, does this leaking of TUEs tell us anything about a pattern, or misuse? What do we think was the purpose behind it?
 

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It is clear to me that there is a lot of possibility for misuse of TUEs. It's not known what kind of illnesses they are allowed for, who allows them, are some players denied going down this TUE road while others are freely given TUEs. They are all for prohibited substances, so the main issue is how they determine who gets them and how they obtain them.

And frankly, there will always be people who will suspect that these TUEs are just a mask for using PEDs legally.
 

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It is clear to me that there is a lot of possibility for misuse of TUEs. It's not known what kind of illnesses they are allowed for, who allows them, are some players denied going down this TUE road while others are freely given TUEs. They are all for prohibited substances, so the main issue is how they determine who gets them and how they obtain them.

And frankly, there will always be people who will suspect that these TUEs are just a mask for using PEDs legally.
That may be true, but it's kind of lazy thinking. Now that all this stuff has come to light, it would be worth it if someone has analyzed it to see what is possibly abuse, and what is clearly legit. Obviously, it's going to be often legitimate. Athletes get injured more often than the rest of us, and a lot of the commonly prescribed solutions involve cortisones and steroids. Use of them, or being a granted a TUE for them is not necessarily any reason for outrage. However, consistent misuse can be, as we've seen with the recent Meldonium ban. But just because WADA and the ITF have not been models of transparency, there is no reason to mistrust all uses of TUEs. Not that you are, but I'm saying we have to be judicious.
 

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Why do they keep the usage of TUEs private? Why didn't they volunteer that info to the public?
 

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Why do they keep the usage of TUEs private? Why didn't they volunteer that info to the public?
In one way, you can think of it as privileged medical information, and it's awkward for WADA or the ITF to simply publish it without putting in place a blanket release from the athletes. But to that point, they should do that, i.e., require that athletes sign a release to all testing results and exemptions granted, and publish them regularly. That would assume they're interested in transparency, however, which doesn't seem to be the case. I would say that is why Nadal, with his many injuries, has talked about his medical interventions voluntarily.
 
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The fact this TUE info only surfaced because of hackers arouses suspicions about the process - anything that is purposefully hidden should arouse suspicions - Very interesting that Sharapova suggested the ITF and WADA could have intentionally targeted her -
 

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The fact this TUE info only surfaced because of hackers arouses suspicions about the process - anything that is purposefully hidden should arouse suspicions - Very interesting that Sharapova suggested the ITF and WADA could have intentionally targeted her -
But what and which suspicions are aroused? I'm saying that the ITF/WADA doesn't release, but Nadal has spoken about procedures he's undergone. The lack of disclosure is on the powers that be, is it not? Did you read what the TUEs were for Nadal? 25 Sept. 2009: 3mg Betamethasone - one time, intramuscular. (This was in a year when he'd had an injury lay-off for tendinitis in the knees.) 30 July 2012: Corticotropin - intramuscular, 1x every 3 days, expires 8 Aug. (This was during an injury lay-off. Note that the time allotment would have only allowed for 5 shots, and Nadal didn't play again for 5+ months.) I think Nadal's TUEs make sense. I'm not sure where you're going with Sharapova being targeted, though. For what reason?
 

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Sharapova is the one who said she thinks she was targeted by the ITF and WADA - I didn't say this Sharapova did - check her twitter page -
 

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Sharapova is the one who said she thinks she was targeted by the ITF and WADA - I didn't say this Sharapova did - check her twitter page -
You said it was interesting. So, then, in what way? Perhaps you mean "provocative." I really don't see how a former world #1 and multi-slam winner was targeted. The more likely thought, given past experience or general consensus, would be that she'd be protected. She may have had the bad luck to have been complacent about the rules just when they changed, and just when the ITF was coming under more scrutiny. If it's that, I wouldn't say she was "targeted" so much as, when the music stopped, she was short a seat. I think she hit bad judgement in a moment of bad timing.
 
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There is an anti Russian bias in the USA media now - Povetkin the Russian no 1 contender boxer lost his heavyweight title shot vs Deontay Wilder - Hillary Clinton and our Mainstream Media are constantly demonizing Russia - anything is possible including a political propaganda agenda against Russian athletes -