Djokovic the CVAC Cyborg

[EdbergsGhost]

I think I have. He said he stopped using it which was a complete lie as he used it all through this year's AO before and after matches so it clearly works very well. I hadn't read up enough on it and must've missed the part where they claim it's twice as effective as illegal blood doping. Seeing how the guy went from having terrible cardio issues with breathing problems and tons of retirements in a very short space of time from the end of 2010 to being the "fittest" (artificial fitness so I'm putting it in quotes) guy on tour start of 2011 to present, I think the authorities have been poor in not following up on it since they said they needed to look into it and just gave up. It's against the spirit of sport and belittles what past eras have done. Did Laver and Borg have this crap? No. To stay fit they had to train very hard, running on the road etc, day after day.

Laver and his gang were smoking cigarettes and drinking beer after the matches. Borg,Gerulaitis, Mac and the pack were snorting cocaine at Studio 54 with a young Peter Bodo.

 

[Front242]

Laver and his gang were smoking cigarettes and drinking beer after the matches. Borg,Gerulaitis, Mac and the pack were snorting cocaine at Studio 54 with a young Peter Bodo.

None of which are performance enhancing in the slightest. In fact, the polar opposite so it only makes their achievements so much better than a guy sitting in a giant egg to stay "fit".

 

[EdbergsGhost]

None of which are performance enhancing in the slightest. In fact, the polar opposite so it only makes their achievements so much better than a guy sitting in a giant egg to stay "fit".

If that is what you believe he does to stay "fit", good for you. It would be nice to see empirical evidence that it even works. :scratch: Oh. There isn't any.

 

[Front242]

If that is what you believe he does to stay "fit", good for you. It would be nice to see empirical evidence that it even works. :scratch: Oh. There isn't any.

There's plenty of evidence starting with the most obvious, namely he had serious cardio and breathing issues up until late 2010, retiring from a lot of matches and then, presto, starts using this egg and is a total beast just a few months later in 2011 and this hasn't changed since. Secondly, the fact that he's used the machine all through this year's AO is even more proof that it works or why else would he have been rushing off to sit in it after the Simon match and before the Nishikori one as per the link I posted one the first page. Of course this was written before the semi and final so you can bet he used it before and after all matches up to the final.

 

[Moxie]

I think I have. He said he stopped using it which was a complete lie as he used it all through this year's AO before and after matches so it clearly works very well. I hadn't read up enough on it and must've missed the part where they claim it's twice as effective as illegal blood doping. Seeing how the guy went from having terrible cardio issues with breathing problems and tons of retirements in a very short space of time from the end of 2010 to being the "fittest" (artificial fitness so I'm putting it in quotes) guy on tour start of 2011 to present, I think the authorities have been poor in not following up on it since they said they needed to look into it and just gave up. It's against the spirit of sport and belittles what past eras have done. Did Laver and Borg have this crap? No. To stay fit they had to train very hard, running on the road etc, day after day.

Fronty, I don't mean to chase you around about this, but you can be a little lax with your sources. Your first source, the WSJ, very creditable, says nothing about a quote from Allen Ruszkowski, the CEO of CVAC. Yet the 2nd article you cited quotes him as saying that the method is twice as effective as blood-doping, and implies it came from the WSJ article. It did not, and the 2nd article is not from a reliable source. They don't even tell us who they are. And while it's already hard to believe that a CEO would use language such as "twice as effective as blood-doping" to promote his product, a google search comes up with no such quote. They claim to give similar effects to training at altitude. But loads of products make big claims that are, let's say, over-sold.

You're also making a leap as to how much Djokovic has been using it. Documented is 2011 at the USO and 2016 at the AO. However much he has used it in between is unknown. Let me suggest that it doesn't develop a better serve. It doesn't give him the flexibility, balance and timing that he has, which are pretty spectacular. And he's always had a great backhand and ROS. So you're basically just saying that this CVAC took care of his fitness and breathing issues. And that made him a world-beater. I don't buy it. I think his ascendence is down to diet, confidence and, yes, I'll say it, Boris Becker. If it were just about getting into the Egg, then please explain to me the Wimbledon final performance v. Murray in 2013. Heat still bothers him, as does humidity. And wind. He's impressive, but he's not Superman.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Front I agree with some of your points,in saying that I have to agree with Moxie and her lastest response to you.
It is legal,regardless of Wada and the IFT findings to begin with.Until Wada and the ITF I am out in regards to Novak and his use. of the egg or the updated version which is legal by the way,used by marathon runner's and athletes who train in high altitude conditions.

 

[Denis]

Front you're such a bad loser lol

 

[Mastoor]

He used it all during this year's AO so it seems that's total bollocks

First thing you should know about is that the author Perota is an Albanian storyteller, so his good intentions when writing about Serbian superstar are more than questionable.

But lets say he said only truth in his article. Lets say No1e used it during AO, so what? It's yet another placebo concept that No1e thinks helps him along with Christianity, meditations in Buddhist monasteries, drinking warm water, eating GF food, keeping his feet in freezing cold water after matches and God knows what other crap he believes. If those sorts of things help him it is only because he believes they do.

So what do you want done about it? Christianity, Buddhism, drinking warm water, breathing pure oxygen, eating GF food, keeping legs in ice cubes and God knows what else No1e believes into, all prohibited because he keeps beating Federer in slams?

Another point is why they keep advertising the pod that is not working in Wall Street Journal? Also, why US FDA (Food and Drug Agency) which normally chases scammers around the world, not only in USA, lets them manufacturing, advertising and selling the pods in their country.

 

[Moxie]

First thing you should know about is that the author Perota is an Albanian storyteller, so his good intentions when writing about Serbian superstar are more than questionable.

Tom Perrotta and the WSJ article are not the problem. It's the unattributed websites. Perrotta is not an "Albania storyteller," by anything I can tell. He wrote "Election," and "Little Children," both very American stories. Wikipedia tells me he is primarily Italian-American, with some Albania extraction. Mastoor, I feel for you if you lived through that war, but not everything can be filtered through factional goggles. And I think you're completely missing the boat on who is denouncing your Serbian superstar.

 

[Mastoor]

Tom Perrotta and the WSJ article are not the problem. It's the unattributed websites. Perrotta is not an "Albania storyteller," by anything I can tell. He wrote "Election," and "Little Children," both very American stories. Wikipedia tells me he is primarily Italian-American, with some Albania extraction. Mastoor, I feel for you if you lived through that war, but not everything can be filtered through factional goggles. And I think you're completely missing the boat on who is denouncing your Serbian superstar.

His mother is Albanian, so he is that 50% at least. We are yet to see someone of that sort writing objectively about anything or anyone Serbian and I'm sure I am not wrong.

 

[Moxie]

His mother is Albanian, so he is that 50% at least. We are yet to see someone of that sort writing objectively about anything or anyone Serbian and I'm sure I am not wrong.

I read that his mother is Italian-Albanian, so really just 25%. But not to split hairs. Go back to the article. The WSJ/Perrotta one says nothing bad about Djokovic. You're looking for your bogeymen in the wrong place. It's the unattributed website, (and Front, frankly,) that are making insinuations. You are wrong to use language like "someone of that sort," with regards to a writer of repute, and a respected publication. He said nothing wrong about Djokovic. You are spreading division without warrant, and you are also not reading carefully. It's not illegal, and the WSJ article doesn't make any claim that it is. Just puts it out there that some athletes are using it. You are playing into the hands of the likes of that unattributed website, and Front, who are the ones trying to make something nefarious out of the CVAC. Your own prejudice distracts you from where the actual innuendo lies.

 

[Ricardo]

I think a lot of people are still not comfortable that Djokovic's level of fitness upped several notches (pre/post 2011) in a very short time, and they think it's something more than the 'egg' possibly.

There is no evidence but they can't get over it.

 

[Billie]

I think a lot of people are still not comfortable that Djokovic's level of fitness upped several notches (pre/post 2011) in a very short time, and they think it's something more than the 'egg' possibly.

There is no evidence but they can't get over it.

Hm and some people can't get over the fact that 34 old player gets to 2 slam finals last year and gets to #2 ranking in the world playing so many matches, when so many younger and good players can't. He must have some special training, probably.

 

[Rides]

I think a lot of people are still not comfortable that Djokovic's level of fitness upped several notches (pre/post 2011) in a very short time, and they think it's something more than the 'egg' possibly.

There is no evidence but they can't get over it.

There certainly has been a significant change in Novak pre/post 2011. Federer, Nadal and Murray combine for fewer total match retirements than Novak, and Novak has only had the one (last week) since 2011.

It doesn't necessarily point to doping or anything illegal though. He could have simply have rotated fitness and mental/psychological training to the top of this priorities. Lots of top players talk in retrospect on how they didn't 'get' the fitness aspect of the sport until they were well into their careers. This model fits Novak's timeline pretty nicely.

 

[Ricardo]

Hm and some people can't get over the fact that 34 old player gets to 2 slam finals last year and gets to #2 ranking in the world playing so many matches, when so many younger and good players can't. He must have some special training, probably.

in many cases of investigation, people look for sudden changes. Fed's playing pattern hasn't changed and gradually reduces his schedule, while Djokovic's fitness sky-rocketed in a matter of months, see the difference? (you don't need to admit it, it's not even debatable).

 

[Ricardo]

There certainly has been a significant change in Novak pre/post 2011. Federer, Nadal and Murray combine for fewer total match retirements than Novak, and Novak has only had the one (last week) since 2011.

It doesn't necessarily point to doping or anything illegal though. He could have simply have rotated fitness and mental/psychological training to the top of this priorities. Lots of top players talk in retrospect on how they didn't 'get' the fitness aspect of the sport until they were well into their careers. This model fits Novak's timeline pretty nicely.

nobody accused him of doping as there is no 'evidence' but whatever it was, it's magical.

Lance Armstrong never doped according to 'evidence' (testing), so take what you like.