Completing the Resume

[Moxie]

Djokovic is the safest bet to clear up at this stage.

I've never thought the Olympics should involve tennis so don't really look at it as an event.

I agree with this. It's like the NBA in Olympic basketball. While I find it sweet that Rafa won it, it's not a resume-maker/breaker.

Of the options on offer, I don't believe that Roger will win the Olympic gold, MC or Rome. Is that important, in terms of "completing the resume," as the OP posits? I don't think so. It's a pretty shiny resume. If he adds a Major, that would be significant. The rest is about his longevity, consistency, and the top players and up-and-comers that he continues to beat.

Rafa could get win Miami, but to win Bercy or the WTF I think he would specifically have to target them, and then still get a bit lucky. Indoor hards are not his strength. And Djokovic finds his best tennis at the end of the year. Bad combo for Rafa. Still, his resume is pretty impressive, and if he adds to his Slam total to get over Roger, we have a conversation.

As you say, BB, Djokovic is the one with the room and the legs to get some things he hasn't yet got. His stock just went down for RG, but he has a couple more years to make good on that one. Cincy might weirdly allude him, but who cares, really? And the Olympic Gold, as discussed. He might win, but it could also go to some complete surprise, since it often seems to. The thing that Novak has to do for his resume is to win Slams. The rest is window-dressing.

Not sure if I hit these topics on this thread, but I know I did somewhere on the site! Many of us don't think Nole can catch Rafa or Roger in the "GS majors" count, but having a complete RESUME and owning the record for Masters would put him up there with them without question! I have complete faith that he has the time and ability to do it! Rafa and Roger are probably "past it" in trying to complete their resumes! :nono :angel:

I don't think pros should be going to the Olympics either; esp. millionaires from tennis and basketball! I have huge reservations concerning Rafa and his legacy! His main claim to fame after all is said and done is he did "reach #1," but couldn't hold it because his consistency was nowhere near the other greats! The 9 FO's will lead the headlines in the OBIT! He has NEVER defended a title off the clay surface which is very strange! Even the most obscure of champions like a "Pat Rafter" retained his USO title years ago! Rafa hasn't done it at a 250 or 500 on HC, grass, or indoor court; much less at a Masters! The most criminal part of Rafa's record is that he does own Roger: lock, stock, and barrel; esp. on clay! :cover uzzled :nono :eyepop

Completing some box set of MS will not get Novak into the conversation. It's all about the Slams.

As to your point that I bolded above, Rafa's main claim to fame is not that he reached #1 though he's like #9 on the all-time list. It's that he won 14 Majors, and dominated the clay season like no one before him. That he dominated the other greatest of his era, Roger Federer, and at times held a H2H advantage over the basically all of the field that mattered, is a point worth making. (Upon entering the 2013 USO, he had a winning H2H over every seeded player.)

His time at #1 was pretty good, given his absences for injury. And you often harp on him not defending titles, when, that doesn't really matter, if you win other ones. Rafa has won all but 2 of the MS. All of the Majors.

It starts to sound crabby when people wonder what he might have done better. Probably Djokovic fans feel the same. :hug

 

[Fiero425]

I agree with this. It's like the NBA in Olympic basketball. While I find it sweet that Rafa won it, it's not a resume-maker/breaker.

Of the options on offer, I don't believe that Roger will win the Olympic gold, MC or Rome. Is that important, in terms of "completing the resume," as the OP posits? I don't think so. It's a pretty shiny resume. If he adds a Major, that would be significant. The rest is about his longevity, consistency, and the top players and up-and-comers that he continues to beat.

Rafa could get win Miami, but to win Bercy or the WTF I think he would specifically have to target them, and then still get a bit lucky. Indoor hards are not his strength. And Djokovic finds his best tennis at the end of the year. Bad combo for Rafa. Still, his resume is pretty impressive, and if he adds to his Slam total to get over Roger, we have a conversation.

As you say, BB, Djokovic is the one with the room and the legs to get some things he hasn't yet got. His stock just went down for RG, but he has a couple more years to make good on that one. Cincy might weirdly allude him, but who cares, really? And the Olympic Gold, as discussed. He might win, but it could also go to some complete surprise, since it often seems to. The thing that Novak has to do for his resume is to win Slams. The rest is window-dressing.

Not sure if I hit these topics on this thread, but I know I did somewhere on the site! Many of us don't think Nole can catch Rafa or Roger in the "GS majors" count, but having a complete RESUME and owning the record for Masters would put him up there with them without question! I have complete faith that he has the time and ability to do it! Rafa and Roger are probably "past it" in trying to complete their resumes! :nono :angel:

I don't think pros should be going to the Olympics either; esp. millionaires from tennis and basketball! I have huge reservations concerning Rafa and his legacy! His main claim to fame after all is said and done is he did "reach #1," but couldn't hold it because his consistency was nowhere near the other greats! The 9 FO's will lead the headlines in the OBIT! He has NEVER defended a title off the clay surface which is very strange! Even the most obscure of champions like a "Pat Rafter" retained his USO title years ago! Rafa hasn't done it at a 250 or 500 on HC, grass, or indoor court; much less at a Masters! The most criminal part of Rafa's record is that he does own Roger: lock, stock, and barrel; esp. on clay! :cover uzzled :nono :eyepop

Completing some box set of MS will not get Novak into the conversation. It's all about the Slams.

As to your point that I bolded above, Rafa's main claim to fame is not that he reached #1 though he's like #9 on the all-time list. It's that he won 14 Majors, and dominated the clay season like no one before him. That he dominated the other greatest of his era, Roger Federer, and at times held a H2H advantage over the basically all of the field that mattered, is a point worth making. (Upon entering the 2013 USO, he had a winning H2H over every seeded player.)

His time at #1 was pretty good, given his absences for injury. And you often harp on him not defending titles, when, that doesn't really matter, if you win other ones. Rafa has won all but 2 of the MS. All of the Majors.

It starts to sound crabby when people wonder what he might have done better. Probably Djokovic fans feel the same. :hug

I was bored; just wanted to rant about something to get a dialogue going! No wonder a couple people hit me up about coming back while on "suspension;" it's just not been too active around here of late IMO! I have no life and monitor this board along with others; "hard times here" for the most part! uzzled :nono :angel: :dodgy:

 

[Moxie]

Not sure if I hit these topics on this thread, but I know I did somewhere on the site! Many of us don't think Nole can catch Rafa or Roger in the "GS majors" count, but having a complete RESUME and owning the record for Masters would put him up there with them without question! I have complete faith that he has the time and ability to do it! Rafa and Roger are probably "past it" in trying to complete their resumes! :nono :angel:

I don't think pros should be going to the Olympics either; esp. millionaires from tennis and basketball! I have huge reservations concerning Rafa and his legacy! His main claim to fame after all is said and done is he did "reach #1," but couldn't hold it because his consistency was nowhere near the other greats! The 9 FO's will lead the headlines in the OBIT! He has NEVER defended a title off the clay surface which is very strange! Even the most obscure of champions like a "Pat Rafter" retained his USO title years ago! Rafa hasn't done it at a 250 or 500 on HC, grass, or indoor court; much less at a Masters! The most criminal part of Rafa's record is that he does own Roger: lock, stock, and barrel; esp. on clay! :cover uzzled :nono :eyepop

Completing some box set of MS will not get Novak into the conversation. It's all about the Slams.

As to your point that I bolded above, Rafa's main claim to fame is not that he reached #1 though he's like #9 on the all-time list. It's that he won 14 Majors, and dominated the clay season like no one before him. That he dominated the other greatest of his era, Roger Federer, and at times held a H2H advantage over the basically all of the field that mattered, is a point worth making. (Upon entering the 2013 USO, he had a winning H2H over every seeded player.)

His time at #1 was pretty good, given his absences for injury. And you often harp on him not defending titles, when, that doesn't really matter, if you win other ones. Rafa has won all but 2 of the MS. All of the Majors.

It starts to sound crabby when people wonder what he might have done better. Probably Djokovic fans feel the same. :hug

I was bored; just wanted to rant about something to get a dialogue going! No wonder a couple people hit me up about coming back while on "suspension;" it's just not been too active around here of late IMO! I have no life and monitor this board along with others; "hard times here" for the most part! uzzled :nono :angel: :dodgy:

Fiero, I'm sorry if you're having hard times. I have been, too. No reason to rant or punch out, though. If you want a conversation, there is always one here. No need to rant...just converse. How about that? :hug :angel:

 

[Kirijax]

Not sure if I hit these topics on this thread, but I know I did somewhere on the site! Many of us don't think Nole can catch Rafa or Roger in the "GS majors" count, but having a complete RESUME and owning the record for Masters would put him up there with them without question! I have complete faith that he has the time and ability to do it! Rafa and Roger are probably "past it" in trying to complete their resumes! :nono :angel:

I don't think pros should be going to the Olympics either; esp. millionaires from tennis and basketball! I have huge reservations concerning Rafa and his legacy! His main claim to fame after all is said and done is he did "reach #1," but couldn't hold it because his consistency was nowhere near the other greats! The 9 FO's will lead the headlines in the OBIT! He has NEVER defended a title off the clay surface which is very strange! Even the most obscure of champions like a "Pat Rafter" retained his USO title years ago! Rafa hasn't done it at a 250 or 500 on HC, grass, or indoor court; much less at a Masters! The most criminal part of Rafa's record is that he does own Roger: lock, stock, and barrel; esp. on clay! :cover uzzled :nono :eyepop

Completing some box set of MS will not get Novak into the conversation. It's all about the Slams.

As to your point that I bolded above, Rafa's main claim to fame is not that he reached #1 though he's like #9 on the all-time list. It's that he won 14 Majors, and dominated the clay season like no one before him. That he dominated the other greatest of his era, Roger Federer, and at times held a H2H advantage over the basically all of the field that mattered, is a point worth making. (Upon entering the 2013 USO, he had a winning H2H over every seeded player.)

His time at #1 was pretty good, given his absences for injury. And you often harp on him not defending titles, when, that doesn't really matter, if you win other ones. Rafa has won all but 2 of the MS. All of the Majors.

It starts to sound crabby when people wonder what he might have done better. Probably Djokovic fans feel the same. :hug

I was bored; just wanted to rant about something to get a dialogue going! No wonder a couple people hit me up about coming back while on "suspension;" it's just not been too active around here of late IMO! I have no life and monitor this board along with others; "hard times here" for the most part! uzzled :nono :angel: :dodgy:

AHH-HA! Boredom always leads to interesting trouble.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Just giving a bump to this thread.

Since the time poll was created, Novak has filled one gap in resume, viz., winning RG.

It is fair to say that, Roger's gap concerning OG will remain unfulfilled. It is too much of a stretch even for me to imagine he winning it in 2020, assuming he is even playing that time.

With roger quitting for the year, there is a very good chance that Novak will win Cincy this year as Roger was his primary obstacle there. But, I am not so sure of Novak winning OG as Andy might defend it. But, Novak will get at least one more attempt at it, even if he does not get it done this year.

The other gaps of Roger and Rafa also have extremely small chances of getting filled.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Bodo seems optimistic of Fed's stab at Tokyo 2020 .

Wouldn't it be fun, if Fed comes back wins a couple of slams and then wins OGS in Tokyo at 39 years and then calls it quits. Just dreaming.

 

[Fiero425]

Bodo seems optimistic of Fed's stab at Tokyo 2020 .

Wouldn't it be fun, if Fed comes back, wins a couple of slams, and then wins OGS in Tokyo at 39 years; then calls it quits. Just dreaming.

I hope you don't drive under this kind of influence! :celeb: :celeb: uzzled :nono :celeb: :celeb: :zzz:

 

[herios]

My fellow Hungarian Bodo should retire himself already:nono

 

[lob]

Rafa's career, like his game, is the most unconventional among all time greats. His biggest claim to fame are of course the nine RGs and the absolute domination of the Clay circuit. But there is a subtext in his career which is even more impressive. To me Rafa is strategically the smartest among the all time greats. What stands out most in his career is how well he used strategy and guile to adapt his game, his choices, his energy and audacity to win big. Lest anyone think that this is a backhanded compliment, what I am emphasizing is how sharp his mind is and how tough the s.o.b. is. He always found a way to play to his strengths and hang in there.

There are too many examples. The foundation of his Wimbledon victories was his first serve percentage and placement. Everybody knows that they matter. But he alone could adjust his game around that foundation beautifully to win two Wimbledons. Of course how he used top spin + bounce + left handedness to decimate the tour on clay is startling. His superior H2H with respect to the rest of the top 10 and almost the entire tour is no accident. It shows how well he understood that tennis at that level is all about confidence. You can't be confident consistently without a winning H2H. His 'inability' to defend off clay can be seen as a weakness in his game. But to me it shows how well he succeeded in not letting the opposition from 'figuring him out'. So, in a sense, that gap is a reflection of his subconscious strategic intelligence. No, it's not just uncle Tony. Not everyone is amazingly clever enough and tenacious enough to understand, implement, adapt and exploit good advice. Ask Roger/JWT/Nalby/Berdych/Roddick or even the younger Novak/Murray.

No wonder the dude plays poker at a high level!

 

[lob]

PS: can anyone imagine Rafa dumping two double faults at that juncture like Roger did in the SF vs. Raonic? Or DF at that moment like Novak in the 2013 (?) RG final. Or like Roddick losing that second set tie break from 5-2 with a set already in the bag? Or like Roger losing the match points in USO SF 2010/11 against Novak? Or losing his first four GS finals like Murray did?

I am actually interested in knowing some stats.
Did Rafa ever lose from two sets up in a five setter?
Did he ever lose a match after earning a match point?
How often did he lose a match after winning the first set?

That AO 2012 missed volley is his only big blunder that I can recollect. There may be others but you can count them with one hand.

 

[Riotbeard]

Rafa's career, like his game, is the most unconventional among all time greats. His biggest claim to fame are of course the nine RGs and the absolute domination of the Clay circuit. But there is a subtext in his career which is even more impressive. To me Rafa is strategically the smartest among the all time greats. What stands out most in his career is how well he used strategy and guile to adapt his game, his choices, his energy and audacity to win big. Lest anyone think that this is a backhanded compliment, what I am emphasizing is how sharp his mind is and how tough the s.o.b. is. He always found a way to play to his strengths and hang in there.

There are too many examples. The foundation of his Wimbledon victories was his first serve percentage and placement. Everybody knows that they matter. But he alone could adjust his game around that foundation beautifully to win two Wimbledons. Of course how he used top spin + bounce + left handedness to decimate the tour on clay is startling. His superior H2H with respect to the rest of the top 10 and almost the entire tour is no accident. It shows how well he understood that tennis at that level is all about confidence. You can't be confident consistently without a winning H2H. His 'inability' to defend off clay can be seen as a weakness in his game. But to me it shows how well he succeeded in not letting the opposition from 'figuring him out'. So, in a sense, that gap is a reflection of his subconscious strategic intelligence. No, it's not just uncle Tony. Not everyone is amazingly clever enough and tenacious enough to understand, implement, adapt and exploit good advice. Ask Roger/JWT/Nalby/Berdych/Roddick or even the younger Novak/Murray.

No wonder the dude plays poker at a high level!

I feel like this was meant for another thread, as it is completely non sequitur...

 

[lob]

Riot: I was responding to the exchange between Fiero and Moxie above. Sorry, if this didn't belong here.

 

[Fiero425]

Riot: I was responding to the exchange between Fiero and Moxie above. Sorry, if this didn't belong here.

OTTH, Rafa was up 2 sets to love to Fabio Fognini in the 3rd Rd of '15 USO; preceded to give it up & lost it in 5, 6-3,6-4,4-6,3-6,4-6! IIRC, it was the 1st time with a record of 150-1 in 5 set matches when leading 2 sets to love!:nono

 

[Riotbeard]

Riot: I was responding to the exchange between Fiero and Moxie above. Sorry, if this didn't belong here.

No worries Makes sense now, I didn't re-read them since they were from last summer.

 

[Kieran]

I am actually interested in knowing some stats.
Did Rafa ever lose from two sets up in a five setter?

Twice, as far as I know. As a kid against Roger in Miami in 2005, I think, and last year at the USO against Fognini.

Did he ever lose a match after earning a match point?

I think he had match point against Thiem earlier in the year, and lost. I know he has lost after having match point.

How often did he lose a match after winning the first set?

At slams, he had an incredible record in this regard, losing only one until 2012, when both Novak and Rosol beat him after losing the first. Not sure the full stats, nor would many people know how many 3 set matches he lost after winning the first.

That AO 2012 missed volley is his only big blunder that I can recollect. There may be others but you can count them with one hand.

It was a backhand down the line. :cover I still see it, in 3D technicolour with sound-surround and smellovison... :cry

 

[the AntiPusher]

I am actually interested in knowing some stats.
Did Rafa ever lose from two sets up in a five setter?

Twice, as far as I know. As a kid against Roger in Miami in 2005, I think, and last year at the USO against Fognini.

Did he ever lose a match after earning a match point?

I think he had match point against Thiem earlier in the year, and lost. I know he has lost after having match point.

How often did he lose a match after winning the first set?

At slams, he had an incredible record in this regard, losing only one until 2012, when both Novak and Rosol beat him after losing the first. Not sure the full stats, nor would many people know how many 3 set matches he lost after winning the first.

That AO 2012 missed volley is his only big blunder that I can recollect. There may be others but you can count them with one hand.

It was a backhand down the line. :cover I still see it, in 3D technicolour with sound-surround and smellovison... :cry

me too 4-2 30-15 . Why didn't Rafa just hit him with the ball. SMH

 

[Kieran]

I am actually interested in knowing some stats.
Did Rafa ever lose from two sets up in a five setter?

Twice, as far as I know. As a kid against Roger in Miami in 2005, I think, and last year at the USO against Fognini.

Did he ever lose a match after earning a match point?

I think he had match point against Thiem earlier in the year, and lost. I know he has lost after having match point.

How often did he lose a match after winning the first set?

At slams, he had an incredible record in this regard, losing only one until 2012, when both Novak and Rosol beat him after losing the first. Not sure the full stats, nor would many people know how many 3 set matches he lost after winning the first.

That AO 2012 missed volley is his only big blunder that I can recollect. There may be others but you can count them with one hand.

It was a backhand down the line. :cover I still see it, in 3D technicolour with sound-surround and smellovison... :cry

me too 4-2 30-15 . Why didn't Rafa just hit him with the ball. SMH

Exactly. Blam, 40-15. I watched Djoker smile waiting to return at 30-all and I went looking for the sick bucket. The backhand only made it level in that game, but really, it was the moment Rafa blinked... :nono

 

[the AntiPusher]

Again Andy Dufresene stood a better chance with the sisters at Shawhank then anyone other than Roger stopping Novak at Cincy..I would give a Federer a better chance without any pre tournament warm up matches to be compete effectively against Novak at Cincy than anyone else.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Sorry Nole, you cannot complete the resume (at least for four more years).

You better get that flower vase on sale before Roger comes back.

 

[Fiero425]

Sorry Nole, you cannot complete the resume (at least for four more years).

You better get that flower vase on sale before Roger comes back.

He'll be all the more ready for Cincy and USO now that OG out of his reach for the time being! :angel: