Borg McEnroe

[Nadalfan2013]

As great as the Fed-Rafa rivalry has been, I don't think it quite has the story or sex appeal of Borg-McEnroe. Furthermore, this sort of movie really needs to be made years after they retire.

Rafa has a lot of sex appeal even has been an underwear model but of course Federer doesn't and would kind of ruin the movie. I feel that they should do a Rafa movie alone, not with Federer. Maybe they will do a movie about Rafa in 10 years and release it in celebration of his 20th French Open title. Have a nice day everyone! B-)

 

[El Dude]

Bait not taken.

 

[Horsa]

Rafa has a lot of sex appeal even has been an underwear model but of course Federer doesn't and would kind of ruin the movie. I feel that they should do a Rafa movie alone, not with Federer. Maybe they will do a movie about Rafa in 10 years and release it in celebration of his 20th French Open title. Have a nice day everyone! B-)

I think you would have been wiser saying that there should be a Rafa vs. Fed film & not say that Fed would ruin the film as there are a lot of Fed fans here & that way you would keep everyone sweet & not put yourself in the firing line. As a result, no animosity. Have a nice day!

 

[Moxie]

Talking of sportsmanship and McEnroe, it should be noted that, when Borg asked him to play an exhibition in South Africa during apartheid, McEnroe declined, saying that, "I have better ways to earn a million dollars." So call him a brat, but he respected the sports boycott of SA.

 

[JesuslookslikeBorg]

the "you cannot be serious" mac outburst was in 1981..so to shoehorn that into stuff from 1980 is pretty feeble.

also the actual dialogue of that row is different in the film..i mean why ?..as if the original wasn't dramatic enough.

folk responsible must be cinematic wankers.

 

[Horsa]

Talking of sportsmanship and McEnroe, it should be noted that, when Borg asked him to play an exhibition in South Africa during apartheid, McEnroe declined, saying that, "I have better ways to earn a million dollars." So call him a brat, but he respected the sports boycott of SA.

O.K.

 

[Horsa]

the "you cannot be serious" mac outburst was in 1981..so to shoehorn that into stuff from 1980 is pretty feeble.

also the actual dialogue of that row is different in the film..i mean why ?..as if the original wasn't dramatic enough.

folk responsible must be cinematic wankers.

There were other outbursts when he came up with that & 1980 is a bit before my time (not by much but a bit) but when I think of McEnroe that's what I think of. Maybe I should have stayed quiet. (I actually thought I was doing well not leaving myself that open & thinking of & preventing repercussions. I was wrong.) I'm used to always having to have an answer to everything spontaneously & normally I have a decent answer to everything spontaneously (that's why I normally have no problem talking about things I know little or nothing about though I ask questions sometimes) so I must be slacking. I haven't seen the film yet but it sounds interesting.

 

[Moxie]

I finally saw this film last night and really enjoyed it. The actors did a fine job and it really gives a glimpse into the minds of these two iconic greats, as well as tennis of around 1980.

For those unfamiliar with the movie, it is centered around their 1980 Wimbledon final, although half the film is biographical flashbacks for both players. The film follows both, although the emphasis seems slightly more on Borg. I also loved the depiction of Vitas Gerulaitis.

If the film is accurate, it painted a picture of Borg that I wasn't fully aware of: that he was really quite tightly wound and had an immense routine to keep his emotions under check. The film implies, if not outright states, that he retired so young mostly because he simply couldn't stand the intense pressure anymore - but it was an internal pressure to keep his emotions in check.

There was a point in the film where his coach, Lennart Bergelin, said something to the effect that Borg wouldn't be able to handle not being the best, that he would completely collapse when he slipped. This implies that even if he had played on, with McEnroe surpassing--as he did by 1981--he might not have won that much more. But we'll never know.

Anyhow, it was nice to see an actually good tennis film. Battle of the Sexes, also from 2017, was also quite good. Other than that, not much out there (I suppose Wimbledon was cute).

My only complaint about the film is that I didn't love the actual tennis scenes. I'm used to watching actual matches, or highlights of actual matches, and these were obviously staged, without much really good action. I'm not sure how they could have done it otherwise, but it was very "set proppy," if that makes sense.

Highly recommended. I just love the scene near the end, in the airport - very touching.

I watched it last night. The actor that played Borg was uncanny. The point was made that he was pushed too hard too young, and I think there's truth in that. There is a moment in the Wimbledon scenes where they cross at the change over, and Borg tells him to just "be himself," or something like that. That didn't happen in that final, but it did happen in a match. McEnroe was imploding with anger and Borg told him, during the match, to just chill out and play, and I think McEnroe ended up beating him. As you say, the end was touching, because they have ended up being friends, and no one knows what they went through but each other. Same with Evert and Navratilova. And despite trollish film scripts suggestions that will never be made, I do think that Roger and Rafa will be sitting in that chair, going over the 2008 Wimbledon together. As much as some Fed fans hate it, they're tied at the hip, and most likely there is no one who understands what they've gone through better than each other.

 

[El Dude]

I watched it last night. The actor that played Borg was uncanny. The point was made that he was pushed too hard too young, and I think there's truth in that. There is a moment in the Wimbledon scenes where they cross at the change over, and Borg tells him to just "be himself," or something like that. That didn't happen in that final, but it did happen in a match. McEnroe was imploding with anger and Borg told him, during the match, to just chill out and play, and I think McEnroe ended up beating him. As you say, the end was touching, because they have ended up being friends, and no one knows what they went through but each other. Same with Evert and Navratilova. And despite trollish film scripts suggestions that will never be made, I do think that Roger and Rafa will be sitting in that chair, going over the 2008 Wimbledon together. As much as some Fed fans hate it, they're tied at the hip, and most likely there is no one who understands what they've gone through better than each other.

Absolutely. The film, like most biopics, was more a recreation than a realistic depiction, with various things mashed together. For instance, the film made it seem like it was there first meeting when they were already deep into their rivalry, and Mac had already won a Slam.

I agree on Roger and Rafa. Where we disagree is that Novak is there, too - at least in ability and more and more so in accomplishments. He will always be the third wheel in a way, but as an equal third wheel - just not part of the "couple" that is Fedal. I could be wrong, but I think there's genuine affection between Roger and Rafa, not so much with either and Novak. Maybe someday.

 

[Moxie]

Absolutely. The film, like most biopics, was more a recreation than a realistic depiction, with various things mashed together. For instance, the film made it seem like it was there first meeting when they were already deep into their rivalry, and Mac had already won a Slam.

I agree on Roger and Rafa. Where we disagree is that Novak is there, too - at least in ability and more and more so in accomplishments. He will always be the third wheel in a way, but as an equal third wheel - just not part of the "couple" that is Fedal. I could be wrong, but I think there's genuine affection between Roger and Rafa, not so much with either and Novak. Maybe someday.

I'm not trying to leave out Novak on purpose, but you're right that he's a 3rd wheel. I'm just saying what works for history and neat packagings. Sorry for Novak, but the conversation will always be about Roger and Rafa. It has been a great rivalry. Epic matches. Back and forth with #1/#2 for six solid years. In the historical tennis conversation, of course Nole is in there. When they make the movie, I'm sorry...he doesn't fit.

 

[Horsa]

I watched it last night. The actor that played Borg was uncanny. The point was made that he was pushed too hard too young, and I think there's truth in that. There is a moment in the Wimbledon scenes where they cross at the change over, and Borg tells him to just "be himself," or something like that. That didn't happen in that final, but it did happen in a match. McEnroe was imploding with anger and Borg told him, during the match, to just chill out and play, and I think McEnroe ended up beating him. As you say, the end was touching, because they have ended up being friends, and no one knows what they went through but each other. Same with Evert and Navratilova. And despite trollish film scripts suggestions that will never be made, I do think that Roger and Rafa will be sitting in that chair, going over the 2008 Wimbledon together. As much as some Fed fans hate it, they're tied at the hip, and most likely there is no one who understands what they've gone through better than each other.

Excuse me, please. I'm no troll.

 

[Ricardo]

Absolutely. The film, like most biopics, was more a recreation than a realistic depiction, with various things mashed together. For instance, the film made it seem like it was there first meeting when they were already deep into their rivalry, and Mac had already won a Slam.

I agree on Roger and Rafa. Where we disagree is that Novak is there, too - at least in ability and more and more so in accomplishments. He will always be the third wheel in a way, but as an equal third wheel - just not part of the "couple" that is Fedal. I could be wrong, but I think there's genuine affection between Roger and Rafa, not so much with either and Novak. Maybe someday.

Affection my butt! Rafa publicly criticised Roger for not supporting his self served 2 year ranking change, and he doesn’t usually critisize anyone else. Also Novak and Isner both offered words of support to Roger when Julien said something about his AO previlage, don’t ever hear about Rafa backing Roger in anything.

 

[Chris Koziarz]

And despite trollish film scripts suggestions that will never be made, I do think that Roger and Rafa will be sitting in that chair, going over the 2008 Wimbledon together

Excuse me, please. I'm no troll.

Rest assured that you're not a troll. I'm more confident about it than about anything else I have said on this site.
My interpretation of Moxie's quoted assertion is: she thought about this post, where NadalFan2013 said:
"Federer [...] would kind of ruin the movie they should do a Rafa movie alone, not with Federer"
Such sentence by NadalFan2013, does dewfinitely qualify as trolling.

 

[Horsa]

Rest assured that you're not a troll. I'm more confident about it than about anything else I have said on this site.
My interpretation of Moxie's quoted assertion is: she thought about this post, where NadalFan2013 said:
"Federer [...] would kind of ruin the movie they should do a Rafa movie alone, not with Federer"
Such sentence by NadalFan2013, does dewfinitely qualify as trolling.

Thank you very much, Chris. I know that the quotation you stated by NadalFan is a trolling post but as I also mentioned a Roger & Rafa film according to Moxie's phraseology I could also be classed as a troll & I was only joining in & referring to NadalFan's original suggestion about a Rafa film using a bit of imagination & keeping the peace on all sides or trying to anyway. Don't forget that I'm noticing more since I got my new specs as I'm seeing things a lot better than I have done for ages. I guess I should leave my imagination for my stories, reading fiction, thinking about how other people must be feeling or what they'll think or feel if I say this or that or acting though. If I'm a troll I want to be the equine-loving troll or the poetic troll. Lol.

 

[Moxie]

Thank you very much, Chris. I know that the quotation you stated by NadalFan is a trolling post but as I also mentioned a Roger & Rafa film according to Moxie's phraseology I could also be classed as a troll & I was only joining in & referring to NadalFan's original suggestion about a Rafa film using a bit of imagination & keeping the peace on all sides or trying to anyway. Don't forget that I'm noticing more since I got my new specs as I'm seeing things a lot better than I have done for ages. I guess I should leave my imagination for my stories, reading fiction, thinking about how other people must be feeling or what they'll think or feel if I say this or that or acting though. If I'm a troll I want to be the equine-loving troll or the poetic troll. Lol.

No, Chris is right...I was just referring to the original suggestion, which seemed pointlessly fannish and silly to me, but you have every right to treat it seriously. I know for sure you are no troll.

 

[Fiero425]

I'm not trying to leave out Novak on purpose, but you're right that he's a 3rd wheel. I'm just saying what works for history and neat packagings. Sorry for Novak, but the conversation will always be about Roger and Rafa. It has been a great rivalry. Epic matches. Back and forth with #1/#2 for six solid years. In the historical tennis conversation, of course Nole is in there. When they make the movie, I'm sorry...he doesn't fit.

OCO, the rivalry aspect of Fedal needs to be stopped! They'll always be linked, but it's a crock and something that was fabricated by the media! You know bloody well, after Rafa got himself established on tour in '08, he owned Roger lock, stock, & barrel; even on grass! It's a wonder Fed has been able to take their last few encounters from '17 that I still can't believe! The H2H will never become level even if they hang around for another 5 years! :whistle: :cuckoo:

 

[Moxie]

OCO, the rivalry aspect of Fedal needs to be stopped! They'll always be linked, but it's a crock and something that was fabricated by the media! You know bloody well, after Rafa got himself established on tour in '08, he owned Roger lock, stock, & barrel; even on grass! It's a wonder Fed has been able to take their last few encounters from '17 that I still can't believe! The H2H will never become level even if they hang around for another 5 years! :whistle: :cuckoo:

I don't know what "OCO" means, but as to the rest, you're banging your head against a wall. It'll always be an historic rivalry.

 

[Fiero425]

I don't know what "OCO" means, but as to the rest, you're banging your head against a wall. It'll always be an historic rivalry.

"Oh come on!" The facts will come to the fore later in this so called historic rivalry when the record is analyzed more closely! I was one who actually made excuses for Roger; blaming it on the clay, Rafa's gamesmanship, and a host of other reasons to explain why "The GOAT" was being owned with a severely losing record! :whistle:

 

[Moxie]

"Oh come on!" The facts will come to the fore later in this so called historic rivalry when the record is analyzed more closely! I was one who actually made excuses for Roger; blaming it on the clay, Rafa's gamesmanship, and a host of other reasons to explain why "The GOAT" was being owned with a severely losing record! :whistle:

I don't think history will be on your side, Fiero. No amount of your childish whining will make the rivalry not a compelling thing.

 

[Fiero425]

I don't think history will be on your side, Fiero. No amount of your childish whining will make the rivalry not a compelling thing.

I never said their matches weren't compelling by the masses; just not a real rivalry until what you want to call it now! The #'s don't lie! :whistle: