Will Fed's 2014 Wimby be like Pete's 2002 USO?

[Tennis Miller]

The stars have aligned. So Milos played the Scheng Schalken role in the semis. Will Nole roll over pretty meekly  the way Andre did in the 2002 USO final? I think if Fed doesn't get it done quickly, Fedfans will suffer deep disappointment as the match rolls on and the errors mount....

It's going to take three quick flawless sets by Roger to keep Nole from getting his teeth in the match and bringing the pain. If this goes even 4, I don't think 90 Minute Fed will be able to summon up TMF for that long.

Cheers
TM

 

[Kieran]

We need ricardo to pipe up that Agassi beating Hewitt was taking the Rafa out of Sampras way. :snigger

I don't think they're comparable, though. For a start, if Roger wins on Sunday, he'll still continue to play, where Pete didn't, and he'll maybe have the guts and confidence to win the US Open (providing Agassi takes care of Rafa :laydownlaughing )...

 

[Front242]

You're mad about that 90 minute mark lol He can play well for more than 90 mins and Novak screws up frequently too and has a far worse record in finals than Roger btw. Even if Roger loses he'll be 17-8 in finals. A lot better than 6-8.

 

[Kieran]

Will Nole roll over pretty meekly  the way Andre did in the 2002 USO final?

Hey by the way, I just noticed this bit! Are you kidding? :lolz: :laydownlaughing

I was at that match and that ain't what happened... :nono

 

[Tennis Miller]

Will Nole roll over pretty meekly  the way Andre did in the 2002 USO final?

Hey by the way, I just noticed this bit! Are you kidding? :lolz: :laydownlaughing

I was at that match and that ain't what happened... :nono

I watched it too and I never felt Andre was a real threat to win that match. I don't think Andre felt he could beat Pete at the USO. As in the 1995 US Open final, certainly Andre did not bring to that 2002 final match the kind of tennis he'd been playing. And Pete was simply better than Andre on faster surfaces [grass, USO, carpet] anyway, while Andre was better on the slower surfaces [clay, AO Rebound Ace].

Cheers
TM

 

[Tennis Miller]

You're mad about that 90 minute mark lol He can play well for more than 90 mins and Novak screws up frequently too and has a far worse record in finals than Roger btw. Even if Roger loses he'll be 17-8 in finals. A lot better than 6-8.

4 of Fed's matches have been 94 minutes or less. Today was 100 min. Stan won the first set in the QF, then Fed played well for 3 sets, although a clearly physically failing Stan couldn't mount a final push. All I'm saying is that pretty much all year, there's been around a 90 - 100 minute ceiling on Fed's ability to find a level that he used to be able to play at for 4 hours or even more sometimes.

Sunday will tell if I need to eat some crow on this call!

Cheers
TM

 

[Riotbeard]

Can't see this as Roger's Swan Song unless he has been in lying in every presser for the last year, including those in the last couple of days.

 

[Kieran]

Will Nole roll over pretty meekly  the way Andre did in the 2002 USO final?

Hey by the way, I just noticed this bit! Are you kidding? :lolz: :laydownlaughing

I was at that match and that ain't what happened... :nono

I watched it too and I never felt Andre was a real threat to win that match. I don't think Andre felt he could beat Pete at the USO. As in the 1995 US Open final, certainly Andre did not bring to that 2002 final match the kind of tennis he'd been playing. And Pete was simply better than Andre on faster surfaces [grass, USO, carpet] anyway, while Andre was better on the slower surfaces [clay, AO Rebound Ace].

Cheers
TM

Hardly means he rolled over meekly, brother. He almost took it to five...

 

[Tennis Miller]

Can't see this as Roger's Swan Song unless he has been in lying in every presser for the last year, including those in the last couple of days.

Oh, I didn't mean in terms of swan song and quick retirement. I was just talking about the stars aligning for one possible last GS title...

Cheers
TM

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Can't see this as Roger's Swan Song unless he has been in lying in every presser for the last year, including those in the last couple of days.

No way that Roger is retiring after this, independent of the result.

 

[Tennis Miller]

Will Nole roll over pretty meekly  the way Andre did in the 2002 USO final?

Hey by the way, I just noticed this bit! Are you kidding? :lolz: :laydownlaughing

I was at that match and that ain't what happened... :nono

I watched it too and I never felt Andre was a real threat to win that match. I don't think Andre felt he could beat Pete at the USO. As in the 1995 US Open final, certainly Andre did not bring to that 2002 final match the kind of tennis he'd been playing. And Pete was simply better than Andre on faster surfaces [grass, USO, carpet] anyway, while Andre was better on the slower surfaces [clay, AO Rebound Ace].

Cheers
TM

Hardly means he rolled over meekly, brother. He almost took it to five...

Yeah, "meekly" is too strong. But my recollection was Pete winning the first two sets handily, and then after a third set letdown by Pete, Andre just blew a boatload of break points in the 4th. Then Pete broke on some Andre UFEs and it was all over. I think what Grigor did today, with 4 set points in the 4th, was almost take it to 5 sets. I don't think Andre came close to making this a 5 setter, but I take your point. ("Objection sustained")

Cheers
TM

 

[Front242]

Also, with Del Potro out, Murray having not beaten a top 10 opponent in a year, Djokovic dodgy in slam finals and Nadal an unknown quantity on hard courts this year, who the hell could class this as Federer's last chance at a slam?! None of the top guys are exactly in amazing form by any means.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Also, with Del Potro out, Murray having not beaten a top 10 opponent in a year, Djokovic dodgy in slam finals and Nadal an unknown quantity on hard courts this year, who the hell could class this as Federer's last chance at a slam?! None of the top guys are exactly in amazing form by any means.

Yes, Fed is due for another twins now.

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

The thing is, Roger will not retire. If he loses, he will think he is still in the mix and he just has to get over the hump. If he wins, he 'll say, why retire when you can still win?

 

[nehmeth]

Can't see this as Roger's Swan Song unless he has been in lying in every presser for the last year, including those in the last couple of days.

Pete was floundering for 2 years without doing much at all. Roger is still in the thick of things and for him to just bow out at 18? That's not what he's been saying when they ask him about retirement.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Fed isnt going anywhere soon.. pretty soon if you google "what can survive the Apocalypse", it will be the cockroach and the tennis game of Roger Federer.

I think Rafa's game has been architected to beat Roger's game but Roger's game has been built to outlast this current generation of ATP pros. Yes there seems to be a decline in Roger's game at times over the past 3 to 4 years but not really. Just as he did in 2012, Roger is most likely win Wimbledon again this year or there after. I understand why his fans admire his game because its really special to watch and it looks so effortless on his part. Most Rafa fans really like Roger but really felt a change was needed because the game of tennis had become predictable during the time of (2003-2007). If you think about it, there were maybe 2 or 3 great matches during that time (for me I can only think of AO 2005 ( Safin def. Federer: 5-7, 6-4, 5-7, 7-6 (8-6), 9-7). The past 7-8 years has produced the rise of Nadal, Djoker and Murray. Their baselines games combined with Roger's has made this current game of tennis the BEST ever by Far.

Fed winning #18 is not good for the current game because it really means that his record of (men)GS titles will Never get tied or broken in our lifetime. It means that Murray has no chance at the age of 27 and Djoker will have to go Federer type of run for about the next 5 years to even get considered which is highly unlikey. Four or five years ago it was safe to say that Nadal was the 2nd best grasscourt player on the ATP tour but now Rafa's grass court game is in such a huge decline, that it may take Divine Intervention for him to even make the Wimbledon semi yet alone the finals. That means to catch or tie Fed, Rafa would have to win aleast 2 more US opens , another title chase at the AO which again is gonna take Divine Intervention because he has gotten injured atleast 4-5 times at that tournament and a few more RG titles which is obviously his best chance. Records are made to be broken, that is the fun of Sport but when titles are beyond belief or human effort, there is no thrill or real challenge in the game(sport).

 

[Fiero425]

Will Nole roll over pretty meekly  the way Andre did in the 2002 USO final?

Hey by the way, I just noticed this bit! Are you kidding? :lolz: :laydownlaughing

I was at that match and that ain't what happened... :nono

I watched it too and I never felt Andre was a real threat to win that match. I don't think Andre felt he could beat Pete at the USO. As in the 1995 US Open final, certainly Andre did not bring to that 2002 final match the kind of tennis he'd been playing. And Pete was simply better than Andre on faster surfaces [grass, USO, carpet] anyway, while Andre was better on the slower surfaces [clay, AO Rebound Ace].

Cheers
TM

Hardly means he rolled over meekly, brother. He almost took it to five...

Yeah, "meekly" is too strong. But my recollection was Pete winning the first two sets handily, and then after a third set letdown by Pete, Andre just blew a boatload of break points in the 4th. Then Pete broke on some Andre UFEs and it was all over. I think what Grigor did today, with 4 set points in the 4th, was almost take it to 5 sets. I don't think Andre came close to making this a 5 setter, but I take your point. ("Objection sustained")

Cheers
TM

Andre may have done his best, but he always was Sampras' pigeon in big matches; esp. at the USO and Wimbledon! Andre got him at the FO and AO when Pete was distraught over Gullikson's collapse and subsequent diagnosis of a brain tumor!

 

[nehmeth]

Fed isnt going anywhere soon.. pretty soon if you google "what can survive the Apocalypse", it will be the cockroach and the tennis game of Roger Federer.

I think Rafa's game has been architected to beat Roger's game but Roger's game has been built to outlast this current generation of ATP pros. Yes there seems to be a decline in Roger's game at times over the past 3 to 4 years but not really. Just as he did in 2012, Roger is most likely win Wimbledon again this year or there after. I understand why his fans admire his game because its really special to watch and it looks so effortless on his part. Most Rafa fans really like Roger but really felt a change was needed because the game of tennis had become predictable during the time of (2003-2007). If you think about it, there were maybe 2 or 3 great matches during that time (for me I can only think of AO 2005 ( Safin def. Federer: 5-7, 6-4, 5-7, 7-6 (8-6), 9-7). The past 7-8 years has produced the rise of Nadal, Djoker and Murray. Their baselines games combined with Roger's has made this current game of tennis the BEST ever by Far.

Fed winning #18 is not good for the current game because it really means that his record of (men)GS titles will Never get tied or broken in our lifetime. It means that Murray has no chance at the age of 27 and Djoker will have to go Federer type of run for about the next 5 years to even get considered which is highly unlikey. Four or five years ago it was safe to say that Nadal was the 2nd best grasscourt player on the ATP tour but now Rafa's grass court game is in such a huge decline, that it may take Divine Intervention for him to even make the Wimbledon semi yet alone the finals. That means to catch or tie Fed, Rafa would have to win aleast 2 more US opens , another title chase at the AO which again is gonna take Divine Intervention because he has gotten injured atleast 4-5 times at that tournament and a few more RG titles which is obviously his best chance. Records are made to be broken, that is the fun of Sport but when titles are beyond belief or human effort, there is no thrill or real challenge in the game(sport).

Obviously, Roger has lost some of the speed - from lightening fast to faster than most of the rest of the tour. His forehand lets him down in ways it never did during his prime. And when things get to a fifth set lately, his chances of winning take a marked drop.

Roger has had things line up for him before, the 2009 French and Wimbledon titles, 2012 Wimbledon and almost again in 2014. Had Dimitrov had found a way into the finals, who knows.

Maybe Novak goes on a run after this win. Maybe a renewed Roger plays an abbreviated summer hard court schedule and comes into NYC fresh and ready to win his 18th. Maybe Rafa stays stuck at 14 until the French next year. Roger winning 18 wouldn't be bad for the sport, just bad for the guys chasing his record. :snigger

A 2002 type finish for Roger would be beating Rafa at the U.S. Open. I don't know that we will ever see it, but stranger things have happened.

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

Obviously, Roger has lost some of the speed - from lightening fast to faster than most of the rest of the tour. His forehand lets him down in ways it never did during his prime. And when things get to a fifth set lately, his chances of winning take a marked drop.

Roger has had things line up for him before, the 2009 French and Wimbledon titles, 2012 Wimbledon and almost again in 2014. Had Dimitrov had found a way into the finals, who knows.

Maybe Novak goes on a run after this win. Maybe a renewed Roger plays an abbreviated summer hard court schedule and comes into NYC fresh and ready to win his 18th. Maybe Rafa stays stuck at 14 until the French next year. Roger winning 18 wouldn't be bad for the sport, just bad for the guys chasing his record. :snigger

A 2002 type finish for Roger would be beating Rafa at the U.S. Open. I don't know that we will ever see it, but stranger things have happened.

It is all good but I am never buying the "things lining up" argument. I mean look, is anybody saying "things really lined up for Novak this year at Wimby...he did not have to face the defending champ in Murray, he avoided Rafa, who beats him more than he beats Rafa, and he faced a way past his prime Roger in the final."? . I have not heard that once, and for good reason. You play the draw. That's it. If certain players were not good enough to go deep in a tournament, you cannot hold it against a player who was...

 

[GameSetAndMath]

Obviously, Roger has lost some of the speed - from lightening fast to faster than most of the rest of the tour. His forehand lets him down in ways it never did during his prime. And when things get to a fifth set lately, his chances of winning take a marked drop.

Roger has had things line up for him before, the 2009 French and Wimbledon titles, 2012 Wimbledon and almost again in 2014. Had Dimitrov had found a way into the finals, who knows.

Maybe Novak goes on a run after this win. Maybe a renewed Roger plays an abbreviated summer hard court schedule and comes into NYC fresh and ready to win his 18th. Maybe Rafa stays stuck at 14 until the French next year. Roger winning 18 wouldn't be bad for the sport, just bad for the guys chasing his record. :snigger

A 2002 type finish for Roger would be beating Rafa at the U.S. Open. I don't know that we will ever see it, but stranger things have happened.

It is all good but I am never buying the "things lining up" argument. I mean look, is anybody saying "things really lined up for Novak this year at Wimby...he did not have to face the defending champ in Murray, he avoided Rafa, who beats him more than he beats Rafa, and he faced a way past his prime Roger in the final."? . I have not heard that once, and for good reason. You play the draw. That's it. If certain players are not good enough to go deep in a tournament, you cannot hold it against a player who was...

Let me add that the only top 10 player faced by Novak in this tournament is way past prime Fed.
If the draw holds up, one is expected play a minimum of three top 10 players. The draw does
not always hold up and hence I would not take anything away form Novak's win.
However, people use this "stars aligning", "things lining up" etc only when they want to detract.