Why has the tour regressed in the last 10 years?

[El Dude]

Don't forget that Andy is the exact same age as Djokovic - people often talk about him as if he's younger and taking the reins. Chances are he doesn't last much longer than Novak.

We've all discussed this before, but I expect another 2-3 years of dominance by the Big Three (2014-16), with Rafa fading first, and then a more wide-open field as the current 20-25 group starts winning a Slam here and there, and then sometime in 2018 or so we'll see the emergence of a new dominant player or two. I hope it is sooner, but I don't think so. That's five years, so if that player shows up at age 20-22 or so, he'd be 15-17 right now. Gianluigi Quinzi!

 

[Kieran]

Don't forget that Andy is the exact same age as Djokovic - people often talk about him as if he's younger and taking the reins. Chances are he doesn't last much longer than Novak.

That's true! And incredibly, Rafa is only a year older than both of them. To the lazy eye, he must be five years older! He has more miles on the clock, to be sure, but he's achieved so much more, also...

 

[Fiero425]

Don't forget that Andy is the exact same age as Djokovic - people often talk about him as if he's younger and taking the reins. Chances are he doesn't last much longer than Novak.

That's true! And incredibly, Rafa is only a year older than both of them. To the lazy eye, he must be five years older! He has more miles on the clock, to be sure, but he's achieved so much more, also...

But at what cost? Like you said, the miles are definitely showing, but I think it's going to be worse for him! I think of Michael Chang who grinded out wins over people for years! I think I have a faint recollection of hip replacements, if not more going on! Tennis shouldn't be like football where guys fall apart after retiring! We're supposed to be better off than that, but you hear stuff like this more; esp. with the women! Players like Martina and Roger played with a fluidity and grace that doesn't seem to debilitate them like others and they're playing longer than the rest of the crowd!

 

[DarthFed]

Don't forget that Andy is the exact same age as Djokovic - people often talk about him as if he's younger and taking the reins. Chances are he doesn't last much longer than Novak.

That's true! And incredibly, Rafa is only a year older than both of them. To the lazy eye, he must be five years older! He has more miles on the clock, to be sure, but he's achieved so much more, also...

Novak only has a couple years less wear and tear than Rafa actually and Rafa has a few years less than Roger. Novak was near the top since 07, Rafa since 05 and Roger since 02.

 

[El Dude]

For the sake of discussion:

Career matches
Federer: 1117 in 16 years, or 70/year
Nadal: 756 in 12 years, or 63/year
Djokovic: 641 in 10 years, or 64/year
Murray: 543 in 9 years, or 60/year

Nadal's numbers would be higher if he hadn't missed so much time - he'd certainly be above 800, but still wouldn't have the matches per year that Federer has.

 

[Fiero425]

For the sake of discussion:

Career matches
Federer: 1117 in 16 years, or 70/year
Nadal: 756 in 12 years, or 63/year
Djokovic: 641 in 10 years, or 64/year
Murray: 543 in 9 years, or 60/year

Nadal's numbers would be higher if he hadn't missed so much time - he'd certainly be above 800, but still wouldn't have the matches per year that Federer has.

The only "IF" I use on a regular basis is "if Monica Seles hadn't been stabbed...!" The rest is totally under the player's control; even injury! As I've been saying, Nadal puts those miles on himself through defensive play that could be overcome with a more offensive mindset! Even Borg pushed himself to attack the net more as he matured; hense his winning 5 straight Wimbledons! Nole is pushing himself more and we see the results as of 2011! I'm so proud of him even though I don't particularly care for that type of play; but he makes it entertaining and fun on occasion! I'm watching him destroy Ferrer at this year's AO and it's great to see; and funny(the pinpoint dropshots are killers)! :laydownlaughing :clap Last night I brought out Martina in '83 & '84 USO finals vs Evert and '87 over Graf! The contrast in style makes it "must see tv" for me just to keep me interested sometimes!

 

[calitennis127]

The skill deficiency I just witnessed from Dimitrov in the third set is further evidence of what I have been talking about on this thread.

It is clear to me that Dimitrov has been brainwashed into the silly notion that the game is so "physical" now and that to win at the highest level you have to be a musclehead, ready to go to battle for 6 hours if need be, to track down every ball like it's your last and then wolf down some protein bars along with engaging in an intense reading of Men's Health magazine. This, of course, is mostly a bunch of nonsense.

Dimitrov's total inability to use his forehand for offensive purposes was indeed pathetic. He did not hit flat and did not hit through the court with the forehand, despite the clear advantage that doing so would provide him. Instead, he was stuck in the mindset of trying to "outwork" Nadal by prolonging the points with defense. As a result, he was constantly on his back foot and a step behind in the rallies. This is why on one point in the third set he even did 6 consecutive backhand slices. Needless to say, he lost the point.

Who is training and advising these young players? I really want to know. The poor fundamentals of Raonic and Dimitrov really make you wonder.

 

[Luxilon Borg]

Today, more than ever, I missed the 2003-2008 era, when you legitimately had 10-20 players who could all play some serious, elite tennis from the baseline.

The young crop, aside from Janowicz, is so bad that I really don't see why Djokovic, Nadal, and Murray can't dominate for another 6 to 8 years. I am dead serious about that.

What is going to stop that from happening, aside from injuries? The talent differential is so big aside from Janowicz that it seems improbable that the current regime will be dethroned anytime soon.

I would have thought that the Federer-Nadal rivalry in its heyday of 2006-2008 would have inspired the younger generation to be great. Maybe it is too soon to judge the rivalry's effects, but it appears that the players who were teenagers when Federer and Nadal were dooking it out simply did not have even one-tenth of the talent to produce the level of tennis we saw from the Top 20 2003 to 2008. What we are seeing from this younger generation is really pathetic.

People often talk about history as if it is just a constant progression with things getting better and better. The reality is that there are stretches of progress AND regress. The men's game seems to me to have really taken a couple steps back in the past 5 years. As much as I respect and like Ferrer's game and mentality, the fact that he has had his peak results at ages 29-31 (after having been as serious about tennis earlier in his career; Ferrer was no slacker) means that he out-lasted a generation he couldn't beat.

The current crop of young players is inferior and the pro game has regressed. Today's match was proof positive of that. There is no way any Top 10 players in, say, 2006 - Ivan Ljubicic included - would have looked as sad as Raonic did today.

I am not sure I agree completely...but you have a point.

The BIG 4 are SO good, you it mind boggling.

The fact is Raonic is a terrible example. He has one huge weapon, the serve, a second decent weapon, the forehand, but glaring weakness like the back hand and the movement.

A game like Dimitrov takes time to mature. He has a complete game with a few minor issues.

Paire is pathetic mentally and his forehand is a joke.

The young Americans are hopeless. Hard courters who play mindless tennis...Sock, Kudla, Johnson...although Johnson has very good potential. Querry is braindead. So is Tomic.

But Jerzey Boy is no brain surgeon either. He thinks he is Pete Sampras with the double faults and the Eastern forehand grip, but without the height, he is at best a futures player.

Dogpolov is a moron.

But....Dimitrov, as mentioned, Goffin, Delbonis, Klizan, Gulbis, and Pospisil have real potential.

I also believe the "middle tier", like Tsonga, Del Po, Berdych, Wawrinka, Verdasco..etc would lay some heavy beatdowns on the 90s slam winners.

 

[El Dude]

Entertaining post, Luxilon Borg - keep them coming.

 

[brokenshoelace]

I also believe the "middle tier", like Tsonga, Del Po, Berdych, Wawrinka, Verdasco..etc would lay some heavy beatdowns on the 90s slam winners.

Since when did Verdasco lay heavy beatdowns on anyone?

 

[Kieran]

I think there's a serious overrating of the modern tour going on, when the chump change is being weighed as gold...

 

[Luxilon Borg]

I also believe the "middle tier", like Tsonga, Del Po, Berdych, Wawrinka, Verdasco..etc would lay some heavy beatdowns on the 90s slam winners.

Since when did Verdasco lay heavy beatdowns on anyone?

Who was up 2 sets to love and a break on the current Wimby champion in the quarters?

 

[Luxilon Borg]

Entertaining post, Luxilon Borg - keep them coming.

Will try...

 

[brokenshoelace]

I also believe the "middle tier", like Tsonga, Del Po, Berdych, Wawrinka, Verdasco..etc would lay some heavy beatdowns on the 90s slam winners.

Since when did Verdasco lay heavy beatdowns on anyone?

Who was up 2 sets to love and a break on the current Wimby champion in the quarters?

...and proceeded to lose? Verdasco.

 

[Fiero425]

I also believe the "middle tier", like Tsonga, Del Po, Berdych, Wawrinka, Verdasco..etc would lay some heavy beatdowns on the 90s slam winners.

Since when did Verdasco lay heavy beatdowns on anyone?

Who was up 2 sets to love and a break on the current Wimby champion in the quarters?

...and proceeded to lose? Verdasco.

All those guys on the 2nd tier from Spain don't know how to finish! No matter the lead and how many match points, they find a way to give it all back; Verdasco, Lopez, Amalgro, and others! It's so sad to see again and again!