Most disappointing player of the last ... 15 years?

GameSetAndMath

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I think we should give exemption to players like DelPo and Soderling who were sidelined due to injuries and so could not deliver.
It has to be decided based on expectation and achievements. If you have no expectation for a player (say for example like Donald Young),
you cannot call him a disappointment. Similarly, if a player has reasonable achievements (say for example like Stan Wawrinka), you cannot
call him a disappointment either. So, the players who fit the bill are those who appeared to be promising at the beginning and then disappointed us by not delivering. Hence, my choices (one for each generation) are below.

The truly most disappointing player are as follows

1. Fed's Generation: Richard Gasquet. This guy was on the cover of sports magazines in France when he was just 15 or so.
He was the original baby Fed. In the end his results turned out to be worse that of even Berdych and
Tsonga. He did not have much injuries to be condoned either.

2. Lost Gen: Surely, it is Grigor Dimitrov. Sure, he won WTF finals and a Masters and so is better results wise in comparison
' to other members of Lost Gen. However, lot more was expected of him due to his variety and style
of play. Also, he is not injured that much to give him a pass.

3. Next Gen: Nick Kyrgios. He beat #1 Ralph in 4th round at his debut in Wimbledon in 2014. It has been almost
five years since then and he has done nothing of note. He reached QF on only one other occasion
in slams and has never won a Masters either. He has never entered top 10 also.
 

Moxie

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I think we should give exemption to players like DelPo and Soderling who were sidelined due to injuries and so could not deliver.
It has to be decided based on expectation and achievements. If you have no expectation for a player (say for example like Donald Young),
you cannot call him a disappointment. Similarly, if a player has reasonable achievements (say for example like Stan Wawrinka), you cannot
call him a disappointment either. So, the players who fit the bill are those who appeared to be promising at the beginning and then disappointed us by not delivering. Hence, my choices (one for each generation) are below.

The truly most disappointing player are as follows

1. Fed's Generation: Richard Gasquet. This guy was on the cover of sports magazines in France when he was just 15 or so.
He was the original baby Fed. In the end his results turned out to be worse that of even Berdych and
Tsonga. He did not have much injuries to be condoned either.

2. Lost Gen: Surely, it is Grigor Dimitrov. Sure, he won WTF finals and a Masters and so is better results wise in comparison
' to other members of Lost Gen. However, lot more was expected of him due to his variety and style
of play. Also, he is not injured that much to give him a pass.

3. Next Gen: Nick Kyrgios. He beat #1 Ralph in 4th round at his debut in Wimbledon in 2014. It has been almost
five years since then and he has done nothing of note. He reached QF on only one other occasion
in slams and has never won a Masters either. He has never entered top 10 also.
While I think everyone has a right to decide their own criteria, I'm rather with you on this. I think we're all disappointed FOR del Potro, and lots also for Soderling, because of their misfortunes in health, it's different to being disappointed IN them. Doesn't mean others can't choose "disappointed for," though. That said, I think those are 3 good candidates. I had also thought of adding Nick. And I think everything has already been said about Nalbandian. He's well-installed in the under-achiever Hall of Fame. Of all, I do think that Dimitrov is the top disappointment of the last 10 years, anyway. The depth and breadth of his falling short of expectations is fairly breath-taking. He's been so long-touted, and so all-but been lacking in any results. I didn't even like the guy, and yet I found myself thinking, in several years, "This is the one where he comes good." But no. I also agree with those who name Tsonga as a pretty big disappointment.
 
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tenisplayrla08

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No contest... Nalbandian

Yeah. I do feel like if you go back that far, it's Nalbandian. Even more than Safin. Nalbandian probably ran into the big 3 a bit because of Rafa's early start and Fed's dominance. And good on Fed for turning their rivalry around. But you'd think Nalbandian would have challenged a bit more. Like, losing to Roddick in that 2003 US Open semi was something else. I'm glad he got the one he got. But if everything else had turned out like it did, Roddick should never have won a slam. Because Nalbandian had NO business losing that match. But good on Roddick.
 

tenisplayrla08

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While I think everyone has a right to decide their own criteria, I'm rather with you on this. I think we're all disappointed FOR del Potro, and lots also for Soderling, because of their misfortunes in health, it's different to being disappointed IN them. Doesn't mean others can't choose "disappointed for," though. That said, I think those are 3 good candidates. I had also thought of adding Nick. And I think everything has already been said about Nalbandian. He's well-installed in the under-achiever Hall of Fame. Of all, I do think that Dimitrov is the top disappointment of the last 10 years, anyway. The depth and breadth of his falling short of expectations is fairly breath-taking. He's been so long-touted, and so all-but been lacking in any results. I didn't even like the guy, and yet I found myself thinking, in several years, "This is the one where he comes good." But no. I also agree with those who name Tsonga as a pretty big disappointment.

I mean, I think a number of us have already said that obviously DelPo and Soderling (and Nishikori for me) get passes. It's not really fair or unfair the way their careers worked out. It just is. Not much that could have prevented it.

I do think Kyrgios has under performed so far (responding to you and the post you quoted here). But, again, it's not exactly like he was gonna dominate. Not with Djokovic around. But. He has shown flashes, even as recently as 2017, where he nearly beat Fed in IW or Miami, which ever it was. And I think honestly most of this still has to come down to that. Like. Djokovic was having none of it. He reached a level I simply don't think we've seen. It wasn't for lack of trying on Dimitrov and all the other player's part. They may in fact be good enough still to get some slams. I mean, I'm sitting here going, well since everyone has mentioned Dimitrov while he's the guy of the moment to pick on because of his early AO loss, watch him waltz out and win Wimbledon. I don't actually think that's likely if Djokovic or Fed are in his way. But it's not completely impossible. It'd be funny after all this discussion though. Seems like everyone has written him off. And, again, I agree he's been disappointing. But I will say, we've just watched Federer play at the top of his game well into his mid and late 30s. All of these guys know that they have longer now. They're all well aware of the 30 plus leaning way of the top 10 and 20. So they aren't going away. They may still find a crack on occasion in Djokovic or Nadal or Fed (definitely Fed it seems).
 

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Yeah. I do feel like if you go back that far, it's Nalbandian. Even more than Safin. Nalbandian probably ran into the big 3 a bit because of Rafa's early start and Fed's dominance. And good on Fed for turning their rivalry around. But you'd think Nalbandian would have challenged a bit more. Like, losing to Roddick in that 2003 US Open semi was something else. I'm glad he got the one he got. But if everything else had turned out like it did, Roddick should never have won a slam. Because Nalbandian had NO business losing that match. But good on Roddick.
I have to say, I dislike the phrase that anyone had "no business" losing a match. It gets used around here by the "alternate universe" people a lot. I have no love for Roddick or his game, but he won that match. There is a reason that people pick Nalbandian at the top of the pile for recent disappointments...he barely ever reached potential. But he's one in a long list of proof that raw "talent" isn't everything.
 

Moxie

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I mean, I think a number of us have already said that obviously DelPo and Soderling (and Nishikori for me) get passes. It's not really fair or unfair the way their careers worked out. It just is. Not much that could have prevented it.

I do think Kyrgios has under performed so far (responding to you and the post you quoted here). But, again, it's not exactly like he was gonna dominate. Not with Djokovic around. But. He has shown flashes, even as recently as 2017, where he nearly beat Fed in IW or Miami, which ever it was. And I think honestly most of this still has to come down to that. Like. Djokovic was having none of it. He reached a level I simply don't think we've seen. It wasn't for lack of trying on Dimitrov and all the other player's part. They may in fact be good enough still to get some slams. I mean, I'm sitting here going, well since everyone has mentioned Dimitrov while he's the guy of the moment to pick on because of his early AO loss, watch him waltz out and win Wimbledon. I don't actually think that's likely if Djokovic or Fed are in his way. But it's not completely impossible. It'd be funny after all this discussion though. Seems like everyone has written him off. And, again, I agree he's been disappointing. But I will say, we've just watched Federer play at the top of his game well into his mid and late 30s. All of these guys know that they have longer now. They're all well aware of the 30 plus leaning way of the top 10 and 20. So they aren't going away. They may still find a crack on occasion in Djokovic or Nadal or Fed (definitely Fed it seems).
I still think it's early to write Kyrgios off. It was GSM who mentioned him. I just said I have him in my mind, as disappointing "to date." (I think the Fed match you're mentioning was IW, btw.) Obviously, with Djokovic, and Fedal, tbh, around, it's hard for these younger players to get a foothold.

However, you say, "it wasn't for lack of trying on Dimitrov and all the other players' part." I disagree, at least on the part of Dimitrov. He has a lot of talent, and he's had coaches that have tried to take him in hand. I don't disagree that facing the Big 3 has made mincemeat of the rest of the field, but I think Dimitrov is particularly lame. He showed early chops to join in the conversation. Del Potro fell out. And yet, he kept showing himself incapable of making the leap. It's not just his game, it's his head and his commitment. I'm sorry, but when the Big 3 fall out, I think that the likes of Zverev, Tsitsipas, Shapo and even probably Kyrgios will jump over Dimitrov. He's the same kind of shirker as Nalbandian. Maybe we'll all be surprised when he wins a Major someday. Myself, I would be shocked.
 

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I have to say, I dislike the phrase that anyone had "no business" losing a match. It gets used around here by the "alternate universe" people a lot. I have no love for Roddick or his game, but he won that match. There is a reason that people pick Nalbandian at the top of the pile for recent disappointments...he barely ever reached potential. But he's one in a long list of proof that raw "talent" isn't everything.

Yeah. I try not to be an alternate universe person. And I, a young American at the time of Roddick's win, was thrilled he won. The "no business" is just because I'm pretty sure he had match point. But like I said, good on Roddick for hanging in there.
 

tenisplayrla08

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I still think it's early to write Kyrgios off. It was GSM who mentioned him. I just said I have him in my mind, as disappointing "to date." (I think the Fed match you're mentioning was IW, btw.) Obviously, with Djokovic, and Fedal, tbh, around, it's hard for these younger players to get a foothold.

However, you say, "it wasn't for lack of trying on Dimitrov and all the other players' part." I disagree, at least on the part of Dimitrov. He has a lot of talent, and he's had coaches that have tried to take him in hand. I don't disagree that facing the Big 3 has made mincemeat of the rest of the field, but I think Dimitrov is particularly lame. He showed early chops to join in the conversation. Del Potro fell out. And yet, he kept showing himself incapable of making the leap. It's not just his game, it's his head and his commitment. I'm sorry, but when the Big 3 fall out, I think that the likes of Zverev, Tsitsipas, Shapo and even probably Kyrgios will jump over Dimitrov. He's the same kind of shirker as Nalbandian. Maybe we'll all be surprised when he wins a Major someday. Myself, I would be shocked.

I won't be shocked if Dimitrov ever wins one. Just because I think he's got the game to come through. But I fully agree his head isn't where we'd like it to be for his talent. But it is the way it is. And that's the way it's always been. But I disagree he's a shirker the likes of Nalbandian. Nalbandian was just straight up lazy. He liked the good life that tennis brought him. He was consistently overweight. I'm not sure the guy ever had a 6 pack in his life. He WAS completely relying on his talent. Dimitrov has shown some serious dedication over the years and put in the hard training work. And he got a touch of reward for it in 2017. We'll see if Agassi can help him find something. Anything. More confidence or control or joy in the game or another level. Something he needs. But, again, I can't honestly say I care. I'm not really on the Dimitrov bandwagon. Though it seems few are these days.

He'll just be cracking 30 in 3 years when Djokovic will be 35 and most likely no longer the number one player in the world. He could be the next Wawrinka. Or Ivanisevic. But the ship has obviously already sailed that he'll ever be "the guy." It'd be unprecedented at this point if he became dominant for even a year or two.
 

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I mean, I think a number of us have already said that obviously DelPo and Soderling (and Nishikori for me) get passes. It's not really fair or unfair the way their careers worked out. It just is. Not much that could have prevented it.

I do think Kyrgios has under performed so far (responding to you and the post you quoted here). But, again, it's not exactly like he was gonna dominate. Not with Djokovic around. But. He has shown flashes, even as recently as 2017, where he nearly beat Fed in IW or Miami, which ever it was. And I think honestly most of this still has to come down to that. Like. Djokovic was having none of it. He reached a level I simply don't think we've seen. It wasn't for lack of trying on Dimitrov and all the other player's part. They may in fact be good enough still to get some slams. I mean, I'm sitting here going, well since everyone has mentioned Dimitrov while he's the guy of the moment to pick on because of his early AO loss, watch him waltz out and win Wimbledon. I don't actually think that's likely if Djokovic or Fed are in his way. But it's not completely impossible. It'd be funny after all this discussion though. Seems like everyone has written him off. And, again, I agree he's been disappointing. But I will say, we've just watched Federer play at the top of his game well into his mid and late 30s. All of these guys know that they have longer now. They're all well aware of the 30 plus leaning way of the top 10 and 20. So they aren't going away. They may still find a crack on occasion in Djokovic or Nadal or Fed (definitely Fed it seems).
Djoker played what level we haven’t seen? Get over hyping it up, he has played better years ago yet certain offensive players still beat him, when they were on.
 
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Ricardo

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Yeah. I do feel like if you go back that far, it's Nalbandian. Even more than Safin. Nalbandian probably ran into the big 3 a bit because of Rafa's early start and Fed's dominance. And good on Fed for turning their rivalry around. But you'd think Nalbandian would have challenged a bit more. Like, losing to Roddick in that 2003 US Open semi was something else. I'm glad he got the one he got. But if everything else had turned out like it did, Roddick should never have won a slam. Because Nalbandian had NO business losing that match. But good on Roddick.
Roddick should never won a slam? I ain’t no lover of his game and don’t anyone is, but you talk bs.
 
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damn it Ricardo, I'm finding it hard to disagree with a lot of what you're saying right now bro :yes::D
 

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Roddick should never won a slam? I ain’t no lover of his game and don’t anyone is, but you talk bs.

I think this is just a misunderstanding.
Because again. I was a huge Roddick fan. I wanted him to win more slams. And he tried as much as he could. He got just about every last drop out of his career that he could with the Big 3 around. And until Djokovic and Murray finally reached their best level, he was easily the second best grass player on the planet (and that includes Nadal in my book). The only reason he never got a Wimbledon is because his prime was during Fed's prime. But all I was saying is Nalbandian had match point in that semifinal at the 2003 US Open against Roddick. And it's not often that a player wins a slam having been down match point down in any of their matches. I mean, it happens, but it's rare. My statement was intended to dig at Nalbandian who let matches like that one slip away and let his entire career slip away. Also, I said that if "everything else worked out the way it did" meaning, if he still went to every other slam final he did and lost, if he had lost that match point in 2003, he'd have never won a slam. So I said he should have never won a slam, in that context. I was just trying to keep it as close to history as possible. Because in reality, obviously if he doesn't win that match, everything changes and maybe he has a completely different career.
 
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tenisplayrla08

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Djoker played what level we haven’t seen? Get over hyping it up, he has played better years ago yet certain offensive players still beat him, when they were on.

You have a way of singling out comments that weren't really part of the main point. This post is about Kyrgios. My Djokovic comment was meant to show that Kyrgios' supposed under performance is not, in my opinion, as bad as people like to think. One reason for that is because Djokovic wouldn't have let him win anyways. Because he was at a ridiculous level. I understand that you're trying to say I'm over hyping the level he reached. And he did get beaten. In say, 2014 at 3 of the slams. Wawrinka, Rafa and Nishikori at the US Open. But then he won 5 of 6 slams. Making the final of all 6. So I guess I think it's kinda hard to say I'm over hyping his level. I did use the term "a level we haven't seen." And I guess I just got that from a bunch of different commentators at the time. Who were all blown away by his level of play which was basically him being a wall and never missing and tracking everything down. We saw some incredibly high levels from Rafa and Fed and other players in previous eras. But, while it doesn't make me happy to say this, I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone play as well as Djokovic did during that year and a half.

But we can agree to disagree.
 

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You have a way of singling out comments that weren't really part of the main point. This post is about Kyrgios. My Djokovic comment was meant to show that Kyrgios' supposed under performance is not, in my opinion, as bad as people like to think. One reason for that is because Djokovic wouldn't have let him win anyways. Because he was at a ridiculous level. I understand that you're trying to say I'm over hyping the level he reached. And he did get beaten. In say, 2014 at 3 of the slams. Wawrinka, Rafa and Nishikori at the US Open. But then he won 5 of 6 slams. Making the final of all 6. So I guess I think it's kinda hard to say I'm over hyping his level. I did use the term "a level we haven't seen." And I guess I just got that from a bunch of different commentators at the time. Who were all blown away by his level of play which was basically him being a wall and never missing and tracking everything down. We saw some incredibly high levels from Rafa and Fed and other players in previous eras. But, while it doesn't make me happy to say this, I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone play as well as Djokovic did during that year and a half.

But we can agree to disagree.

Cool topic. Mate, didn't McEnroe in 1984 and Pete Sampras in 1993 both have stellar seasons or just as dominant? Also and its before my time, Jimmy Connors (1974).
 

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Do you have a women's version on this topic? I have not been able to find one.
 

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Do you have a women's version on this topic? I have not been able to find one.

No. For the reason that I mentioned in the first post. I've thought at least 15 different women were going to be "great" over the last 10 years or even 15. But. I've come to realize that they are all just really close! A few are more consistently good and have a game that can weather the storm a bit better. So they rise to the top and keep the higher rankings for a while. But on any given day literally any player on the women's tour can beat one of the top ladies. With Serena being like the only exception and she's still not completely invulnerable. But she wouldn't be part of this discussion obviously because she has in no way been a disappointment. So it's just a tough conversation.

But you're welcome to start it if you want to. I'm sure there are still ones that stick out.
 

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Cool topic. Mate, didn't McEnroe in 1984 and Pete Sampras in 1993 both have stellar seasons or just as dominant? Also and its before my time, Jimmy Connors (1974).

So I wasn't around for any of those. I'm too young for that. I was alive for Sampras. But I was too young to see him in 1993. Anyways. I know their records somewhat well and can look them up. And yeah, all three of those were incredibly dominant. Probably the most dominant was actually Connors. If the French hadn't banned him for his WTT play, he would have had to deal with Borg, but that was Borg's first. So he was hardly at his dominant best yet. I think it's likely Connors would have been the next guy, just 5 years after Laver, to win the calendar year slam. But alas, it worked out the way it did. But I'd put Djokovic above Sampras because Sampras never really had a shot on the clay. And his game was still always more offensive. Djokovic plays a ton of offense, especially against lesser players. But against the best so much of his game is about taking their biggest weapons and neutralizing them. Which he did better than perhaps anyone we've ever seen. He's the closest descendant of Agassi one can find probably. He's just taller, has a better serve, and a much better mover than Agassi. And so he's been better. Also, he doesn't have the demons Agassi apparently had.

As for McEnroe. I'm gonna be honest. He's my weak spot in the history of the game. Well, one of many. But while I can tell you that I've repeatedly heard that's he's probably the most talented man to ever pick up a racket, I mean, I just haven't seen him play really. I've seen the Wimbledon tiebreaker from 1980 several times. Seen a couple other matches here and there. But Idk. I guess just because he gets over shadowed by Borg and I don't care for how much he berated umps. But his doubles success is probably, to me, what sets him apart. While so few singles greats on the men's side have cared about doubles, he gave it his time and effort and won more slams in doubles than in singles. He's brilliant. Which, while he often annoys me as a commentator, he still always impresses me with his thoughts about what he's watching. He's that brilliant.

And... I should say that I'm one of these guys that I do think Roger, Rafa, and Novak are all probably the best we've ever seen. But. I am pretty much over the GOAT debate. Because it is SO hard to compare players from different eras. Because of racket and string tech. And because of fitness levels. And because of courts. The USO was on grass from '68 to 74' and green clay or hard clay from '75 to '78 (hello Chris Evert's 4 straight US Open titles after falling in the SF 4 straight times on grass). Same with the AO. It was on grass through '87. And nobody went down to play it because it was thousands of miles away and flights weren't as cheap I guess. Idk. It was quite the trek from what I understand. Hence Borg having zero AO's. He played it less than 5 times I think. And that's largely because.... one of the biggest reasons it's hard to compare eras. Basically every pro from before the 90s will tell you that they didn't prioritize slams like we do today. It was about the tour and being #1. Which makes sense because they were nascent tours. They cared about building them up. It was still relatively new. But also about being able to say they were the best in the world. And the money back then was no where near what it is today. So you played a TON of tournaments (a la Connors).

Going back to Connors and McEnroe. Connors played the AO twice in '74 and '75. He won it in '74. He could have easily gone down there and played with Rosewall and Newcombe and won a couple more and probably gotten closer to Borg's total. And Rosewall wouldn't have been at 12. He may not have dominated it. But he would have won it one or two more times. Vilas won it back to back in the last 70s. Connors was still playing well. Wilander won it twice in the early 80s. Connors was still making the semis at the other slams. There's no telling what his number could be. McEnroe showed up in 1977. Didn't play the AO until 1983 and only played it 4 more times between '85 and '92. Never won it.

Meanwhile Federer has 6. Djokovic has 7. Nadal only has 1. We respect the AO on a whole other level now. Back then it was "the other slam." Partially because, I forgot to mention, it was at the end of the year (I'm sure you know this). After the US Open. These folks were tired. You take the AO out and Nadal's dominance at the French starts to take on a much greater significance and he's the guy with the most slams. Though Roger's 8 at Wimbledon is still unprecedented and nothing to sneeze at. But of course, removing an entire slam would have changed everything else anyways. Fed and Djokovic may have been more rested and or hungrier and maybe Fed finds his way through Nadal in one of those 4 earlier meetings. Though that seems unlikely to me. Or maybe he wins the French before Rafa shows up. Because he has more urgency. Or not. We don't know. Which is why I shouldn't have even mentioned removing it because you can't. And that's the point, for this era and the others. You can't take the AO away now but you can't really fault for the other guys for not going to the AO when no one went. AND when slams weren't how they held themselves up against each other or against history. I'm not sure they even worried about history like we do today because they were the start of the history. Or at least the Open history. They were the pace setters. The ones who had to be passed.

With all that said. I do think Djokovic's level was insane. Then and now it just makes me so mad that he can be that good. That he can be everywhere. Trusts himself enough to go for it and more often than not makes whatever insane shot he's going for. We often talk about players in matches thinking they needed to make a shot too good. Everyone does it. Including Djokovic. But I feel like he and Nadal do it less than anyone else. And having heard McEnroe (an avowed Nadal lover) say that Djokovic may be the best we've ever seen I think I can say what I've said with some confidence. Even though I'd love to be able to say that Fed's highest level is the highest we've seen. But, honestly Fed's highest level may even be behind Nadal's highest level. 2006 was amazing. But Nadal's intensity takes the cake over either of these guys if you ask me. But Djokovic seemed to have zero weaknesses there for a bit. Wawrinka illuminated his weakness against power there a couple times (a la Nadal against Tsonga at the 2008 AO or Soderling at the 2009 FO and Fed against Berdych early on or DelPo or also Soderling at the 2010 FO). In the end you just have to say they all had their best years and all have their strength's and weaknesses and it's been a pleasure to watch them all battle with each other.

I'm sorry I got off topic and went super long. I'm long winded. It's my greatest weakness. I can't help myself.
 

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113
I think this is just a misunderstanding.
Because again. I was a huge Roddick fan. I wanted him to win more slams. And he tried as much as he could. He got just about every last drop out of his career that he could with the Big 3 around. And until Djokovic and Murray finally reached their best level, he was easily the second best grass player on the planet (and that includes Nadal in my book). The only reason he never got a Wimbledon is because his prime was during Fed's prime. But all I was saying is Nalbandian had match point in that semifinal at the 2003 US Open against Roddick. And it's not often that a player wins a slam having been down match point down in any of their matches. I mean, it happens, but it's rare. My statement was intended to dig at Nalbandian who let matches like that one slip away and let his entire career slip away. Also, I said that if "everything else worked out the way it did" meaning, if he still went to every other slam final he did and lost, if he had lost that match point in 2003, he'd have never won a slam. So I said he should have never won a slam, in that context. I was just trying to keep it as close to history as possible. Because in reality, obviously if he doesn't win that match, everything changes and maybe he has a completely different career.
Sorry but I just don’t buy this circular, speculative crap, good effort though. Just remember, your should’ves Isn’t as meaningful as you might like.