Early Talk about Roland Garros

[Moxie]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

^Are you going to claim lack of sleep as your "excuse" for agreeing with me? If so, I'm going to claim a bum knee, and a possible onset of mono for agreeing with YOU. :laydownlaughing

 

[Fiero425]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

^Are you going to claim lack of sleep as your "excuse" for agreeing with me? If so, I'm going to claim a bum knee, and a possible onset of mono for agreeing with YOU. :laydownlaughing

Sleep deprivation will always be my "fall back" with chronic apnea being present since I was a kid! :cover

 

[Moxie]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

Sleep deprivation will always be my "fall back" with chronic apnea being present since I was a kid! :cover

I'm not sure if that explains your affinity for the exclamation point, or for Djokovic, but I hope with time all of these maladies will clear themselves up. :laydownlaughing

 

[Kirijax]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

If it hadn't been for that net blunder by Djokovic, Nadal very well could have lost. That's what I call lucky.

 

[lacatch]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

I find it hard to believe that people are "encouraged" by Nadal's performance this week: almost all three setters, and he said in his presser that his legs were "tired" from all the tennis he played. It seems more clear than ever that Nadal has started his own, slow Federer-like decline, and he said to the press when they questioned him about losing sets/tournaments on his beloved clay, "get used to it". The French is going to be VERY interesting....

 

[Moxie]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

If it hadn't been for that net blunder by Djokovic, Nadal very well could have lost. That's what I call lucky.

You really don't start that argument again, but that didn't make Novak lose that match. Think of it this way: it was not game point, and it was simply an error. Think of it as the equivalent of hitting the ball long/wide/into the net. As I mentioned before, Novak lost that match because he blew a lead/played poorly to start/got lucky to be in the fifth set anyway/lost his serve through inattention late in the 5th. It was a 4 hour 40-some minute match with many points played. He didn't lose it on one net blunder, and you shouldn't buy into that nonsense.

 

[lacatch]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

The net blunder shook him up, and he also asked (and was refused) to have the court swept because of slippery conditions (they asked Rafa and he said he didn't think it was necessary--- he knew Djokovic was having a hard time with it). All errors are not created equal .

 

[nehmeth]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

I find it hard to believe that people are "encouraged" by Nadal's performance this week: almost all three setters, and he said in his presser that his legs were "tired" from all the tennis he played. It seems more clear than ever that Nadal has started his own, slow Federer-like decline, and he said to the press when they questioned him about losing sets/tournaments on his beloved clay, "get used to it". The French is going to be VERY interesting....

I agree with you in that there doesn't seem to be anything encouraging to take from Rome. At the same time, Uncle Toni will have a lot to address during the week off. Team Rafa will be ready for another run to the final of the French Open by then.

 

[Moxie]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

The net blunder shook him up, and he also asked (and was refused) to have the court swept because of slippery conditions (they asked Rafa and he said he didn't think it was necessary--- he knew Djokovic was having a hard time with it). All errors are not created equal .

I don't remember that he asked for the court to be swept though I do remember that he asked for it to be watered, which it wouldn't be, in the middle of a set. In any case, yes, he did let that blunder bother him, but that's also his fault. He hung onto it too long, and if I remember, he was broken in the next set. It's a mental lapse, and part of 5-set tennis is maintaining focus for the long-haul. All errors are not created equal if you don't treat them that way. He should have let it go and move on, but he didn't. That's his own fault, and not "bad luck."

 

[lacatch]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

You are right Moxie--he asked to have the court watered (due to slippery conditions), not swept. And he DID let both the slippery conditions and the net touch get to him. But as I said after Djokovic pummeled Rafa in Miami, he has that 2011 look in his eyes again, and is a man on a mission. All in all---the French should be more interesting this year than ever!

 

[Moxie]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

You are right Moxie--he asked to have the court watered (due to slippery conditions), not swept. And he DID let both the slippery conditions and the net touch get to him. But as I said after Djokovic pummeled Rafa in Miami, he has that 2011 look in his eyes again, and is a man on a mission. All in all---the French should be more interesting this year than ever!

He didn't ask to have the court watered because it was slippery. It was because it would make the balls heavier, and he needed an advantage. Yes, Djokovic pummeled Nadal in Miami, though I'm not sure why that's to the point. If you want to move onto the vagaries of "look in his eyes" and "man on a mission," you're losing me. At Roland Garros, Djokovic has yet to make a completely convincing stand against Rafa. (And I mean that. Nadal was the better player for most of both matches in 2012 and 2013.) That's the bottom line. Yes, Rafa is going in at his least impressive. However, Djokovic hasn't replaced him as the world-beater on clay, or even hards this season. The season does seem to be more up for grabs. But the French Open still shapes up to come down to two. And if it does come down to those two, it's nearly a toss-up, but you have to give the edge to the guy who has always held him at bay, and everyone else, save one. In some 65 best-of-five set matches on clay, Nadal has lost one. He may lose another this year, but I wouldn't bet my house on it.

If they do meet in the finals, Djokovic will not only have to have his best game, but his best mind-set, and those things don't always come together at the same time. They have not yet for him, at the French Open.

 

[brokenshoelace]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

The net blunder shook him up, and he also asked (and was refused) to have the court swept because of slippery conditions (they asked Rafa and he said he didn't think it was necessary--- he knew Djokovic was having a hard time with it). All errors are not created equal .

If something favors your opponent would you agree to it? If so, you're not doing it right... Keep in mind, this wasn't something unfair or anything. Djokovic wanted the courts watered, but it's not like there was danger to the players or anything. Nadal didn't do anything wrong.

As far as the net blunder, that should have never happened, I agree, because the match should have been over an hour before. But don't let anyone remind us of that.

 

[tented]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

^ But wasn't it RG's policy not to water the court during a set? If that's the case -- and I seem to remember it being mentioned at the time -- then there was nothing Novak, the umpire, or Rafa could do about either going ahead with it or preventing it. It was never going to happen; it wasn't someone's on-the-spot decision or judgement call.

 

[tented]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

BTW, yet again discussing The Net Cord Touch That Shook The World feels like spending a holiday with a drunk uncle.

 

[Kieran]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

He asked to have the court watered because it would favour his game, he only said it was slippy and dangerous because he couldn't say to the umpire, "please, water the court, it suits Rafa better the way it is!"

And Broken is correct: it should have been done in four...

 

[Moxie]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

BTW, yet again discussing The Net Cord Touch That Shook The World feels like spending a holiday with a drunk uncle.

I kinda thought I'd put that one to bed…but we've moved onto the finer points of watering the court.

 

[Federberg]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

If it hadn't been for that net blunder by Djokovic, Nadal very well could have lost. That's what I call lucky.

You really don't start that argument again, but that didn't make Novak lose that match. Think of it this way: it was not game point, and it was simply an error. Think of it as the equivalent of hitting the ball long/wide/into the net. As I mentioned before, Novak lost that match because he blew a lead/played poorly to start/got lucky to be in the fifth set anyway/lost his serve through inattention late in the 5th. It was a 4 hour 40-some minute match with many points played. He didn't lose it on one net blunder, and you shouldn't buy into that nonsense.

Completely agree. At that level one point doesn't make the difference.. unless it's match point.. which it wasn't. It would actually diminish Novak to say that he lost because of that. He has far greater mental resources than that. Clearly he didn't have enough belief. It remains to be seen whether the place where he's at now is more secure. If it is.. he'll probably pull it off this time. It just seemed to me in this match, that when he was playing his game he's just better than Rafa at the moment. The only thing is that I'm still not confident that we can rely on Novak to just play tennis. Until he wins another big one, the question is out there...

 

[TsarMatt]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

BTW, yet again discussing The Net Cord Touch That Shook The World feels like spending a holiday with a drunk uncle.

This is turning into, like, the most notorious photo in tennis history:

 

[Kieran]

RE: 2014 Masters Series Rome Final: Djokovic v. Nadal

BTW, yet again discussing The Net Cord Touch That Shook The World feels like spending a holiday with a drunk uncle.

This is turning into, like, the most notorious photo in tennis history:

Nothing notorious about it. Just like there's nothing notorious about players using Hawkeye to challenge an opponent's shot.

Rafa was correct...

 

[coban]

AP, I think his camp has to look at how he has lost the matches he has on clay this year, including the Nishikori win for obvious reasons. People that beat him are on the baseline, taking time away from him and he is 20 feet behind, scrambling all over the place. Even today, during the third set, he decided to hug the baseline for a bit and attack and he had success, broke Nole .
He has to take command of the rallies early and not sit so far back. It will work against %90 of the competition but the rest can punish you for it. Also, he is returning from so far back...I know why he is doing it and when he gets his return nice and deep to neutralize the rally, it works. But his returns for the most part has been so short recently and good players punish him for it.

This is what must be done, and you are right. Nadal knows it, but it takes confidence to do it. All in all, I think he goes into RG better than we would have thought a couple of weeks ago. Let's see if he makes the adjustments. (Game and head.)

I think he needs to realize that he's not 25 any more, and that he has lost a millisecond or two. The strategies that he has previously employed and been very successfull with is not going to work anymore. Standing closer to the baseline and trying to take more charge or the rallies is the only way to go.

If not i see that his slowdown will be much uglier than Federer because his style demands so much more than Federer.