China Open 500

[the AntiPusher]

He's not inconsistent today, obviously. This seems like typical Rafa, since 2015. But grigor must be playing tough to be in so much control...

Personally, maybe a good azz whipping will finally put the bed all of those theories that there isn't a lot of holes in Rafa's non clay game.. I have been preaching this since 2014

 

[Kieran]

Good win for Grigor, let's hope it's not the extent of it for him, but he builds on it...

 

[herios]

I just check the scores. Why is Nadal getting peppered by inconsistent Dimi. He's down 6-2 2-0 :cover

Reality check. Rafa is not the same player as he used to be a few years ago, he is vulnerable and a player with enough game having a good day can send him home.

Well done by Grigor.

 

[kskate2]

It is a job well done by Dimi. But I need to see him win something significant before I believe this is a corner turn.

 

[herios]

It is a job well done by Dimi. But I need to see him win something significant before I believe this is a corner turn.

That I agree with

 

[herios]

I hope Raonic is over the bad patch which resulted in losses to Harrison at the USO and Youzhny in Moscow.
He had to play 2 matches today, because of the rain delays and won them both in straight sets against Jaziri and Carreno-Busta, who upset first Gasquet.

 

[Kieran]

I wonder how this defeat affects Rafa in the race for London...

 

[herios]

I wonder how this defeat affects Rafa in the race for London...

Not as much. Brdych lost even earlier in Tokyo to Muller, and he was right behind Rafa in the race.
Cilic may get closer to him, if he wins in Tokyo.

 

[herios]

Zverev lost today to Ferrer. Sasha sill needs to get better to become a big threat.

 

[Fiero425]

I wonder how this defeat affects Rafa in the race for London...

Not as much. Brdych lost even earlier in Tokyo to Muller, and he was right behind Rafa in the race.
Cilic may get closer to him, if he wins in Tokyo.

Tomas had to be on his last legs! He's getting up there and can't play consecutive tourneys that well anymore! After winning Shenzhen, he should have just bowed out like other players! :nono :angel: :dodgy: :cover

 

[the AntiPusher]

I just check the scores. Why is Nadal getting peppered by inconsistent Dimi. He's down 6-2 2-0 :cover

Reality check. Rafa is not the same player as he used to be a few years ago, he is vulnerable and a player with enough game having a good day can send him home.

Well done by Grigor.

the reality check should have been in 2014 not late 2016 from loosing a match to Grigor. As I stated earlier a good azz whipping today and a few more will eventually break through the stubborn Spanish Bull.

 

[El Dude]

But according to Carol, Rafa just needs a mental boost and he'll be back to his 2013 form.

As for Dimitrov, this is nothing new. He's been capable of elite level tennis for a few years now but just not on a regular basis. Still, he's as good a candidate as any to have a late peak.

 

[El Dude]

But as for the "reality check" I think it should have come in 2015 when he didn't come back strong despite being healthy. In 2014 and early 2015 it was understandable to think a tweak or two would return him to form, but by the time 2015 clay season was over it was clear that he just wasn't the same player.

 

[masterclass]

Rafa said today "was a disaster".

As mentioned in my End of Winning Slams thread, Rafa just has too many matches in him. He'll have a couple of fair matches if he doesn't get challenged too much, and then an awful one, especially anyone with fair defense and controlled aggressive play. And playing on hard courts only makes it worse.

I think his only chance was to shut down his season after the US Open, get completely healthy and then work on his fitness, practice and play on the clay, much as he did in 2012-2013, and stay on it as much as possible next year through to Roland Garros. But I think that chance is gone now.

Time is master of all.

Respectfully,
masterclass

 

[Fiero425]

Rafa said today "was a disaster".

As mentioned in my End of Winning Slams thread, Rafa just has too many matches in him. He'll have a couple of fair matches if he doesn't get challenged too much, and then an awful one, especially anyone with fair defense and controlled aggressive play. And playing on hard courts only makes it worse.

I think his only chance was to shut down his season after the US Open, get completely healthy and then work on his fitness, practice and play on the clay, much as he did in 2012-2013, and stay on it as much as possible next year through to Roland Garros. But I think that chance is gone now.

Time is master of all.

Respectfully,
masterclass

He might think he can swipe a YEC with Nole down, Roger out, and many other players worn down like Thiem & Kei! IDK how anyone can call this guy "The GOAT" with his abysmal record at the YEC, no defense of a title off clay, and limited time at #1! :nono :dodgy:

 

[shawnbm]

I certainly think he is one of the GOAT on that record!

 

[Fiero425]

I certainly think he is one of the GOAT on that record!

Well with Rafa's FO's alone I'd concur! The problem I had was with past "loudmouths" like Wilander and McEnroe who thought Nadal was the end all, be all of tennis greats! It was obscene IMO since I've been a bit of a historian and appreciate players going back to Tilden! For them to even think Nadal was ahead of all others was hubris allowing the world to know they're "past it!" Nadal isn't even in my top 6 for obvious reasons with the tech and homogenized courts! He wouldn't have survived past generations of truly great players who would abuse his defensive style! The only player it seems that could sustain greatness playing like that was Borg; which is why he's a true legend with 5 straight Wimbledons and 6 FO's alone! :angel: :dodgy: :clap

 

[El Dude]

Rafa is most definitely one of the GOATs, which is more of a small herd than a singular animal. But he shares a trait that I think all or most of the "herd" share: he has his own distinct components of greatness, both in terms of his resume and his play. The same with Novak, Roger, Pete, and all the other true greats.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

I just check the scores. Why is Nadal getting peppered by inconsistent Dimi. He's down 6-2 2-0 :cover

If Baby can do this much, imagine what Dad could do. :snicker

 

[sid]

Murray should shove a racquet up his a$$ if he manages to lose on this slow hard court, where he should feel at home. As for Nadal's chances he should play some challenger on clay if possible. His last showing on a hard court was, to say the least, pathetic. At least make the unforced error like a man, serving 80 mph and sending moonballs won't win you a lot of ATP matches.

How colorful you are with this (Murray should shove a racquet up his a$$)cover

Maybe your so good @ tennis you could beat Murray:snicker