Chengdu Open 2018 - China - ATP 250

[herios]

But then again, how he, without a coach and without much practice, manages to play the way he does if it is not on pure talent.

You missed the meaning. He is talented, but not as much as he is praised for.

 

[mrzz]

But then again, how he, without a coach and without much practice, manages to play the way he does if it is not on pure talent.

First, with the best serve in town. With that he gets to the 3732327432 tie-breakers he play every match.

Second, being big, strong, and fast.

Third, having good reflexes. If you want to call it talent, fine. I don't.

Fourth, being much more cold blooded than the average. He plays his best at crunch time. If you want to call that talent, well, with that I agree.

And this "no practice" story, c'mon, that's pure bullshit. Of all people, you're one of the last I would expect to buy it.

And by the way I like Kyrgios. I just read him differently from most (not just me, @herios as well, I should have remembered as we had this conversation before).

 

[Billie]

Go F3!!!

 

[britbox]

Tomic and Fog locked in a final breaker.

 

[britbox]

Bernie takes the match 9-7 in the breaker. Wins Chengdu.

 

[britbox]

Always good to see a repentant sinner...

 

[herios]

This was the 4 title for Tomic. He had to do the heavy lifting being a qualifier. Good for him. Back in business indeed.

 

[Moxie]

I was hoping for Fabio. I can't manage to root for Bernie anymore.

 

[Mastoor]

I thought Tomic gave up tennis after earning all those millions. I watched the final until mid 3rd set. Very nervous play from Fognini and Tomic mixing up didn't help Fabio at all.

 

[Mastoor]

First, with the best serve in town. With that he gets to the 3732327432 tie-breakers he play every match.

Second, being big, strong, and fast.

Third, having good reflexes. If you want to call it talent, fine. I don't.

Fourth, being much more cold blooded than the average. He plays his best at crunch time. If you want to call that talent, well, with that I agree.

And this "no practice" story, c'mon, that's pure bullshit. Of all people, you're one of the last I would expect to buy it.

And by the way I like Kyrgios. I just read him differently from most (not just me, @herios as well, I should have remembered as we had this conversation before).

What do you think, how long he practices per average? I think he doesn't practice in his average week as much as Fedal do in their average days.

 

[mrzz]

What do you think, how long he practices per average? I think he doesn't practice in his average week as much as Fedal do in their average days.

Well, I would not be surprised if he practices less than Fedal (or Djokovic, for that matter). But I hear those stories about no practicing exactly the same way I hear one kid that just lost a tennis match telling the other "but I let you win".

Tennis players like to play tennis. Obviously that practicing is not playing for fun, but even so it is much better than the average job, and Kyrgios is a smart guy that knows that pretty well. Those young kids, with all that energy, they won't be resting on the couch all day long. And if he gets out of shape he is bound to exit any major at R1. He may have some unorthodox training, but whatever he does works for him.

My guess now is that he practices what the average top 100 practices, and I won't be surprised if one day he actually starts practicing above average. Some people have work ethics, but most practice just as much as they want (or need) to win. And if I would make a guess about that (actually something I rather don't bother much), I would say this a guy who REALLY wants to win... (debatable, obviously).

 

[Mastoor]

Well, I would not be surprised if he practices less than Fedal (or Djokovic, for that matter). But I hear those stories about no practicing exactly the same way I hear one kid that just lost a tennis match telling the other "but I let you win".

Tennis players like to play tennis. Obviously that practicing is not playing for fun, but even so it is much better than the average job, and Kyrgios is a smart guy that knows that pretty well. Those young kids, with all that energy, they won't be resting on the couch all day long. And if he gets out of shape he is bound to exit any major at R1. He may have some unorthodox training, but whatever he does works for him.

My guess now is that he practices what the average top 100 practices, and I won't be surprised if one day he actually starts practicing above average. Some people have work ethics, but most practice just as much as they want (or need) to win. And if I would make a guess about that (actually something I rather don't bother much), I would say this a guy who REALLY wants to win... (debatable, obviously).

That is not what I read, that top 100 players practice all about the same. Even among Big 3 there is a difference. For Nole they say he practices up to 2 hours a day, for Rafa's fans claimed some time ago it was 6 hours, while I read that some players practice with Federer for as long as 9 hours.

Kyrgios doesn't look patient to me at all. I can't imagine him practicing that long. As for his will to win, that probably depends on a day. i watched him tanking a match, i think last year, while just last month Lahiani decided to encourage him to give better effort.

 

[mrzz]

That is not what I read, that top 100 players practice all about the same. Even among Big 3 there is a difference. For Nole they say he practices up to 2 hours a day, for Rafa's fans claimed some time ago it was 6 hours, while I read that some players practice with Federer for as long as 9 hours.

Kyrgios doesn't look patient to me at all. I can't imagine him practicing that long. As for his will to win, that probably depends on a day. i watched him tanking a match, i think last year, while just last month Lahiani decided to encourage him to give better effort.

Well, I won't discuss with facts, specially considering that I have zero information on the subject. But I take the numbers above with a pinch of salt... after your post I realized that it is a bit over simplistic to assume most top 100's train the same amount, but I would correct then to this: all (or most) top 100's train the maximum time that it is effective for them. I mean, player A does not train 4 hours instead of 4,5 because he did not feel like training those extra .5 hours. He does not train those hours because either he took professional advice or time told him that anything more than 4 hours a day would be over training. Now, put in the mix that different players will have different thresholds, and it all makes sense.

Having said that... 2 hours a day for Djokovic? Again, you surely know anything Djokovic-related way better than me, but this looks too much (or to little). Maybe it is two hours of technical, racquet in hand training, but I would guess there also would be more physical parts or anything aimed at his performance, even yoga, meditation or whatever they feel it helps.

9 hours for Federer? Again, I believe the number, but for sure this is occasional. In the long run it does not work.

As for Nadal, he is obviously a maniac, so whatever they say makes sense

Re: Kyrgios tanking, he surely does that, but he is an opportunistic s.o.b. I have seen him tank sets (which he figured he was bound to lose) just to come back firing on all cylinders on the next, taking the opponent off guard (yes, it is borderline gamesmanship to say the least). But let us agree not to waste time on Kyrgios' psyche...

 

[Mastoor]

Well, I won't discuss with facts, specially considering that I have zero information on the subject. But I take the numbers above with a pinch of salt... after your post I realized that it is a bit over simplistic to assume most top 100's train the same amount, but I would correct then to this: all (or most) top 100's train the maximum time that it is effective for them. I mean, player A does not train 4 hours instead of 4,5 because he did not feel like training those extra .5 hours. He does not train those hours because either he took professional advice or time told him that anything more than 4 hours a day would be over training. Now, put in the mix that different players will have different thresholds, and it all makes sense.

Having said that... 2 hours a day for Djokovic? Again, you surely know anything Djokovic-related way better than me, but this looks too much (or to little). Maybe it is two hours of technical, racquet in hand training, but I would guess there also would be more physical parts or anything aimed at his performance, even yoga, meditation or whatever they feel it helps.

9 hours for Federer? Again, I believe the number, but for sure this is occasional. In the long run it does not work.

As for Nadal, he is obviously a maniac, so whatever they say makes sense

Re: Kyrgios tanking, he surely does that, but he is an opportunistic s.o.b. I have seen him tank sets (which he figured he was bound to lose) just to come back firing on all cylinders on the next, taking the opponent off guard (yes, it is borderline gamesmanship to say the least). But let us agree not to waste time on Kyrgios' psyche...

Yes, 2 hours on the court, if you include stretching, yoga, meditations, gym, jogging, bike and whatever else he does, that must be all day long.

 

[Moxie]

Yes, 2 hours on the court, if you include stretching, yoga, meditations, gym, jogging, bike and whatever else he does, that must be all day long.

Which is probably more like most players. I don't believe 9 hours/day for Roger, even if you include the gym. Personally, I've never made any claims for Rafa...I don't even know what his routine is, though I'd think a couple of hours on court and a couple of hours strength and conditioning. I expect that the top guys put in something similar. As to the younger ones, Juan Carlos Ferrero was recently quoted as saying that he thinks they don't put in the time. He says they have too many distractions. But if it's true, it could explain what everyone is complaining about...that the younger gen is not stepping up to the plate. Besides the talent gap, maybe a lot of them really don't work hard enough. I take Raonic and Nishikori as serious guys, and I think Sasha Zverev is. We know Thiem is.