Andy Murray's slam winning days are over

El Dude

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Well written article and welcome to the forum.

I tend to agree with you and have said as much back in January when he had hip surgery. I see three factors working against Andy:

1) The hip surgery itself. I'm no doctor, but my sense is that it will be difficult to return to his previous form given his physical style of play and lack of a major weapon, as you emphasized.

2) The resurgence of Novak to go along with Fedal. Andy Murray is the 4th greatest player of the last ten years and probably the best player of the Open Era with fewer than six Slams, and arguably as good as most of the 6-7 Slam lesser greats. But he's always been the 4th best of the group, and I would also add isn't noticeably better than Stanimal or del Potro at their best, and both are playing well. So the old guard isn't done and Andy's one year of dominance saw an injured Roger, a struggling Rafa, and Novak going AWOL. The point being, he might not have that window again, at least not before...

3) The rise of NextGen. The Holy Trinity are so much more talented than everyone else, even in their 30s. But at some point the young talent will rise as the old talent falls; this might be another year or two or even three, but eventually as the NextGen reaches their peak and the Holy Trinity are a couple years older they will be close enough to compete. But Andy's talent level isn't that much higher than what we can imagine to be the peaks of Zverev, Shapo, and Tsitsipas--all of whom seem like future multi-Slam winners, if not 6+ Slam greats.

So yeah. Combining those three factors and it would take a perfect storm for Andy to win another Slam. If I were to list active players by their likelihood of winning future Slams, I'd say:

Probably (say, better than 50%): Djokovic, Nadal, Zvevev, Tsitsipas, Shapovalov
Maybe, solid chance (less than 50% but not negligible): Federer, Cilic, Wawrinka, del Potro, Thiem
Unlikely, but there's a chance I suppose (negligible, say >20%): Murray, Dimitrov, Nishikori, Raonic, Goffin, Anderson, etc
Maybe someday, but hard to say (?): Tiafoe, Kyrgios, Rublev, Edmund, Coric, Khachanov, Moutet, Aliassime, etc

Not the best grouping of players to be amongst. But maybe I'm being too harsh on Andy?
 
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Horsa

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Hi all,
Just joined the forum as I love tennis!

Wrote this piece. Please give it a read.
https://www.theroar.com.au/2018/08/22/andy-murrays-grand-slam-winning-days/
Do you agree?
Regards
Hi! Welcome!

I like your piece & think it's well written though I hope Andy Murray wins a lot more for us as a patriotic Brit. Your piece had a lot less spelling, punctuation, grammatical & typographical errors in than some magazines, newspapers & books I've read & they were supposed to have been proof-read. (Sometimes I read something & think I could have proof-read it better.) Well done! Mind you, other British players are coming to the fore so have a run in if not now maybe in the future. Realistically though, I know you're probably right.
 

luvsports!

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Hi! Welcome!

I like your piece & think it's well written though I hope Andy Murray wins a lot more for us as a patriotic Brit. Your piece had a lot less spelling, punctuation, grammatical & typographical errors in than some magazines, newspapers & books I've read & they were supposed to have been proof-read. (Sometimes I read something & think I could have proof-read it better.) Well done! Mind you, other British players are coming to the fore so have a run in if not now maybe in the future. Realistically though, I know you're probably right.

Cheers, look forward to posting more often here!
Really appreciate the feedback!

Do you think he can go back to the way he was or do you think he should change his style?
 

Horsa

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Cheers, look forward to posting more often here!
Really appreciate the feedback!

Do you think he can go back to the way he was or do you think he should change his style?
You're welcome. I look forward to seeing more of your writing. I found no errors at all in your piece.

I'm a big believer in encouraging, inspiring & motivating others. I only offer constructive criticism because people learn from it & I know how hard it can be to get constructive criticism. I write poems, short stories & songs (spontaneously except when offered constructive criticism which I agree with *in parts* & when I'm writing a poem & find something I really want to say but can't find another sentence which would leave a rhyme at the end & then I work hard to turn the words round while keeping the meaning so I still get the rhyme at the end & say what I want.). The only criticism I normally get is "That's a very good poem." "I love your poems." "That song you wrote is very good. I love the words. Are you going to record yourself singing it & share it?" & "Tell me more. I love your story but would like you to extend it, please." & "are you going to get your poems & your fairy-tale published?". I've copyrighted them all & am looking into getting my fairy-tale published. I've been told where to get hold of a book with all the publishers in & I'm trying to get enough poems together for a book. Anyway, that's enough about me. The long & the short of the matter is I don't mind proof-reading & offering constructive criticism if it's appreciated as constructive criticism can be hard to get & as a writer it's good to get a few different opinions as sometimes we work so hard on what we write that the way we see our work can be different to how others see it. We can think our writing is good while other people think it's bad or we can be overly critical of our work. I also believe in giving credit where it's due & always tell the truth. I say exactly what I think albeit in a tactful, diplomatic & euphemistic way. It's nice to see more writer's here.

I don't know but I think that he should try different styles in practice & see if they suit him better & swap & change the techniques & styles which work best for him from both his existing style & other techniques & styles that are used by others.
 
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GameSetAndMath

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Cheers, look forward to posting more often here!
Really appreciate the feedback!

Do you think he can go back to the way he was or do you think he should change his style?

I don't think Murray is capable of changing his style. He is aggressive only when he has to be absolutely be aggressive. Then very quickly he falls off to his defensive mode which is basic instinct.
 

Murat Baslamisli

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Good read. Probably the correct conclusion too. But confidence is a funny thing. When one gains it, suddenly one feels invincible.
I don't think Andy is ever going to be odds on favorite to win any slams he enters. But that does not mean he will not win one. Draws open up sometimes. In fact, it happens a lot. Just imagine Murray winning Queens next year, going into Wimbledon, building momentum...Roger yet another step slower, Rafa probably not seeing the second week, next gen still trying to figure out grass...
Stranger things have happened.
 
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Chris Koziarz

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Hi all,
Just joined the forum as I love tennis!

Wrote this piece. Please give it a read.
https://www.theroar.com.au/2018/08/22/andy-murrays-grand-slam-winning-days/
Do you agree?
Regards

Me likes your piece, too, Richard.

I luv this sport too & I think its writers are dear!
El Dude is the most prolific tennis blogger here,
so his opinion should be weighed more than mine
but I hope the latter will appear fine.
With regards to your & Dude's opinions, I mostly agree,
But Murray deserves the doubt benefit: we should wait and see.
 

Moxie

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Welcome luvsports! I'm on the side of optimism for Murray. Folks have been writing off Rafa for a decade for his attritional style. So we'll see how it goes.
 
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Fiero425

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Welcome luvsports! I'm on the side of optimism for Murray. Folks have been writing off Rafa for a decade for his attritional style. So we'll see how it goes.

Are you saying Rafa isn't destined for hip replacement surgery? I've been ranting for years that both Nadal and Murray get into unnecessary battles in early rounds with unknown players which inevitably cost them later! IIRC, Murray's best season was 2016 and he was playing well enough to make a FO final! I missed a lot of the 1st set, but it appears he was playing out of his mind and it looked as if he might steal yet another major from Nole! That didn't happen because he decided to get into 5 set battles in cons. early RD. matches! The 1st RD had Stepanek, a doubles' specialist, and aging at that, made Andy look like a fool for 2 set before allowing Murray to bore us all to death in his comeback! The 2nd RD had a French WC leading 2 sets to 1 before #2 seed got his act together! He allows it to happen by playing very defensive, standing way behind the baseline and just running down everything! It's ok if the op. cooperates and donates with errors! If they're playing well and Murray is made to really work hard, it's gotta cost him! By the time he faced Nole, he had truly shot his wad in that first set! Nole schooled him after that, running him around like a chicken! In the 4th set, Nole pulled another one of those walkabouts, up 2 breaks, dropping one of them before closing Murray out for his Nole Slam and immortality! Murray was destined to be in his situation and with Rafa, it's only a matter of time! :nono: :banghead: :cuckoo: :eek: :rolleyes:
 
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Horsa

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Me likes your piece, too, Richard.

I luv this sport too & I think its writers are dear!
El Dude is the most prolific tennis blogger here,
so his opinion should be weighed more than mine
but I hope the latter will appear fine.
With regards to your & Dude's opinions, I mostly agree,
But Murray deserves the doubt benefit: we should wait and see.
I like your poem but if I'm allowed to offer constructive criticism I would say that in the sentence before your poem you should have said "I like" instead of "me likes", (the only exception to this rule that remains is methinks which still lives on through some of Shakespeare's works & the study of Shakespeare's works), luv should be spelt love, & I'd phrase "doubt benefit" as "benefit of the doubt". Other than that your poem is very good & well structured. No offence intended by my constructive criticism. Constructive criticism helps us learn.
 

luvsports!

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I don't think Murray is capable of changing his style. He is aggressive only when he has to be absolutely be aggressive. Then very quickly he falls off to his defensive mode which is basic instinct.

Reckon he can get back to the top 10?
 

luvsports!

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Good read. Probably the correct conclusion too. But confidence is a funny thing. When one gains it, suddenly one feels invincible.
I don't think Andy is ever going to be odds on favorite to win any slams he enters. But that does not mean he will not win one. Draws open up sometimes. In fact, it happens a lot. Just imagine Murray winning Queens next year, going into Wimbledon, building momentum...Roger yet another step slower, Rafa probably not seeing the second week, next gen still trying to figure out grass...
Stranger things have happened.

Good points. If the draw opens up and he doesn't face the likes of Fedalovic, he could definitely have a chance.
Bo5 could give us a clue as to how his body is.
 

Mastoor

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I think it largely depends on how quickly Murray's body recovers. He may be a contender again very soon after that.
 

isabelle

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hope Sir Andy still can win some great tourneys but don't know if his hip'll let him do, this surgery broke Kuerten, Nalby, Gonzalez's careers...so hope and pray
 

Chris Koziarz

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Thanks for your feedback, Horsa.
"I like" instead of "me likes", (the only exception to this rule that remains is methinks which still lives on through some of Shakespeare's
Hmm, I didn't know the Master's expression was reserved to the Master works only and a mortal like me should not imitate it... A bit disappointing.
luv should be spelt love
This is not just a deliberate spelling mistake (e.g. as in a commercial expression "overnite") but the allusion to Richard's avatar name. So it has a deep emotional meaning, something like "I speak your language here, mate".
I'd phrase "doubt benefit" as "benefit of the doubt".
Looks like no one used my phrase yet. So I claim it herein, even if it sounds silly. I Iike to make mistakes sometimes when the rules are too boring.