2025 ATP General News

[Moxie]

We will have to disagree on Madrid, I found it a cold city and the people I much prefer Barcelona for the people food and art

Based on how much time spent in either? I lived in Madrid for over 2 years, and have spent a lot of time in Barcelona, with locals shepherding me around. Both have great art (The Prado in Madrid?) and great food. Both are great cities. But don't tell me Madrid is "cold." It has better Flamenco, for example, which is pretty hot. Tell me Geneva is rather cold, or Milan, but not Madrid.

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Blue clay maybe pleasing to the eye but thats where it ends full stop, no way does it prepare players for the 'real clay of Rome and RG".

Based on how much time spent in either? I lived in Madrid for over 2 years, and have spent a lot of time in Barcelona, with locals shepherding me around. Both have great art (The Prado in Madrid?) and great food. Both are great cities. But don't tell me Madrid is "cold." It has better Flamenco, for example, which is pretty hot. Tell me Geneva is rather cold, or Milan, but not Madrid.

Good for you I dont like Madrid full stop, we cant all like the same cities etc

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Blue clay might be pleasing to the eye, thats where it stops, it dosent prepare any player for the real clay of Rome and RG!

 

[Moxie]

Good for you I dont like Madrid full stop, we cant all like the same cities etc

Fair enough, but we can dislike the tournament and like the city. Personally, I think you should give it another chance, if you ever have the opportunity. Spain, in general, is such a great country, and the people are friendly and outgoing. They'll keep you out all night!

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Fair enough, but we can dislike the tournament and like the city. Personally, I think you should give it another chance, if you ever have the opportunity. Spain, in general, is such a great country, and the people are friendly and outgoing. They'll keep you out all night!

I love Spain in general, Madrid is just not my cup of tea, yes I wished the tournament went some where else, blue clay and the altitude factor just dosent prepare players for Rome and RG, also I could not stand that horrid Tiriac man, both Madrid and Miami are up for sale being IMG tournaments, to date there hasnt been a successful bid

 

[mrzz]

I'm pretty sure they had played on it when they said that.

I believe you. But (and I remember that quite well) people were saying that the blue clay was super slippery weeks before the actual tournament. And maybe it was a tiny bit more than the average (and, remember, clay is supposed to be slippery). So my point is that people, including players, decided that it was "oh so super slippery" and they would never change their tune regardless of what they actually experienced on court.

I watched a lot of matches of that tournament. You simply did not see people slipping all around. I was just checking some highlights and could not find any point where a player slip and fell (though I saw that infamous Verdasco x Nadal match were Verdasco complains all the time and still wins in the end).

At the very very least, it is way less slippery than what people were saying. And I do remember quite well that in the end there were zero injuries because of that. Again, at the very least, the probably could have made it better in the next year.

Problem is, exactly as you said, it is not a permanent clay court. And those courts usually suck, but that does not have much to do about the color of the surface...

 

[Moxie]

I believe you. But (and I remember that quite well) people were saying that the blue clay was super slippery weeks before the actual tournament. And maybe it was a tiny bit more than the average (and, remember, clay is supposed to be slippery). So my point is that people, including players, decided that it was "oh so super slippery" and they would never change their tune regardless of what they actually experienced on court.

I watched a lot of matches of that tournament. You simply did not see people slipping all around. I was just checking some highlights and could not find any point where a player slip and fell (though I saw that infamous Verdasco x Nadal match were Verdasco complains all the time and still wins in the end).

At the very very least, it is way less slippery than what people were saying. And I do remember quite well that in the end there were zero injuries because of that. Again, at the very least, the probably could have made it better in the next year.

Problem is, exactly as you said, it is not a permanent clay court. And those courts usually suck, but that does not have much to do about the color of the surface...

And I believe your memory. But these are 2 different issues. One is blue clay, which, I'm sorry, is dead. Clay, btw, is not "slippery." It's more adapted to sliding, but that is not the same thing. The other is whether the clay surface in Madrid is a good prep for RG, which it is not, as you say. As clay courts, they "suck." Your word.

 

[mrzz]

And I believe your memory. But these are 2 different issues. One is blue clay, which, I'm sorry, is dead. Clay, btw, is not "slippery." It's more adapted to sliding, but that is not the same thing. The other is whether the clay surface in Madrid is a good prep for RG, which it is not, as you say. As clay courts, they "suck." Your word.

Oh, I know blue clay is dead. I might lament it once in a while. Where else, if not here?

About clay being slippery, I think you are splitting hairs here, but fair enough. But if you are making a distinction, than you need a new word for it. Slidy?

About the Madrid surface, again, the problem is blowing things out of proportion. The surface is not as good as some others, ok. But first it is easier to fix that than to scrap the tournament altogether. Second, and that is the most important part, the small difference on the surface is not enough to call it a bad preparation for RG; It is still clay, the center court is the only one with dimensions comparable to Chartrier, most of the big dogs are there... I mean, it is only fans that will say that this is not good preparation for RG. I bet that any player would simply reply to that with a surprised expression and a quick "of course it is...."

But, ugh, how we love to debate. I am pretty sure Madrid's surface is not that important for either you and me...

 

[MargaretMcAleer]

Oh, I know blue clay is dead. I might lament it once in a while. Where else, if not here?

About clay being slippery, I think you are splitting hairs here, but fair enough. But if you are making a distinction, than you need a new word for it. Slidy?

About the Madrid surface, again, the problem is blowing things out of proportion. The surface is not as good as some others, ok. But first it is easier to fix that than to scrap the tournament altogether. Second, and that is the most important part, the small difference on the surface is not enough to call it a bad preparation for RG; It is still clay, the center court is the only one with dimensions comparable to Chartrier, most of the big dogs are there... I mean, it is only fans that will say that this is not good preparation for RG. I bet that any player would simply reply to that with a surprised expression and a quick "of course it is...."

But, ugh, how we love to debate. I am pretty sure Madrid's surface is not that important for either you and me...

After the tournament took place in 2012, threats of future boycotts from some players, especially Nadal and Djokovic ( who both lost on the blue surface) led the tournament to return to traditional red clay for the 2013 season, this was due to the blue clay being more slippery than regular clay
Quite frankly I wish they didnt dump Hamburg in favor of Madrid, I know it was a slower clay indoor surface,
Madrid is a concete base with clay over the top of it, and wth altitude, how can that be a advantage for any player going into Rome and RG is beyond my way of thinking,
You would have to dig up the concrete base and start over again? also Madrid is up for sale..
I know I am a traditionalist when it comes to clay, being brought up to play on the real red dirt in Rome ( btw I still love you mrzz)