2014 Roland Garros Final: Nadal vs. Djokovic

[DarthFed]

I would agree with you, if it were not for the Monte Carlo final. Fed's showing in that match against Wawrinka was one of the most disappointing I have seen from him in his career.

He's played a lot worse than that match this year. He just lost to Bert & Ernie show 8 days ago as an example.

Yeah, but the Monte Carlo final was a chance to get a big title against someone that he has dominated in his career - AFTER already beating his toughest possible opponent in Djokovic.

That loss to Wawrinka just confirmed once and for all that he is no longer in the same competitive frame of mind that he once was. A truly focused and fully motivated Federer wins that in straight sets.

Can't say I disagree. Monte Carlo isn't a GS but still would be a big time win at a tournament he hadn't won. Wasn't a good effort for sure but as mentioned before we've seen wayy worse the last 2 years. He lost to Kei in Miami, Hewitt in Brisbane, Gulbis at RG, Robredo at USO, etc.

 

[rafanoy1992]

Congratulations to Rafael Nadal for winning his 9th French Open title and 14th Grand Slam! Also, he has now won at least 1 Slam in each of the past ten years. What an amazing accomplishment by Nadal. Also, he will keep his number 1 ranking for now.

As for Djokovic, tough loss for him especially after winning the first set. I still think he will win this title, but I give him at least two more years before his window closes at this event. He is 27 years old so it will get harder as he gets older.

 

[huntingyou]

also important to mention Rafa's slice and how it manged to disrupt Novak's timing and frustrate him enough to win points he had no business winning. The tactical adjustment of both players from match to match it's a beauty to see.

 

[tenisplayrla08]

^ Acknowledge that Roger should have done better from 2008 on. He had his chances to.

The real disaster was not 2008 Wimbledon (where Nadal played very well) but the 2009 Australian Open. That match opened the floodgates as far as the Nadal menace went and Federer coughed it up - and then cried it out.

2008 Wimbledon was a disaster. Roger didn't show up for 2 sets and then played OK the last few sets. 1-12 BP's, blowing a 4-1 lead in the 2nd, hideous misses in the 5th, etc.

That opened the floodgates that allowed for AO 2009. I remember being the only one who knew that Roger would implode in the 5th set of that AO final and the only reason for that was the thought of 2008 on his mind.

Not to mention he'd be considered the best on grass and would have won 7 straight Wimbledons. An awful loss for sure.

Well, he might have won 7 straight Wimbledons... if he wins 2008, that changes the circumstances and maybe he doesn't win 2009. He shouldn't have won 2009 anyways. Roddick choked in that one. That friggin backhand volley. Still haunts me to this day. Then again, I should apply the same logic to that match. If Roddick doesn't miss that backhand and wins the second set, he may still lost the third set but lost the fourth set and lost in a fifth set anyways. He may have lost a lot earlier in a fifth set too. OR... he may have won in straight sets (which is definitely the version I prefer, but alas, I live in hypotheticals too much).

But, moving away from the hypothetical, a good point would be that he wouldn't have had to win 7 straight Wimbledons. He would have been the only man to win 6 straight Wimbledons or 6 straight of any slam. That is why I think he lost it honestly. I think he lost that 08 Wimbledon because the idea of winning 6 in a row weighed on him. I think he collapsed under the history of it all. I know that may be a little bit of a stretch or just down right crazy or naive. And obviously, Nadal had just beaten the living snot out of him at RG. The truth of the matter is probably simply that Nadal won the first two sets easily because he had Fed's number. The argument could actually be made that I'm completely wrong and the only reason Fed extended the match to 5 sets was because he wanted to win 6 in a row so badly that he found a way to do it. But then... you have the 2009 US Open. His second chance to win a particular slam 6 times in a row. That time he was up against a first time grand slam finalist. Was up 2 sets to one. Collapsed in the 5th. As he had done against Nadal in the fifth set of the AO. So many scars in that head of his. He's immensely mentally strong. But he's no Nadal when it comes to the mind. You can't say Fed is mentally weak. But you can say he's faltered mentally a number of times. Or maybe you can't. Maybe he just got out played. I don't think I'll ever really make up my mind on any of these things.

 

[Riotbeard]

The real disaster was not 2008 Wimbledon (where Nadal played very well) but the 2009 Australian Open. That match opened the floodgates as far as the Nadal menace went and Federer coughed it up - and then cried it out.

2008 Wimbledon was a disaster. Roger didn't show up for 2 sets and then played OK the last few sets. 1-12 BP's, blowing a 4-1 lead in the 2nd, hideous misses in the 5th, etc.

That opened the floodgates that allowed for AO 2009. I remember being the only one who knew that Roger would implode in the 5th set of that AO final and the only reason for that was the thought of 2008 on his mind.

Not to mention he'd be considered the best on grass and would have won 7 straight Wimbledons. An awful loss for sure.

I don't completely disagree about the Wimbledon final. The breakpoint conversion issue was a huge one. I just think that Nadal played much better in that match than the 2009 Australian Open final. Unlike at Wimbledon 2008, Nadal had never even reached a Melbourne final before 2009 and he only barely squeaked into the final after the marathon with Verdasco. Federer's self-destruction in that match was on par with LeBron in the 2011 Finals, except quite possibly worse in the 5th set. Nadal basically just stood there watching his opponent crumble and fade away.

WHY ARE WE BRINGING UP BAD MEMORIES UGHHH

why is it turning into a federer thread first?

Haha, oh that imperialist swiss.

 

[Kieran]

Congrats Rafa on his 9th RG title. He didn't need to do much, Novak messed up big time.

Terrible performance really. Everything went AWOL in the second set. Backhand especially.

I don't want to rub it in, but maybe someone like Nadal deserves more respect than to hope for him in the final because "it would narrow the gap in the head-to-head" or suggest that he might tank to avoid Djokovic.

Oh you're rubbing it in allright. As you should. I was beating on the wardrums, but Novak was beaten on court today unfortunately.

It could also be easy rubbed in on the Rafa fans who kept insisting he wouldn't win the FO. I'm looking at you, Tented, you went galloping for the hills even in pm's when I told you after the Ferrer match, Nadal will drop one more set - max - in this tourney. You insisted he would lose.

Who paid you off, brother, that's all I want to know, and how much did they pay you? :snigger

You too, Broken, you lost faith in your boy. I don't wanna sound like I'm banging my own drum, but this match had Rafa in four written all over since Wednesday, but very few of us backed him. He didn't play great today but he was still too strong.

I feel very bad for Nole, because of all Rafa's rivals, I like him most. He was very emotional at the end, and clearly he was affected by some issues during the match, and I think he should look into what that is, because it affected him against Gulbis too. It could be stress, which affects all players. They do remarkable things to keep coming back and trying to rise to the top.

I have a feeling this could be a hard final for both men to recover from. Rafa looked gassed at the death, and he did exceptionally well to hold at 4-4 in the fourth, then break from 30-0 behind. I think if it went to a fifth, he might have lost it. His back also seems to be a serious issue, one which won't help him at Wimbledon, to put it lightly.

I also feel for Nole's fans. I never congratulate fans because all we do is sit on our ar$e and watch Telly, but I know how the Nole fans feel, we've all been there and it's not nice. Especially when you follow a guy who is good enough to win the FO - if Rafa didn't show up. Maybe that'll happen, folks, Nole still has time.

As for Rafa? 5 in a row, 9 in total, a record in consistency by winning for ten seasons in a row, and 14 in total, which is incredible, given how injuries have impacted him, and after what happened in Oz, and given how poorly he looked most of the year.

But the emotions got to him too. I doubt he'll play Halle. I hope he's ready for Wimbledon, but if not, this season has already been a success by winning in Paris... :clap

 

[Fiero425]

I would agree with you, if it were not for the Monte Carlo final. Fed's showing in that match against Wawrinka was one of the most disappointing I have seen from him in his career.

He's played a lot worse than that match this year. He just lost to Bert & Ernie show 8 days ago as an example.

Yeah, but the Monte Carlo final was a chance to get a big title against someone that he has dominated in his career - AFTER already beating his toughest possible opponent in Djokovic.

That loss to Wawrinka just confirmed once and for all that he is no longer in the same competitive frame of mind that he once was. A truly focused and fully motivated Federer wins that in straight sets.

Can't say I disagree. Monte Carlo isn't a GS but still would be a big time win at a tournament he hadn't won. Wasn't a good effort for sure but as mentioned before we've seen wayy worse the last 2 years. He lost to Kei in Miami, Hewitt in Brisbane, Gulbis at RG, Robredo at USO, etc.

That is why I'll never rate Nadal "the GOAT!" He's vulnerable everywhere else! He throws everything into winning this major and is upset again and again at others! Hard to call anyone the greatest of all time when they've taken off so many times in their young careers; same for Serena! Players like Martina and Federer; GOAT's respectively on their tours, never took such hiatuses and I find it ridiculous that so called experts seem to ignore that history!

 

[Front242]

Novak had no business winning points 'cos he either hit them into the net or miles wide.

 

[brokenshoelace]

Oh I believe others have the ability to beat Rafa in Paris

I respectfully disagree.

 

[Front242]

Oh I believe others have the ability to beat Rafa in Paris

I respectfully disagree.

Well, Djokovic has the ability but he's so far never produced it except in the mickey mouse clay events prior to RG. I think a number of players out there if given the chance would've done better today.

 

[rafanoy1992]

Congrats Rafa on his 9th RG title. He didn't need to do much, Novak messed up big time.

Terrible performance really. Everything went AWOL in the second set. Backhand especially.

I don't want to rub it in, but maybe someone like Nadal deserves more respect than to hope for him in the final because "it would narrow the gap in the head-to-head" or suggest that he might tank to avoid Djokovic.

Oh you're rubbing it in allright. As you should. I was beating on the wardrums, but Novak was beaten on court today unfortunately.

It could also be easy rubbed in on the Rafa fans who kept insisting he wouldn't win the FO. I'm looking at you, Tented, you went galloping for the hills even in pm's when I told you after the Ferrer match, Nadal will drop one more set - max - in this tourney. You insisted he would lose.

Who paid you off, brother, that's all I want to know, and how much did they pay you? :snigger

You too, Broken, you lost faith in your boy. I don't wanna sound like I'm banging my own drum, but this match had Rafa in four written all over since Wednesday, but very few of us backed him. He didn't play great today but he was still too strong.

I feel very bad for Nole, because of all Rafa's rivals, I like him most. He was very emotional at the end, and clearly he was affected by some issues during the match, and I think he should look into what that is, because it affected him against Gulbis too. It could be stress, which affects all players. They do remarkable things to keep coming back and trying to rise to the top.

I have a feeling this could be a hard final for both men to recover from. Rafa looked gassed at the death, and he did exceptionally well to hold at 4-4 in the fourth, then break from 30-0 behind. I think if it went to a fifth, he might have lost it. His back also seems to be a serious issue, one which won't help him at Wimbledon, to put it lightly.

I also feel for Nole's fans. I never congratulate fans because all we do is sit on our ar$e and watch Telly, but I know how the Nole fans feel, we've all been there and it's not nice. Especially when you follow a guy who is good enough to win the FO - if Rafa didn't show up. Maybe that'll happen, folks, Nole still has time.

As for Rafa? 5 in a row, 9 in total, a record in consistency by winning for ten seasons in a row, and 14 in total, which is incredible, given how injuries have impacted him, and after what happened in Oz, and given how poorly he looked most of the year.

But the emotions got to him too. I doubt he'll play Halle. I hope he's ready for Wimbledon, but if not, this season has already been a success by winning in Paris... :clap

Very well said, Kieran :clap

I think he will skip Halle too. He started to cramp after the trophy presentation. Also, I agree I hope he can at least win his 1st round match this year

 

[Denis]

Oh I believe others have the ability to beat Rafa in Paris

I respectfully disagree.

Well, Djokovic has the ability but he's so far never produced it except in the mickey mouse clay events prior to RG. I think a number of players out there if given the chance would've done better today.

Rome, Monaco and Madrid mickey mouse clay events? :laydownlaughing

 

[brokenshoelace]

You too, Broken, you lost faith in your boy. I don't wanna sound like I'm banging my own drum, but this match had Rafa in four written all over since Wednesday, but very few of us backed him. He didn't play great today but he was still too strong.

I never ever lost faith. For a while, I just didn't think he'd win it (there's a difference), until the second week of the FO. My fears weren't exactly unjustified though, because Nadal wasn't playing well. Nevertheless, I maintained, way before the tournament that Nadal will be playing Djokovic in the final, and said that "I'm slightly leaning towards Djokovic, but I might change my mind as the tournament progresses" (that post was in reply to GSM's awful predictions. Where is he btw?). That's not exactly losing faith one bit. I even laughed off the manner in which Nadal was getting shrugged off in most people's predictions. Give me more credit than that, buddy.

 

[Kieran]

I like him at Wimbo if he can get through the first rounds - and if his back is fine. He can't stoop for low balls on grass with a severe backache. it's an issue, but one he overcame here. But at what cost? I never seen Rafa so affected by a victory before...

 

[DarthFed]

Nole isn't beating Rafa at RG, he has only been competitive once in 6 matches and his career has been in the tubes since RG 2013.

 

[brokenshoelace]

Oh I believe others have the ability to beat Rafa in Paris

I respectfully disagree.

Well, Djokovic has the ability but he's so far never produced it except in the mickey mouse clay events prior to RG. I think a number of players out there if given the chance would've done better today.

By "others" he meant "others besides Djokovic" in response to my post saying only Novak can beat Nadal. Obviously Novak has the ability to beat Nadal in Paris. I just don't think anyone else does.

 

[tenisplayrla08]

I would agree with you, if it were not for the Monte Carlo final. Fed's showing in that match against Wawrinka was one of the most disappointing I have seen from him in his career.

He's played a lot worse than that match this year. He just lost to Bert & Ernie show 8 days ago as an example.

Yeah, but the Monte Carlo final was a chance to get a big title against someone that he has dominated in his career - AFTER already beating his toughest possible opponent in Djokovic.

That loss to Wawrinka just confirmed once and for all that he is no longer in the same competitive frame of mind that he once was. A truly focused and fully motivated Federer wins that in straight sets.

Can't say I disagree. Monte Carlo isn't a GS but still would be a big time win at a tournament he hadn't won. Wasn't a good effort for sure but as mentioned before we've seen wayy worse the last 2 years. He lost to Kei in Miami, Hewitt in Brisbane, Gulbis at RG, Robredo at USO, etc.

Robredo at the US Open shocked me. Hewitt in Brisbane was surprising. Kei in Miami was surprising, but Kei has shown since then that it wasn't Fed. It was Kei. Kei is really really good. He's finally found whatever he needed to find to be able to play and beat the top guys. Gulbis has always been supremely talented, just a head case. But after he won Nice and I saw him in Fed's quarter, I said to myself, if Gulbis makes it to Fed, he can beat him. Now I might have only thought that because I've seen Fed lose some matches he shouldn't have in the last 2 or 3 years. But it was at least partly because Gulbis is good. Fed still isn't losing to crappy players. Robredo was top 10 for years. BUT I'll admit that was still a stretch. Stakhovsky at Wimbledon last year is probably his worst loss to me though. Stakhovsky has been top 40 before, though he wasn't when he beat Fed last year. But even just a top 40 guy is a bad loss.

So... with those in mind... I was say that Fed got out played in the Monte Carlo match. Stan believes in himself now. So, he takes more risk with his backhand. And when you put his backhand up against Fed's, it's gonna win. And he found a way to exploit that, and to keep Fed from beating him with his forehand. Found a way to keep it on Fed's backhand. Wawrinka has always been very talented. When he showed up in 2008, I thought he'd achieve quite a lot because of his shots. Over the years it became clear that he wasn't strong enough mentally. He didn't believe in himself or whatever. After that match with Djokovic last year in the AO, he started believing. And while perhaps not the third best player in the world, he's much better now. A completely different player than the guy Fed beat every time before. A guy with the shots he always had, that were always good enough to beat the top players with, but now also believing he can win. I don't think Fed lost that match because of a lack of motivation or whatever.

 

[Front242]

Oh I believe others have the ability to beat Rafa in Paris

I respectfully disagree.

Well, Djokovic has the ability but he's so far never produced it except in the mickey mouse clay events prior to RG. I think a number of players out there if given the chance would've done better today.

Rome, Monaco and Madrid mickey mouse clay events? :laydownlaughing

Yeah of course in the grand scheme of things. You don't think he'd trade all those wins for a RG title?

 

[crystalfire]

I would agree with you, if it were not for the Monte Carlo final. Fed's showing in that match against Wawrinka was one of the most disappointing I have seen from him in his career.

He's played a lot worse than that match this year. He just lost to Bert & Ernie show 8 days ago as an example.

Yeah, but the Monte Carlo final was a chance to get a big title against someone that he has dominated in his career - AFTER already beating his toughest possible opponent in Djokovic.

That loss to Wawrinka just confirmed once and for all that he is no longer in the same competitive frame of mind that he once was. A truly focused and fully motivated Federer wins that in straight sets.

Can't say I disagree. Monte Carlo isn't a GS but still would be a big time win at a tournament he hadn't won. Wasn't a good effort for sure but as mentioned before we've seen wayy worse the last 2 years. He lost to Kei in Miami, Hewitt in Brisbane, Gulbis at RG, Robredo at USO, etc.

That is why I'll never rate Nadal "the GOAT!" He's vulnerable everywhere else! He throws everything into winning this major and is upset again and again at others! Hard to call anyone the greatest of all time when they've taken off so many times in their young careers; same for Serena! Players like Martina and Federer; GOAT's respectively on their tours, never took such hiatuses and I find it ridiculous that so called experts seem to ignore that history!

Hands down the KING GOAT OF CLAY. no question about it. Idk whether he is a true goat yet but he probably will be. I'll wait till he hangs up his racquet to decide

 

[brokenshoelace]

I like him at Wimbo if he can get through the first rounds - and if his back is fine. He can't stoop for low balls on grass with a severe backache. it's an issue, but one he overcame here. But at what cost? I never seen Rafa so affected by a victory before...

I really hope Nadal DOES NOT skip Halle. He paid the price big time last year. Nadal essentially hasn't played significant periods of grass court tennis since 2011. That's a long time. He needs to get his feet wet.

Obviously if the back is an issue then that makes things more complicated.