US Politics Thread

[Federberg]

ok so I was just listening to someone ranting about this Save Act and what it's trying to do about voting. It's much much more than voter ID, which I was trying to say is reasonable. The rest of the stuff is a blatant attempt at election tampering

 

[Murat B.]

ok so I was just listening to someone ranting about this Save Act and what it's trying to do about voting. It's much much more than voter ID, which I was trying to say is reasonable. The rest of the stuff is a blatant attempt at election tampering

Nah, not true. It is asking people to take a bit of action to keep their democracy safe, like almost all civilized democratic countries. It takes a bit of effort. If a 70 year old woman in eastern Turkey in winter can show up with an id and line up at -30 Celcius in the dead of morning , a fucking US citizen can do it too.
Election tempering is letting millions of people illegally, no questions asked in a country, making them comfortable and making sure they vote "correctly" when the time comes. It is a long game.

 

[Moxie]

Nah, not true. It is asking people to take a bit of action to keep their democracy safe, like almost all civilized democratic countries. It takes a bit of effort. If a 70 year old woman in eastern Turkey in winter can show up with an id and line up at -30 Celcius in the dead of morning , a fucking US citizen can do it too.
Election tempering is letting millions of people illegally, no questions asked in a country, making them comfortable and making sure they vote "correctly" when the time comes. It is a long game.

No, he's right. The proposed forms of ID are expensive, and can be hard to obtain. It's not just some old lady in Turkey with her state-issued ID. For example, many of the forms require an original birth certificate. Which I do not have. I have a passport, so I'm good. But i have tried to get a copy of my birth certificate, and I'm going to have to go to DC for it. That would suppress my vote.

 

[Murat B.]

No, he's right. The proposed forms of ID are expensive, and can be hard to obtain. It's not just some old lady in Turkey with her state-issued ID. For example, many of the forms require an original birth certificate. Which I do not have. I have a passport, so I'm good. But i have tried to get a copy of my birth certificate, and I'm going to have to go to DC for it. That would suppress my vote.

We talked about this for so long, American people overwhelmingly agree with me. You are the richest, most powerful country on earth. You know how lefties like to talk about the top %1 and all that? If you are making over $30.000 , you are in the top %1 in the world ! Get it done ! Simple. In what parallel universe it is even a discussion that only the citizens of a country should be able to vote and that they should prove it??? How and when did we get to this point? Find a way to get it done. And I am done on this subject

 

[Federberg]

‎Gemini - direct access to Google AI

Created with Gemini

g.co

 

[Federberg]

^ hope that query to Gemini helps. It's more than just requiring voter ID. Personally I'm in favour of voter ID, we take it fore granted here in the UK. If you're restricted in the form of ID you can show then that becomes discriminatory. Some of those are very difficult to get. You need to ask yourself why certain types of ID aren't allowed. Who are they really trying to stop from voting. Quite apart from the rather obvious point that the last thing illegal immigrants want to do is put themselves in a situation where they could get deported. If anyone really thinks illegal immigrants are lining up to vote, I've got a bridge to nowhere to sell

 

[Murat B.]

‎Gemini - direct access to Google AI

Created with Gemini

g.co

Just saying...from Gemini "herself".

• Gemini (Google): Studies have found that Gemini exhibits a more pronounced left-wing/liberal tendency compared to other LLMs, frequently aligning with left-of-center perspectives.

 

[Federberg]

Just saying...from Gemini "herself".

• Gemini (Google): Studies have found that Gemini exhibits a more pronounced left-wing/liberal tendency compared to other LLMs, frequently aligning with left-of-center perspectives.

that's interesting. Which AI agents are considered more neutral? I don't want bias in my search for knowledge

 

[Murat B.]

that's interesting. Which AI agents are considered more neutral? I don't want bias in my search for knowledge

There is none !. Elon created (or help create) Grok to be more politically incorrect but now it leans right. AI s are products of their creators. Their biases are inherent in the final product. So screw all of them.
I guess this is another debate which I would prefer more than the election ID debate honestly.

 

[Federberg]

There is none !. Elon created (or help create) Grok to be more politically incorrect but now it leans right. AI s are products of their creators. Their biases are inherent in the final product. So screw all of them.
I guess this is another debate which I would prefer more than the election ID debate honestly.

lol! Fair enough

Here’s grok

 

[Federberg]

lol! Fair enough

Here’s grok

this is why I said it's not the same as me going to a voting booth in the Uk with my ID. Typically that's my driving licence. That, it seems, would not be sufficient with this legislation.

 

[britbox]

The solution will ultimately be Digital Id... But first the drama needs to play out.

 

[Moxie]

this is why I said it's not the same as me going to a voting booth in the Uk with my ID. Typically that's my driving licence. That, it seems, would not be sufficient with this legislation.

Driving license at the polls, but what do you have to show to register? You don't have to be a citizen to drive. That just proves you're you. Same is in the US, I think. It's what you'd need to re-register at all, and I think they'd have many of us here in the US re-register, with this new law. That alone will disenfranchise a lot of people who won't realize they need to register all over again. You are right, though, it's just another tactic to suppress the vote. It's isn't however, the same as election tampering, I wouldn't say.

 

[Kieran]

Driving license at the polls, but what do you have to show to register? You don't have to be a citizen to drive. That just proves you're you. Same is in the US, I think. It's what you'd need to re-register at all, and I think they'd have many of us here in the US re-register, with this new law. That alone will disenfranchise a lot of people who won't realize they need to register all over again. You are right, though, it's just another tactic to suppress the vote. It's isn't however, the same as election tampering, I wouldn't say.

In Ireland it’s the same, you bring your voting card which you received in the post, and your driving license. It’s very simple. The driving licence has your photo on it.

Then you vote…

 

[Federberg]

Driving license at the polls, but what do you have to show to register? You don't have to be a citizen to drive. That just proves you're you. Same is in the US, I think. It's what you'd need to re-register at all, and I think they'd have many of us here in the US re-register, with this new law. That alone will disenfranchise a lot of people who won't realize they need to register all over again. You are right, though, it's just another tactic to suppress the vote. It's isn't however, the same as election tampering, I wouldn't say.

they get your information earlier. We have to pay Council Tax which is a sort of property tax. The local council has our information. From that they send a letter asking us to confirm that we live in the borough and are eligible to vote. All of this is on record. There are consequences for lying if you aren't eligible to vote. All of that is settled way before election day. So on the day you just roll up to your voting centre. Show your ID, they find you on the list and then you vote

 

[Moxie]

they get your information earlier. We have to pay Council Tax which is a sort of property tax. The local council has our information. From that they send a letter asking us to confirm that we live in the borough and are eligible to vote. All of this is on record. There are consequences for lying if you aren't eligible to vote. All of that is settled way before election day. So on the day you just roll up to your voting centre. Show your ID, they find you on the list and then you vote

So, basically, they enroll you. In ours, you have to be very proactive. There are independent campaigns to sign people up, and some states offer it to when you get your drivers license, to make it easier. And I have mentioned that there are stiff fines and prison terms for lying about your eligibility here, as well. Which actually is pretty preventative of having people vote illegally. But it does vary state by state as to what ID you have to show a) to register and b) to vote, if at all. But that's not really the important part...the ID when you vote. It's not easy to vote in someone else's place, as I imagine it's not in the UK. It's also not cost-effective as a way to rig an election. However, the more roadblocks you put up to registering people to vote the more you do actively suppress the vote and disenfranchise people.

 

[Moxie]

In Ireland it’s the same, you bring your voting card which you received in the post, and your driving license. It’s very simple. The driving licence has your photo on it.

Then you vote…

Right, but do they register you, or do you request to be registered? We have to actively register. That's the hard part, really. Even though people here forget that, too. The part where you really have to be a citizen. At the polls, you're just proving that you are you, which I do by signing, in my state.

 

[Kieran]

Right, but do they register you, or do you request to be registered? We have to actively register. That's the hard part, really. Even though people here forget that, too. The part where you really have to be a citizen. At the polls, you're just proving that you are you, which I do by signing, in my state.

Yeah we do, actually, been so long since I registered. But, I can’t help but feel that in America even this act of registering is politicised along partisan lines. Looking at the USA.gov website, it’s easy peasy…

 

[Front242]

Wtaf ?!

 

[Murat B.]

Wtaf ?!

Ok, that was funny. And only this guy could come up with something like that and actually say it out loud.
You know how older people do not care after a certain age where and how loud they fart? That's how Trump talks.
I like it .