When has Federer ever hit only 6 winners in a final on any surface?

[calitennis127]

Anyone care to let me know? This has happened quite a bit to Nadal. I think that in the final of the 2013 WTF championships Nadal actually had 4 winners for the match (but I stand corrected - it may have been as high as 7 or 8).

 

 

[britbox]

Think it was 7.

 

[calitennis127]

 

My apologies. Lol.

 

[Billie]

Well Federer probably has that many aces in a match, normally, and they count them as winners.  I bet Federer hit more UFEs than Nadal in some of the finals?

 

[Federberg]

I'm not sure how much stock one should place on the winners stats, but your point is well taken. In any case there's many a way to skin a cat, I'm obviously no fan of Rafa's style but having more winners clearly doesn't mean you win the match. It would be fairly boring if everyone played exactly the same way. Whatever works I say!

 

[brokenshoelace]

Clearly Roger is a superior offensive player. There are a lot of factors involved though, such as his far superior serve, which gives him more aces and more easy put aways. His serve alone is good for 15 winners in a two set match, between aces and 1-2 punches. Not that his forehand isn't offensively superior, because it is, but your take on winners count has always been somewhat narrow-minded.

It's not a coincidence Nadal's winner count catapults significantly when he's serving well (see 2010 and 2013, when he "out-winnered" pretty much everyone). Conversely, when Rafa's serving like a WTA player, he won't produce much winners. It's obviously not the only reason but it's a huge factor. Look at how many floaty weak returns Rafa produces, and how many easy put aways it gives his opponents. That's obviously a knock against him since his return is iffy, but it also adds to discrepancy in winners count.

 

[calitennis127]

Clearly Roger is a superior offensive player. There are a lot of factors involved though, such as his far superior serve, which gives him more aces and more easy put aways. His serve alone is good for 15 winners in a two set match, between aces and 1-2 punches. Not that his forehand isn’t offensively superior, because it is, but your take on winners count has always been somewhat narrow-minded. It’s not a coincidence Nadal’s winner count catapults significantly when he’s serving well (see 2010 and 2013, when he “out-winnered” pretty much everyone). Conversely, when Rafa’s serving like a WTA player, he won’t produce much winners. It’s obviously not the only reason but it’s a huge factor. Look at how many floaty weak returns Rafa produces, and how many easy put aways it gives his opponents. That’s obviously a knock against him since his return is iffy, but it also adds to discrepancy in winners count.

I don't disagree, but I do think that all things being equal, Federer still does more damage on average with his forehand. There have been a slew of big matches for Nadal where he really smacked the hell out of the ball and put all his might into dictating the match with his forehand but still came up short. The match in Shanghai against Del Potro in 2013 was a great example of that.

Although, I must say that Nadal has looked very good against Karlovic and Raonic this week. Obviously neither of them is exactly a superlative rally player, but Nadal is pretty much not missing any passing shots and he is really lining up his forehands with some gusto.