Red clay seems as slippery as blue

[Riotbeard]

As I rewatch the djokovic/dimitrov match, and seeing these guys slip, slide, and fall all over the place, I am beginning to think even more that blue clay was not the reason (or at least the main reason) for why madrid courts stink. It seems like there impermanent status is the more likely cause. Any thoughts?

 

[ftan]

Well they really put down clay few days before the tournament. For it not to slip it needs to set and that can only come with permanent clay courts

 

[Riotbeard]

But isn't this the point, that really blue clay was not the problem in spite of my guy's and rafa's whining?

 

[Billie]

But isn't this the point, that really blue clay was not the problem in spite of my guy's and rafa's whining?

Maybe it was a bit more slippery when it was blue, maybe it was just the perception. But it does not play as a true clay, probably because of the courts and how the clay is set. The condition of the courts can differ from year to year quite a lot, I was told.

 

[brokenshoelace]

Nadal has complained about the Madrid clay since 2009 by the way, when it was red. I remember he wanted to skip it that year, and made a late choice to participate amidst some pressure due to it being a home tournament. So yeah, the clay courts there have been criticized before the blue clay fiasco.

 

[Johnsteinbeck]

hate to s.... no wait, i Love to say i told you so! so glad that Novak (and Rafa) put enough pressure on Tiriac to go back to clay. i'm sure when Nole sits at home in MC and watches the rest of the tournament on the familiar red, it'll be much less irritating for him than it was last year /schadenfreude

nah, more seriously now: while i do think they overreacted last year (Serena put it nicely), i still understand that it was Ion's fault in the first place, the way he went about making the change. but as Broken pointed out, the color wasn't really the problem. and tbh, i don't see a 'problem' at all. so the clay plays different than MC or Rome. is it therefore not "true clay"? tell me then - is Philippe Chartrier true clay, or is Suzanne Lenglen? it's just different clay - it's a natural surface, so it really should have some local differences. for what it's worth, the variations of hardcourts are offering almost more differences in play than the natural surfaces.

 

[tennisville]

Well they really put down clay few days before the tournament. For it not to slip it needs to set and that can only come with permanent clay courts

Exactly. And laying the clay over concrete doesn't help.

That was 2009 . They changed it this year . Its a proper court now and maybe even better than the ones at RG .I thought the clay player quite well here :angel:

Nadal himself said this is the best clay court out there

 

[Kieran]

The way they lay this court isn't conducive to making a good clay court, let alone one suitable for an MS tourney before Paris. If Madrid is still playing like anomalous fast clay, it'll become the Paris Indoors of the summer season - a disposable even for players who'll arrange themselves around it...

 

[Riotbeard]

This is why I say go back to blue. The court doesn't play well anyway. They might as well be cool and interesting looking. I don't have a problem with the court playing fast (I like fast courts), it's more that it is pretty clearly one of the hardest courts to move effectively on. Dimitrov fell a good 5 or 6 times yesturday.

 

[Murat Baslamisli]

hate to s.... no wait, i Love to say i told you so! so glad that Novak (and Rafa) put enough pressure on Tiriac to go back to clay. i'm sure when Nole sits at home in MC and watches the rest of the tournament on the familiar red, it'll be much less irritating for him than it was last year /schadenfreude

nah, more seriously now: while i do think they overreacted last year (Serena put it nicely), i still understand that it was Ion's fault in the first place, the way he went about making the change. but as Broken pointed out, the color wasn't really the problem. and tbh, i don't see a 'problem' at all. so the clay plays different than MC or Rome. is it therefore not "true clay"? tell me then - is Philippe Chartrier true clay, or is Suzanne Lenglen? it's just different clay - it's a natural surface, so it really should have some local differences. for what it's worth, the variations of hardcourts are offering almost more differences in play than the natural surfaces.

Man, when I first read your post, I saw it as "it was Iona's fault" and tried to link her to the issue for minutes and could not...:s

 

[ftan]

hate to s.... no wait, i Love to say i told you so! so glad that Novak (and Rafa) put enough pressure on Tiriac to go back to clay. i'm sure when Nole sits at home in MC and watches the rest of the tournament on the familiar red, it'll be much less irritating for him than it was last year /schadenfreude

nah, more seriously now: while i do think they overreacted last year (Serena put it nicely), i still understand that it was Ion's fault in the first place, the way he went about making the change. but as Broken pointed out, the color wasn't really the problem. and tbh, i don't see a 'problem' at all. so the clay plays different than MC or Rome. is it therefore not "true clay"? tell me then - is Philippe Chartrier true clay, or is Suzanne Lenglen? it's just different clay - it's a natural surface, so it really should have some local differences. for what it's worth, the variations of hardcourts are offering almost more differences in play than the natural surfaces.

Man, when I first read your post, I saw it as "it was Iona's fault" and tried to link her to the issue for minutes and could not...:s

 

[SF Nadalite]

I think Dimitrov's falls were more about being caught off guard than the surface - he would lurk towards a serve and just stumble.

No one seems to mention this, but Novak's issues with his ankles are the same as Rafa's with his knees: while Rafa is picked on for being such a heavy runner/defender/abuser of his knees, Novak's hyper-extension-like stretching (gumby-like although i hate that term) around the court to defend is having the same effect on his ankles. Both ankles and knees are equally difficult to heal - and subject to repeat injuries once they start (even worse if you break an ankle).

I've only caught a few hours of Madrid - Rafa seemed to move fine today.